Can someone help me with the math?

Ralanr··1 votes·1,032 views

Ok, so running full Lethality reds and getting the three main Lethality items, you get about 64.4 lethality

Precision gives 8.5 lethality (I could be wrong) so that's 72.9 lethality if you're running TLD. Going ferocity just gives 7% armor pen.

Let's assume our tank has 300 armor (lets have it be Amumu who at max has a base of 88.144 armor).

So with Tabi, sunfire, omen, and deadmans, we get 190 bonus armor. Add in armor scaling seals (not sure if that's bonus armor or not) and we get 215.92 bonus armor. Add Amumu's base and we get 304.064.

Now here's the math where I am more likely to fuck up.

If bonus armor applies first, then LW bypasses 123.3279 of the bonus armor, leaving 150.7341 armor for bonus. Totaling armor at 238.8781.

Now if BC does it's full shred, that total armor is 155.270765. After the mastery, it's 144.401816.

Now with the lethality runes and items, that brings Amumu down to about 80 total armor (if I did my math correctly). 80 armor (probably wrong) is 44% damage reduction.

So effectively a full pen build does well against tanks. Even when the reason why it was renamed lethality was because armor pen was a bad buy against tanks which made it falsely advertised.

I'm probably wrong here. Can I get someone with better math skills?

15 Comments

Crimzyn1 votes

Total newb question to the in depth question you are asking here... on the Leth. Items they all say "Unique Passive" So I assumed they don't stack... but I see high ELO players using multiple items and even item builds recommend it... so they do stack? Is the "Unique Passive" incorrect?

Ralanr1 votes

The unique out of combat speed on them (as that is the unique passive, not the lethality) does not stack.

Toxic Memes1 votes

The "Unique passive" part is only unique for multiple copies of that item. For example. If you built aitem 3142and aitem 3147 , you would get 35 lethality. but if you built 2 item 3142 , you would only get 20 lethality. Named passives don't stack with other items, this is why buying multiple different types of boots, despite being different items, won't give more movement speed.

GigglesO2 votes

{quoted}

Total newb question to the in depth question you are asking here... on the Leth. Items they all say "Unique Passive" So I assumed they don't stack... but I see high ELO players using multiple items and even item builds recommend it... so they do stack? Is the "Unique Passive" incorrect?

Unique means, per item (unless it says something like spellblade). So multiple ghostblades is a no. One of each lethality items is a go.

MaeDoSan1 votes

Black cleaver applies first Then LW and last Lethality

Ralanr1 votes

Ah. Ok,

So redoing the math with that knowledge, I get 52.69 armor left over. I feel like that's wrong because that is much too small.

MaeDoSan1 votes

Doesn't matter actually because they are % reduction so you'll get the same value

Ralanr1 votes

That's like, 33% damage reduction though if I'm right.

MaeDoSan1 votes

Black cleaver reduced by 30% , LW item reduces bonus by 45 % Base reduced to 0.7 x Base , bonus reduced to 0.7 x 0.55 x Bonus or 0.55 x 0.7 x Bonus = 0.385 x Bonus In the end its 0.7 x Base + 0.385 x Bonus

Penns1 votes

Wouldnt say ~40 armor pen from 3 items with total cost of 9250 does well against tanks tho.

Ralanr1 votes

I'm probably doing the math wrong. I just want a clear correct formula and answer. Then people can at least debate with proper knowledge.

Kiharon1 votes

You can find some good info, especially the order of calculation, here http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Armor_Penetration

I don't know if anyone has actually tested whether or not the % penetration from masteries applies before or after % bonus pen from Last Whisper, but this would have some effect on the result.

So to start Base 88 + Bonus 216 = Total 304

Black Cleaver = 30% Total Reduction = 91.2 After: Base 88 + Bonus 124.8 = Total 212.8

Ferocity = 7% Total Penetration = 14.9 After: Base 88 + Bonus 109.9 = Total 197.9

Notice that these lower the bonus amount first, so the amount LW gets through is affected by this ordering. I'm not entirely sure if Ferocity is calculated before, after, or at the same time as LW, so this might be slightly off.

LW upgrade = 45% Bonus Penetration = 49.5 After: Base 88 + Bonus 60.4 = Total 148.4

Lethality = 72.9 After: Total = 75.5

dunder kill1 votes

This isn't correct because BC also shreds base armor

Kiharon1 votes

Hmmm, that's not super obviously stated in the article, but it is kind of there if you read it closely. I never noticed it that way before. If we take that into account, it ends up being basically what MaeDoSan posted. (Also, I included both Precision and Battering Blows when you can only have one. It doesn't affect the overall method, but it's still wrong.)

As MaeDoSan posted:

Armor = (Base * 0.7 [Black Cleaver]) + (Bonus * 0.7 [Black Cleaver] * 0.55 [Last Whisper upgrade]) - Flat Penetration [Lethality items/runes/masteries]

Armor = (88 * 0.7) + (216 * 0.385) - 72.9 = 61.6 + 83.16 - 72.9 = 71.86

If you had Battering Blows instead, you would multiply base and bonus both by 0.93 and have a lower flat penetration number.

dunder kill1 votes

A good rule is unless an item/ability species BONUS armor, its total armor including base

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