Honestly, they should give Aatrox rework to Certainly T

Hexs Fortune·Jan 3, 2018·36 votes·3,714 views

players have been suffering with a mediocre kit for so long, you know Certainly T would make him fun to play as

58 Comments

Tristanl0lJan 3, 201810 votes

Q has less wind-up, E back to magic damage, passive only requires 4 stacks.

done

KirotheImmortalJan 3, 20186 votes

[{quoted}](name=Xx69 weed 420xX,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RZ78dfPE,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-01-03T19:12:43.564+0000)

Q has less wind-up, E back to magic damage, passive only requires 4 stacks.

done

Pretty much. I actualy like how his passive is now but judt making it without thinking about how hard it is to get the bloodwell filled is whats killing him

Tristanl0lJan 3, 20189 votes

As someone that has this; https://i.imgur.com/HEZDglq.png , I think it's near impossible to get his passive up in a 1v1/gank without hitting R on at least 2 people and having Blood Price ready. As an example Jax needs to auto minions twice before jumping on someone and hitting them with a WR passive hit, while Aatrox needs to auto EIGHT times to even have a chance at having his passive ready assuming after the 8th auto on minions you EQ and either use R(not possible pre6 laning haha!!), or hit them with blood price.

Which is why I stick to playing him in the jungle

Z3SleeperJan 4, 20181 votes

Pretty much. It's bad how hard it is to proc passive without ult.

AirKingNeoJan 4, 20182 votes

Ultimate makes him immune to heal reduction for the duration.

Passive resets duration on turrets.

Now he's fixed with your ideas. (Though E being physical damage would be fine if it got 0/5/10/15/20 more base damage or so).

Poolparty SauronJan 4, 20181 votes

And you solved what? He still has a kit so simple its insulting, is still made worthless by a single item, is still invalidated by any form of cc and his kit has little thematic cohesion. Sometimes fixing a champion isnt about numbers or stacks sometimes you need to remake them from the ground up.

LowvyrJan 4, 20189 votes

I once made a post on reddit titled "Aatrox Main, AMA". The only question I got was "why"

KVbqbFsC8eJan 3, 20187 votes

In that case, he'd be constantly banned and you'd never get to actually play him.

Troll for TrumpJan 3, 20185 votes

You guys want the Kalista/Azir Treatment?

KirotheImmortalJan 4, 20181 votes

{quoted}

You guys want the Kalista/Azir Treatment?

For aatrox even if they make him more viable there will be other. champs that can do him better. Kalista and Azir are extremely unique. Azir has probably the best zoning kit and Kalista's E is what breaks her. Its so strong and with how her passive is its probably the only true reliable damage she does.

Troll for TrumpJan 4, 20181 votes

He's getting a GU, meaning they can almost do anything they want to do with the kit. What CT will likely do is introduce some crazy, never-before-seen, unique mechanic that breaks him.

Void Baboon RFJan 3, 20185 votes

He'd probably just move his W too his Q passively and make his W a AoE 50% damage reduction shield that also stuns and then reddit can pretend like he's competent

Yaśuo MainJan 4, 20185 votes

why doesn't that logic apply to warwick then

SEKAIJan 4, 201820 votes

[{quoted}](name=Yaśuo Main,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RZ78dfPE,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2018-01-04T00:47:41.324+0000)

why doesn't that logic apply to warwick then

Because he was under heavy supervision during his WW rework, so much so it made him hate the WW rework and rework as a whole, and the result is that WW was barely touched beyond modernising the kit mechanics. But as it turns out, you need this amount of babysitting and restriction so that CT can actually make a balanced design.

The moment when a designer can only be defended on a design they almost didn't actually do (given that's what all of the defenders use when they can no longer bull their way out with things like "fun" or whatnot), speaks volumes about the designer's own design competence. But hey.

WimbledofyJan 4, 20185 votes

People keep saying he hates his warwick update but where did he say this? I just want to know, I'm not doutbing he said something like this.

EinarUlfarJan 4, 20184 votes

Not sure where, but he stated he couldn't be as flexible as he had wanted during the WW rework. They wanted to ensure that WW's identity was retained and that he was still a Jungler newer players could comfortably pick up. CT stated this was something he didn't enjoy; although I'd argue it's easily his best work.

AhristocatsJan 4, 20185 votes

because they cannot stand the fact that certainlyt was able to do a good rework, so they have to create rumors about that

certainlyt was not under any suppression or restrictment, but he was forced to keep warwick extremely easy to play instead of making him mechanically complex, and this is what he said when he reworked him

also, he never said that he hated the rework

Spank the FoxJan 4, 20183 votes

It firts Board’s narrative though so shut up :^)

“i don’t need sources, u find it” - Sekai, basically.

TeCoolMageJan 4, 20182 votes

Guys calm down before the boards thought police downvotes us all to hell

nice tableJan 4, 20182 votes

well he did say he didn't enjoy the rework as it limited his creativity

MetalGearTeemoJan 4, 20181 votes

CertainlyT has done arguably more damage to this games design and balancing then Flash.

Sorry folks. Playing overloaded overpowered things tends to be awfully fun when your opponents have limited toolsets.

So I'm not surprised people find CT's characters enjoyable, but that doesn't make them good for the game.

AhristocatsJan 5, 20182 votes

{quoted}

CertainlyT has done arguably more damage to this games design and balancing then Flash.

Lol nice meme

you know who else created mroe damage than certainlyt?

Xypherous, designing orianna lulu fizz heimer renekton riven Designing season 3 items that were a disaster and everyone ended up abusing jungle items designing blade of the ruined king that was NEVER balanced (either weak or overpowered), it got reworked like 5 times since its release designing protobelt and will of the ancient that got removed designing force of nature that got removed

this guy gave us i don't know how much imbalanced items that ruined seasons for years (DFT rework was him, protobelt was him+Rylai buff that made it broken) but for some reasons people never remember him

certainlyt designing 4 champions that people hate? let's forget xypherous fearless and repertoir :^)

OleandervineJan 4, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RZ78dfPE,comment-id=00040000000000000001,timestamp=2018-01-04T10:06:08.356+0000)

because they cannot stand the fact that certainlyt was able to do a good rework, so they have to create rumors about that

certainlyt was not under any suppression or restrictment, but he was forced to keep warwick extremely easy to play instead of making him mechanically complex, and this is what he said when he reworked him

also, he never said that he hated the rework

I've highlighted the contradiction in your statement. Being forced to keep Warwick extremely easy and mechanically simple is a pretty heavy restriction on how he was able to design Warwick. Furthermore, his intense design ideas were suppressed for this reason as well, because he couldn't go crazy like he does with his brand new champions he creates.

Furthermore, the source for CertainlyT saying he wasn't particularly thrilled about being under so many limitations for Warwick's rework was a Twitch video from last January of an interview where he discussed the Warwick rework process and such. I'll have to dig around for it, but it does exist.

AhristocatsJan 4, 20181 votes

No it isn't a restriction, it is an instruction

as for myself i worded it poorly, i shouldn't have said "was forced too" because it would have meant that certainlyt wanted to do something else he was compelled to which means that he had the instruction of making warwick easy and he agreed with that and just did his job without being forced

OleandervineJan 5, 20181 votes

I can instruct you to "go pick up that ball." In that sense, it's a command with no solid directives on how to do it.

I can also instruct you "paint this wall black." This is also a command, however, this is a command with solid limitations. If you paint the wall pink and green, you are disobeying my instructions. You are limited and restricted by my instructions in this matter.

CertainlyT, and any designer, falls into the second category. They get directives from a supervisor telling them how to do something and they are given boundaries to work in. They are given restrictions within the instructions, and they are forced to do it, no matter if you call it compelled or otherwise, because it is their job. If they don't do their job as they are directed to do by their supervisor, they will be punished. This is how management and businesses operate. You may be "compelled" but being "compelled" implies that you are doing this without consequences if you don't go through with the task. Working on a project your manager tells you to do is not "compelling." It's a command from a person who employs you and expects you to do what you are told.

AhristocatsJan 5, 20181 votes

who do you think told certainlyt to keep warwick easy?

that's right, it's certainlyt HIMSELF

tha'ts the difference between an instruction and a restriction, being forced or being compelled

certainlyt put himself the goal of keeping warwick easy, because it wouldn't have made sense to make him mechanically complesxe, he said himself "it's the first time that a vgu goal is to keep a champion for new players"

read his warwick reveal, WHO do you think was leading the vgu? it was certainlyt himself, he decided the goals he decided everything, but compelled himself to keep warwick easy

jesus those people

OleandervineJan 5, 20181 votes

It's a little presumptuous to assume that out of the goodness of his heart that he decided to make Warwick easy. That's entirely untrue.

It would be a VERY hard case to argue that someone above him, say the general production manager like Meddler or Ghostcrawler, didn't hand that directive down to him when he was assigned the team. This is Warwick, a champion slated as an entry level jungler for new players. He didn't _just _ decide to make him easy and stick within certain parameters. He had to because of the nature of Warwick and what the production team prioritizes as entry level versus high skill champions. If he was reworking someone like LeBlanc, who is a high skill champion, he wouldn't just on a whim decide to make her simple, nor would he have had been told to keep her within a tight set of boundaries as what happened with Warwick. Even though he lead the VGU team, he still has production managers above him who oversee the project and keep him on track and make sure that he's keeping within a certain set of boundaries. Meddler and Ghostcrawler are much higher up the chain than CertainlyT, and you better believe that they had task lists and objectives for him to follow and complete when he was given charge of the Warwick VGU. Believing CertainlyT had complete, unbridled control of that team is just naïve.

SighdogJan 4, 20183 votes

He has done fine and none of his champs are meta so stop crying and learn how to play against them.. its not hard

SweedishGunnerJan 4, 20188 votes

Are you just ignoring the high tier Zoe spam?

SighdogJan 4, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Are you just ignoring the high tier Zoe spam?

Zoes win rate is a 46%??? All the people who down voted me are just hard stuck low elo no brain people lol

The steam lifeJan 4, 20181 votes

He said he didn’t like working on it not that he didn’t like the result.

ArfBarkBoofJan 4, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=The steam life,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RZ78dfPE,comment-id=0004000000000002,timestamp=2018-01-04T19:41:02.613+0000)

He said he didn’t like working on it not that he didn’t like the result.

Well that's tough titties for him because he's proven that he can't make a balanced champion without heavy supervision. Yasuo is still the most polarizing champion to ever be released and people act like it's okay (Especially Yasuo mains) for him to have as much free stuff as he has.

The steam lifeJan 5, 20182 votes

It’s not the free stuff it’s the way it’s implemented. Tbh when I play against yas I don’t feel like it’s bs what his stats are and why his abilities are the way they are it’s just the way their implemented.

I genuinely believe the half the stuff about yas people complain about him are just cause he’s yasuo but when I play against him I do kinda hate the dashing the most.

I don’t think he’s overloaded or anything like that it’s just he’s annoying to play against. People act like the stuff he has doesn’t have a reason like the tower thing. If that wasn’t there he could literally never tower dive before 15 min which as a melee champ really sucks.

In regards to him not being able to make a balanced champion thresh is a pretty good example. He was strong on release but now he’s viable in every elo and not overbearing in a single one.

BarkleyJan 4, 20184 votes

Nah, certainlyT would give him some scary bullshit like "now his W automatically toggles at 50% health, and deals bonus true damage the more health you have, and gives additional bonus life steal the lower health you are."

"also, his jump range is now doubled, and resets on champion kill or assist."

People think CertainlyT does good reworks because of warwick, but if you look closely at the boards, you'll start to see some posts creeping out because people are starting to find out that his ult range extends based on his move speed. So people are starting to build max movespeed warwick and ult people from almost a lane away.

The cancer is there. It was just very well hidden.

Until now.

Don't let CertainlyT touch ANY champion ever again.

AetherArisingJan 4, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Nah, certainlyT would give him some scary bullshit like "now his W automatically toggles at 50% health, and deals bonus true damage the more health you have, and gives additional bonus life steal the lower health you are."

"also, his jump range is now doubled, and resets on champion kill or assist."

People think CertainlyT does good reworks because of warwick, but if you look closely at the boards, you'll start to see some posts creeping out because people are starting to find out that his ult range extends based on his move speed. So people are starting to build max movespeed warwick and ult people from almost a lane away.

The cancer is there. It was just very well hidden.

Until now.

Don't let CertainlyT touch ANY champion ever again.

Not to mention that WW is probably the only jungler who can take dragon at 2:50-ish with only the help of an ADC

BarkleyJan 4, 20182 votes

If you need the ADC's help you're doing something wrong.

AetherArisingJan 4, 20181 votes

{quoted}

If you need the ADC's help you're doing something wrong.

Note that i said "by 2:50", regardless of which dragon it is (some are stronger than others) Still, is it a healthy champ design to be able to take an objective that's designed to be snatched up in the end part of the early game, or early part of the mid game?

BarkleyJan 4, 20185 votes

I mean... Fiddlesticks Udyr XinZhao Aatrox can all solo drake pretty damn early in the game.

Idk about no 2:50, but 3:20-3:40 sure. Most of them only need double buffs and some free time.

ﬂooJan 4, 20185 votes

Shyvana can 1v1 drake at lvl 3 as long as she has smite up :)

KoutetsujôJan 4, 20184 votes

You mean giving Certtainly T rework to Aatrox ? Yeah so maybe the champs he makes will be less toxic

LuminierJan 4, 20183 votes

No. The dude who designed Camille (who is one of the most fun duelists in the game, imo) is working on him, and THAT'S what I'm excited about, as an Aatrox main. Keep the fun 1v1s alive.

ArfBarkBoofJan 5, 20181 votes

{quoted}

No. The dude who designed Camille (who is one of the most fun duelists in the game, imo) is working on him, and THAT'S what I'm excited about, as an Aatrox main. Keep the fun 1v1s alive.

Riot Jag is his name, and Camille is bar none one of the coolest champions from a dueling/isolated fight perspective so more power to him.

TheDeviceJan 5, 20181 votes

{quoted}

No. The dude who designed Camille (who is one of the most fun duelists in the game, imo) is working on him, and THAT'S what I'm excited about, as an Aatrox main. Keep the fun 1v1s alive.

ohrly!? I didn't know that. Cool! Well he's in good hands then.

FragglerocJan 4, 20182 votes

lolz thanks for making my day

Lord Phazanor Jan 4, 20181 votes

So you want Aatrox to be stupid op for a patch or two then nerfed to trash tier because his kit is unbalanceable?
Isn't that what you already have? :/

TeCoolMageJan 4, 20182 votes

But having the beginning part again, even if just for a fleeting moment, would be bliss for aatrox players.

AmazoXJan 4, 20181 votes

Make CertainlyT the designer of Aatrox's rework with the same close eyes kept on him when he was making the godly Warwick rework.

ssj8BrolykugetaJan 4, 20181 votes

He'll yea dude. I dont even want to be able to play the champ ive mained since forever

Elkington VIJan 5, 20181 votes

Screw that. I would rather not deal with an Aatrox with "hard to punish, but can easily punish you" mechanics. We need less champions with "oh shit" buttons, not more.