please dont kill support orianna in patch 7.16!

JarodDempsey·Aug 4, 2017·3 votes·931 views

Can we please not nerf orianna shield in 7.16! or at least not when cast on allies? Shes already on the lower end of the shield supports due to the mana cost of her abilities, the proposed nerf of 25% at rank 1 and 20% at rank 2 will be extremely debilitating considering she will have very little ap for much of the game. I'm not sure why her shield is being nerfed anyways since it isn't very strong and so relies on low cooldown to be viable but which is itself is countered by a moderate mana cost.

On a side note, why is her W damage being nerfed as well? She doesnt have very high burst and her mana cost on w is plenty for the damage it does especially considering she also requires the mana from a q to reasonably make use of the damage on w. The damage change is basically just a slap in the face.

22 Comments

GlîtchyAug 4, 20173 votes

She's presently one of the best mid laners, her and Syndra both need nerfs, Taliyah tho.....not really.

Ark SorcererAug 4, 20172 votes

I know Ori is in a good spot mid but what does that have to do with her shield though?

One Ashe OnAug 4, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ark Sorcerer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R9RThgrm,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-08-04T03:07:01.160+0000)

I know Ori is in a good spot mid but what does that have to do with her shield though?

Damage mitigating. She is the strongest and safest laner mid lane so far.

JarodDempseyAug 4, 20171 votes

lool she has no dash, blink, or hard cc aside from her ult knock and all of her skills aside from shield if her ball is on her (which is rare) have an effective cast time due to ball movement speed. She is neither the strongest nor the safest midlaner.

LethalTempo JhinAug 4, 20171 votes

Taliyah needed something though.

She was able to sit on Lost Chapter (this item is stupid) for like 2 items.

GlîtchyAug 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Taliyah needed something though.

She was able to sit on Lost Chapter (this item is stupid) for like 2 items.

Same with Veigar, yet that's not an issue?

JarodDempseyAug 4, 20172 votes

Lets see how many times i was referring to her midlane. ......... ZERO. Please read the post before making unrelated comments.

I clearly suggested a way for her support to not be ruined while her mid still got nerfed by having the nerf only apply to self shield. A base strength shield nerf really only hurts ori when she doesn't build a lot of ap and also when she relies heavily on her shield to be relevant aka support ori, not mid ori. This buff literally nerfs support ori by 25%, mid ori has the ap scaling to mitigate such a large base nerf whereas support ori probably wont get any ap until the item after boots which is usually item 3.

BeatzBoyFTWAug 4, 20173 votes

Big point is that no one brings Orianna Support. Full Stop. Your opinion alone, along with 5 to 6 similar people out of 27+ million players will not have any impact in attempting to "reverse" the nerfs.

GlîtchyAug 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Lets see how many times i was referring to her midlane. ......... ZERO. Please read the post before making unrelated comments.

I clearly suggested a way for her support to not be ruined while her mid still got nerfed by having the nerf only apply to self shield. A base strength shield nerf really only hurts ori when she doesn't build a lot of ap and also when she relies heavily on her shield to be relevant aka support ori, not mid ori. This buff literally nerfs support ori by 25%, mid ori has the ap scaling to mitigate such a large base nerf whereas support ori probably wont get any ap until the item after boots which is usually item 3.

[{quoted}](name=Ark Sorcerer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R9RThgrm,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-08-04T03:07:01.160+0000)

I know Ori is in a good spot mid but what does that have to do with her shield though?

The point being, she's an amazing mid laner because yes her shield is strong but it's TOO SAFE, safe enough to the point that it can disrupt most champs playstyle.

SohleksAug 4, 20171 votes

You're much better off with Teemo support than Orianna support... low bases, limited mana and no hard CC on her primary abilities... nobody plays that...

The 14th AngelAug 4, 20171 votes

NERFS! if akali is getting ass raped on her R by half damage in patch 6.22, then bye bye ori.

Done25Aug 4, 20171 votes

They already killed support Orianna a while back. The shield part of her E used to have a 60% AP ratio. They need to stop nerfing it though. Her damage it what needs hitting. That way she can't 1 shot squishes come late game when she has 500+ AP. Perhaps her ult could do with a longer delay so it's not quite as easy to land.

DontTouchMyBallDec 9, 20171 votes

(Wow.... I suppose you are me in na alternate universe where I actually did open a thread to complain about this.)

Reviving this thread to ask you, how are you surviving this preseason?

This guy's build was my inspiration: https://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/build/diamond-support-orianna-basics-command-support-411258

In his discussion you can find my personal changes to his build.~

I seriously think Orianna could use a "Walk into the ball to refund some little mana" mechanic. (refund being less than the cost of a Q of course to prevent abuse: This would help with her poor mana costs/regen/pool and get some mana back out of scouting bushes with her Q.

I dont get it, I see efforts for Morg and Zyra to also be midlaners but no motives to have Orianna as a support even though her kit has some very good utility! The ball is also fun to position (it has a travel delay!) and use in prediction to incomin damage, its an unique form of shield support, unlike Lulu/Karma point and clickshield, Soraka's heal and Sona's spam.

We could literally have another niche new supports players with her being a viable support. Why can this be a thing?

LifelessAngel

JarodDempseyDec 20, 20172 votes

TBH i havent played much since shortly after runes reforged released since they were a huge let down in my opinion. Overall I havent seen much benefit to ori with regard to aerie or in general, especially since i heard aerie got nerfed. I glanced at your reply to that guide and from what i see i agree with your changes, especially your general more focus on damage compared to that guide. Feel free to look at my guide which is currently just below the guide you replied to in popularity. . I definitely agree though that there is plenty of opportunity to buff supp ori without overtuning her other roles, especially after she was basically dumpstered in 7.16.

HalcyonDwellerDec 20, 20173 votes

I concur, It should be simple enough to Buff Orianna's Shield for only when she applies it to allies, rather than to herself.

DontTouchMyBallDec 20, 20171 votes

{quoted}

TBH i havent played much since shortly after runes reforged released since they were a huge let down in my opinion. Overall I havent seen much benefit to ori with regard to aerie or in general, especially since i heard aerie got nerfed. I glanced at your reply to that guide and from what i see i agree with your changes, especially your general more focus on damage compared to that guide. Feel free to look at my guide which is currently just below the guide you replied to in popularity. . I definitely agree though that there is plenty of opportunity to buff supp ori without overtuning her other roles, especially after she was basically dumpstered in 7.16.

Yeah, I saw yours too after his. I came across his first and followed his streams to learn from him, he's really experieced. I've read pretty much every support orianna threah/guide there is to offer here and on the first few pages on Google.

They nerfed every shield in the game, Ori's, Karma's, Lulu's.... it's just sad, even more now with all the poke going rampant.

Despite my spellthieves, I play very passive. Spellthieves is better IMO just because the mana sustain it offers is superior to the coin. Why? Because the coin requires minions dying near me which is not the case if I happen to rotate/roam/ward. I also need to grab the mana orbs which puts me in high risk of dying since the ball is suppose to be on the ADC for passive stats and if I do shield myself I have to return it to him = even less mana available after this. Tl,dr: coin is less mana efficient even after is upgrade (remains a 6% missing mana refund)

The use of a QWE combo is a legit way of a "suicide" in terms of mana sustain in the lane. Only: --vs mellee,

if the enemy feels zoned/scared by my ball,
if I'm not needing to shield at all during lane, only then I may then poke, and only use Q. The best ways to deal damage is with autos. I do auto a lot but might need to shield myself too.

JarodDempseyDec 22, 20171 votes

RIP shields. Also I never poke as ori, thats just throwing away mana, i also almost never go oom and even though i can often pick up the mana coins from coin theyre usually only 15mana bc my mana isnt low and the main reason i use coin over spellthiefs is the health regen passive which I find so important to sustain in lane. Also, picking up the coins is rarely a problem, id say 1/10 coins I cant pickup due to significant risk which isnt bad when you consider that to get the most out of spell thiefs you also have to walk within aa range which can also be dangerous.

DontTouchMyBallDec 22, 20171 votes

{quoted}

RIP shields. Also I never poke as ori, thats just throwing away mana, i also almost never go oom and even though i can often pick up the mana coins from coin theyre usually only 15mana bc my mana isnt low and the main reason i use coin over spellthiefs is the health regen passive which I find so important to sustain in lane. Also, picking up the coins is rarely a problem, id say 1/10 coins I cant pickup due to significant risk which isnt bad when you consider that to get the most out of spell thiefs you also have to walk within aa range which can also be dangerous.

I need to give coin a second chance and play it here and there and be more carefull with ym spells, My year in review says my most spammed spell on Orianna is the W. I use i all the time: to get to lane and to rotate btwn objectives.

My start is greedy: spellthieves, faerie charm, no pots; but I some sustain in the biscuits rune. I will also look to build Talisman (<3 that item) and maybe Knight's vow and Zeke's harbinger if I see a full AD enemy team comp. More often than not I get athenes and Mikaels and I was wondering how I'll do with a different build path, I expect it to be good.

Gathering storm is nice on her since poking isnt my main goal although scorch is MVP this preseason.

SIghstone changes will come early in new season! Im hoping for something like Saphire Sighstone with some mana ;O would be pretty sweet to get mana just because we also need also need our vision item.

You guys think OriSupp is in a good spot right now? Idk, I just have so muhch fun every time I play her

JarodDempseyJan 2, 20181 votes

Ori supp hasnt been in a good spot since she was ruined in 7.16. Not to mention that with match times beign shorter she is more dependent on earlygame (which is still garbage since this senseless nerf) and also no longer often can hit her endgame powerspike

EDIT: also i would strongly suggest not buying knights vow, it's for tank supports and in comparison to other items ori could get it is not nearly as usefuil. Also also zekes is more often than not a letdown unless youre able to coordinate with your adc really well. Mikaels is good if youre facing heavy cc but otherwise not worth it. Grail used to be perfect but has been nerfed into the trash bin unless you play someone who has low mana costs which ori does definitely not have, it used to have a good enough passive to allow more pokes to build up heals but now that its passive is relatively bad it's not worth it.

DontTouchMyBallJan 2, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Ori supp hasnt been in a good spot since she was ruined in 7.16. Not to mention that with match times beign shorter she is more dependent on earlygame (which is still garbage since this senseless nerf) and also no longer often can hit her endgame powerspike

EDIT: also i would strongly suggest not buying knights vow, it's for tank supports and in comparison to other items ori could get it is not nearly as usefuil. Also also zekes is more often than not a letdown unless youre able to coordinate with your adc really well. Mikaels is good if youre facing heavy cc but otherwise not worth it. Grail used to be perfect but has been nerfed into the trash bin unless you play someone who has low mana costs which ori does definitely not have, it used to have a good enough passive to allow more pokes to build up heals but now that its passive is relatively bad it's not worth it.

All true, but I higly consider that build when against a full AD team since it gets me a little extra armor. Athene's is my go to item vs Brand/Velkoz/Zyra supp since the build path also helps me surviving the lane due to MR, bonus points if the enemy team is imobile so I can stack a heal more easily.

My go to item has been Ardent Censer recently, except when paired with Jhin for obvious reasons. I feel like there's no item we can efficiently rush, redemption has been nerfed, locket too and has no CDR. I find myself getting mikaels a lot due to going up agaisnt so much CC. You won't believe how sad I was when I knew of the item 3174 CDR nerf to just 10%.

I cannot wait to see what the changes to the sighstone's buidpath will be. Currently it only gives health which is nice on any character, but I'd rather have mana/mana regen/AP.

item 2045 is built from item 1028 , so I guess its possible that a SS built from item 1027 , a Sapphire SS.

item 2303 item 2302 item 2301 could also suffer from these changes. Buidpaths are expected to change to lesser he burden of building a SS for supports, I hope we'll end up with something good. The meta isn't smiling upon Orianna Support but I ain't stopping playing her anytime soon, it's too much fun for me, and believe me when I say I end up mentally exhausted after playing her.

rtbf221651412Dec 22, 20171 votes

{quoted}

TBH i havent played much since shortly after runes reforged released since they were a huge let down in my opinion. Overall I havent seen much benefit to ori with regard to aerie or in general, especially since i heard aerie got nerfed. I glanced at your reply to that guide and from what i see i agree with your changes, especially your general more focus on damage compared to that guide. Feel free to look at my guide which is currently just below the guide you replied to in popularity. . I definitely agree though that there is plenty of opportunity to buff supp ori without overtuning her other roles, especially after she was basically dumpstered in 7.16.

You realize you can prob do her better now than before, especially considering the CDR to AP conversion runes and the fact her late scaling is useless now in these shorter games

JarodDempseyJan 2, 20181 votes

I've always used that rune although with some slight cdr item changes back aorund when runes released, it's not usually until late in the match that i get 40-50% cdr and rarely if ever do i end up with more than that so the cdr to ap kind of becomes rather useless although the rune is still needed to suppliment the early(ish) cdr that was lost when new runes came out. As far as her scaling due to shortness of the match goes I agree, she has not only lost that but she has also become more dependent on her early game which is relatively weak since this terrible nerf happened.