If every player on a team does not take runes in a game, the game becomes surprisingly balanced again. Damage falls hard, defense starts to matter really well, and strategy returns. Really, Runes Reforged is the thorn in the strategic aspect of this game. It makes or breaks metas as we have seen since the start of season 8. Get rid of it. Neat idea for a while, but it destroyed the health of this game.
ModWulf Helhammer4 votes(pssst, you know if you don't pick any runes, the game auto chooses one of the pre-made pages for you right?)
Cdore3 votes[{quoted}](name=Wilk Rycerz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RBArhaw7,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-10-04T15:09:16.082+0000)
(pssst, you know if you don't pick any runes, the game auto chooses one of the pre-made pages for you right?)
That says more than I ever could. The fact even Riot acknowledges how powerful runes are essentially speaks for itself.
ModWulf Helhammer2 votesYes...they are powerful..that was literally the entire point of them vs the old system. Yes, there's overall less actual choices, but each of your choices actually means something now, and isn't just tiny insignificant stats.
You aren't making any points here.
Cdore1 votes[{quoted}](name=Wilk Rycerz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RBArhaw7,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-04T15:36:47.653+0000)
Yes...they are powerful..that was literally the entire point of them vs the old system. Yes, there's overall less actual choices, but each of your choices actually means something now, and isn't just tiny insignificant stats.
You aren't making any points here.
My point is that runes make champs irrelevant. They literally make or break the game. The meta has swung drastically simply from how runes were adjusted. Dark Harvest alone is a good testament to the Runes reforged hell we've been through.
ModWulf Helhammer4 votesSo your point hinges on a new addition to the game (Dark Harvest), which while had some ups and downs at the start, is now reasonably balanced and a suitable option for multiple champions to augment their playstyle..and that's a bad thing?
In essence it boils down to "new=bad"?
Cdore1 votes[{quoted}](name=Wilk Rycerz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RBArhaw7,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-04T15:47:14.520+0000)
So your point hinges on a new addition to the game (Dark Harvest), which while had some ups and downs at the start, is now reasonably balanced and a suitable option for multiple champions to augment their playstyle..and that's a bad thing?
In essence it boils down to "new=bad"?
Can you explain this reasonable balanced part? Cause I'm wondering what you mean by that. Cause last I checked, we currently have several runes that are making specific champions top tier simply from them existing. Phase Rush Vlad, Conqueror (insert bruiser), Lethal Temple/ PTA adc, Comet/ Aert carry, aftershock (insert abuser of the month that is suprisingly not a tank) champ.
Kazekiba4 votesThe fact that youre listing so many examples is a testament to the fact that the runes system is working well. Aftershock mages like Syndra, Swain and Lissandra are viable? Kleptomancy works on a wide variety of champions (but only if youre hard smurfing; like a Korean challenger playing in EUW Master), ADCs aren't forced to run Warlord's bloodlust unless their name is Jhin, Rek'sai has multiple rune options and she's still bad no matter which one she picks, Kled is viable...
Remember the old system where literally every jungler, be it Volibear, pre-rework Rek'Sai, Sejuani, or Nidalee and they all took the tank Masteries so they could have Strength of the Ages because it was that overpowered? Or League of Thunderlords where even Soraka was taking Thunderlord's Decree and not just bursty assassins and no one ever took Stormraider's Surge for any reason
Perhaps you just miss the old runes that were uhh ... "+9 armor; literally every champion in the game takes these runes or you auto-lose. Also they cost as much IP as four champions. And you have to manually adjust your rune pages, for every champion you play. But you cant do that in champion select." Sounds like a great system why did they rework it? ... That's right, because the old rune system was designed around a game that you bought from a retailer for $25 and got half the characters (a whole 20, btw) for 'free' and then had to grind to get stats in order to be competitive. Rather than having access to 145 champions without paying a thing and having all of the stats you want/need at the drop of a hat, making the barrier for entry much smoother and easier to work with. Ever wonder why high level players/streamers have so many accounts compared to past years? Because they dont have to get 45,000 IP to spend on 6% armor penetration and 9% attack speed
Cdore1 votesThe fact that youre listing so many examples is a testament to the fact that the runes system is working well. Aftershock mages like Syndra, Swain and Lissandra are viable? Kleptomancy works on a wide variety of champions (but only if youre hard smurfing; like a Korean challenger playing in EUW Master), ADCs aren't forced to run Warlord's bloodlust unless their name is Jhin, Rek'sai has multiple rune options and she's still bad no matter which one she picks, Kled is viable...
Remember the old system where literally every jungler, be it Volibear, pre-rework Rek'Sai, Sejuani, or Nidalee and they all took the tank Masteries so they could have Strength of the Ages because it was that overpowered? Or League of Thunderlords where even Soraka was taking Thunderlord's Decree and not just bursty assassins and no one ever took Stormraider's Surge for any reason
Perhaps you just miss the old runes that were uhh ... "+9 armor; literally every champion in the game takes these runes or you auto-lose. Also they cost as much IP as four champions. And you have to manually adjust your rune pages, for every champion you play. But you cant do that in champion select." Sounds like a great system why did they rework it? ... That's right, because the old rune system was designed around a game that you bought from a retailer for $25 and got half the characters (a whole 20, btw) for 'free' and then had to grind to get stats in order to be competitive. Rather than having access to 145 champions without paying a thing and having all of the stats you want/need at the drop of a hat, making the barrier for entry much smoother and easier to work with. Ever wonder why high level players/streamers have so many accounts compared to past years? Because they dont have to get 45,000 IP to spend on 6% armor penetration and 9% attack speed
I don't miss the old system. I'm aware how broken stuff like thunderlords and CotC were. Stormraider only got good cause of that one patch that nerfed everything else. I think it was TL that got nerfed, or it was vice versa. Been too long. I'm just aware that the current Runes reforged turns the concept of balance on the side of its head. You listed two extreme cases where one champ has multiple rune choices, then the other where there's champs with zero or subpar rune choices. The outliers succeed cause their runes are best, resorting in the meta picks we have had for the last two years. The only time a champ gets up on their own despite runes is because they were OP/ overtuned to begin with. Pyke for instance will still be pyke.
Remove Runes reforged, and the game changes overnight. This is me simply saying that a lot of problems today are caused by the rune reforged throwing the concept of balance out the window. The game wont be fixed immediately to compensate, but the fact we have went two years and not even Riot has properly addressed this issue shows it's too big of a problem for even they to handle. If this was any other company, they would do away with the rune/ mastery system altogether and make the game more champ-decision focused.
Kazekiba3 votesIf this was any other company, they would do away with the rune/ mastery system altogether
Yes because video game companies regularly strip their games of design structures for absolutely no reason.
Cdore1 votesYes because video game companies regularly strip their games of design structures for absolutely no reason.
Good game companies strip their games of bad design.
mack91122 votesGood game companies strip their games of bad design.
There is nothing that says runes reforged is a bad design.
Cdore1 votesThere is nothing that says runes reforged is a bad design.
There are mountains of threads that have given criticisms to say otherwise.
This is a good start:
mack91123 votesThere are mountains of threads that have given criticisms to say otherwise.
This is a good start:
Yes mountains ofnthreads from a board that actively shows that they flat out hate riot.
Runes reforged has added diversity to the game that the previous system could never have achieved.
Cdore1 votesYes mountains ofnthreads from a board that actively shows that they flat out hate riot.
Runes reforged has added diversity to the game that the previous system could never have achieved.
I disagree it added any diversity, but let's be fair on one thing: reddit always loves riot. The boards have both loved and hated riot. Those who hate tend to care more than those who just cry when a new riot song is released.
preternatural1 votesliterlaly can't be tested so...