Shyvana runs in fast, kills shit fast, jumps in and blows up.

Mira Arya Enthe·Apr 2, 2017·22 votes·1,886 views

With only a minor tanking steroid and no sustain in her kit.

Why is she listed as a Juggernaut

Instead of a Diver

44 Comments

Sahn UzalApr 2, 201714 votes

Because, post her ultimate, she's very easy to kite compared to divers.

I think that was the logic behind her classification.

She's a hybrid between the 2 anyway, jumps in like a diver, acts like a juggernaut post that jump

Mira Arya EntheApr 2, 20175 votes

A gud answer

Sahn UzalApr 2, 20174 votes

http://img.memecdn.com/THanks_fb_28684.jpg

Mira Arya EntheApr 2, 20172 votes

Shyvana has none of the major Juggernaut fighting strengths. No in fight sustain and no CC.

She has one diver strength, a leap, divers have that on normal abilities. She also lacks their CC.

She has the weaknesses of both and her only redeeming value is high damage with some mobility, not much. Especially since her clear was gutted.

Sahn UzalApr 2, 20171 votes

Well ofcourse she's gonna have less power than a juggernaut, to make up for the gapcloser that she DOES have :P Not saying she's not too weak, not saying she is either. I'm just stating that her not being as much of a threat in a fight as another juggernaut is undestandable, because she does get to cover that weakness of the Juggernaut subclass with her R.

Troll for TrumpApr 2, 20171 votes

Shyv tries to do things poorly instead of one specialized thing well?

OkamikaziApr 3, 20171 votes

cough item 3022 cough item 1401 aaaaaaack item 3025

LankPantsApr 3, 20172 votes

They're not Shyvana's strengths, they're the item's strengths.

Mira Arya EntheApr 3, 20171 votes

Anybody can buy items. Also two of those do nothing for her early game, the other is available to every jungler. On a side note nobody buys Cinderhulk on Shyvana lol.

EvanThomasApr 3, 20171 votes

IBG on Shyvana.

500 mana. On shyvana. A manaless champion.

ForeverLaxxApr 3, 20172 votes

Tell that to Akali, who really likes Lichbane. Go ahead.

It's whether you believe having wasted stats on an item is worth what the item does for you otherwise.

Sexy Jack RabbitApr 3, 20173 votes

It's sort of different scenario.

In regards to cost efficiency, you're losing out on about 350 Gold by taking item 3100 on Akali. In regards to item 3025 , you're losing out on about 700 gold by buying it on Shyvana.

ForeverLaxxApr 3, 20171 votes

It's not different at all. I'm not advocating that you buy IBG on Shyv, just pointing out that avoiding an item because it has one stat on it you can't use is needlessly shortsighted and limiting your options. Most champions who have an on-hit ability that resets their attack animation will want to consider a Sheen item regardless of their mana situation. The decision to buy comes from deciding on paying for wasted for stats is worth the trade off, or if you can even afford to spend a slot on that kind of luxury.

My Waifu VanillaApr 3, 20171 votes

Even then she isn't really as mobile as most of the other juggs in the grand scheme of things since she can't buy Black Cleaver (Phage being very comparable to her W) and doesn't work as well with SRS as Darius/Morde.

Mira Arya EntheApr 3, 20171 votes

Shyvana gets movespeed quints, deadmans and occasionally tri-force or swiftness. She has top tier base movement speed and a movement speed boost in her base kit, plus an unstoppable 850 range leap. She is extremely mobile, far more than Darius and especially Morde. Also SRS was her primary mastery until buffs to Fervor. Some people still prefer SRS. Some Shyvana players even opt for a Phantom Dancer. Plus BotRK is core which steals movement speed.

TheTariansApr 2, 20179 votes

What are you talking about? All those champs are tanks!

Kappa

Mira Arya EntheApr 2, 20177 votes

http://static1.gamespot.com/uploads/original/81/814377/3066264-1801844645-Stop%2B.gif

xJLx MCHammerApr 2, 20175 votes

She sucks!

That's that

She was intended to be a champion who dives the back line a lot like Xin. Who needs to be peeled off. The state of the game now is that most ADC's can peel Shyvana off by themselves. She has no CC other than her ult. In most cases, she has to use her ult to actually reach the back line and if she does that, she just gets kited. If she does not ult the ult, it's likely, that the enemy team did something wrong and any other champion would have done the job just as good.

Mira Arya EntheApr 2, 20174 votes

This is what it feels like.

Malicious MetalApr 2, 20174 votes

I'd rather not think about Shyvana with an actual heal or major defensive steroid.

Dominick DestineApr 2, 20176 votes

[{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Q2BrhWOU,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2017-04-02T22:07:49.238+0000)

I'd rather not think about Shyvana with an actual heal or major defensive steroid.

If it comes with a general damage reduction, it would not be unreasonable.

Shyvana is very kitable and has one of the worst gap closers in the game.

Mostro GalloApr 3, 20171 votes

This game does not need more champions with innate healing. Fuck that

Teridax68Apr 3, 20173 votes

A core characteristic of a diver is that they can basically reach the backline whenever they want to, without having to physically walk through the enemy team first. Shyvana can do that, but only with her ult. Another core characteristic of divers is that their damage is mostly focused on single targets, whereas juggernauts have much more constant AoE. To be fair, Shyvana clearly has aspects of both juggernauts and divers, and would likely be best represented as a diver/juggernaut hybrid, so she could very well be listed as both.

PsykohApr 2, 20172 votes

My proposal would be to give her ultimate a stun...so she would ult and upon Landing she would set the area on fire for 1 second and stunning all hit by the aoe for 0.5 seconds the aoe burn could scale with her Hp or ad whatever fits the aoe burn could increase by 1 sec for every lvl the stunning could be increased

LankPantsApr 2, 20171 votes

Just make it stun targets against walls IMO. That would be enough and give her an actual use condition in a teamfight without just making her Malphite.

RaiokuMoonscarApr 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

My proposal would be to give her ultimate a stun...so she would ult and upon Landing she would set the area on fire for 1 second and stunning all hit by the aoe for 0.5 seconds the aoe burn could scale with her Hp or ad whatever fits the aoe burn could increase by 1 sec for every lvl the stunning could be increased

This I can see being acceptable.

Dominick DestineApr 2, 20172 votes

I would rather Shyvana be made tankier and less damage orientated.

I hate that they have steadily made her more DPS and less tank.... her mini-rework was complete trash.

FrightningApr 3, 20172 votes

Last time I played Shyvana was in ARAM, and I had most dmg to champs and most kills on my side, but I built nearly full tank. Only damage item was a Titanic Hydra. She wins by being hard af to kill or run away from while dealing steady damage to everything around her. Sounds pretty Juggernautish to me (I do thing she needs help in the form of some choice buffs to the right things...maybe her scaling with defensive stats could be improved a tad...to counteract the damage hike that came w/ season 6 changes and continues to the present time).

Big LincolnApr 2, 20171 votes

She's considered a hybrid between them, her base kit is juggernaut but her ult lets her ignore their weakness, similar to Olaf

Mira Arya EntheApr 2, 20171 votes

Shyvana has none of the major Juggernaut fighting strengths. No in fight sustain and no CC.

She has one diver strength, a leap, divers have that on normal abilities. She also lacks their CC.

She has the weaknesses of both and her only redeeming value is high damage with some mobility, not much. Especially since her clear was gutted.

Big LincolnApr 2, 20172 votes

IDK fam. She's an old-ass champion, she's outdated

if u want i could add shyvana to the list of big lincoln circlejerk topics and see where it goes

Forhonor321Apr 2, 20171 votes

I've always considered her as an odd mix of a juggernaut and diver, but somehow doesn't feel like it works. Don't get me wrong I love playing her, but when you compare what divers have and juggernauts have to what she has, it doesn't feel like this at all. Almost every diver that I can think of has some sort of basic gap closer and way of slowing enemies down or disrupting them (Vi and Aatrox with Q, Xin and Hec with E, Kled Q E Ult, etc.) with possibly the only exception of WW, who even then could still initiate non-ult with Q tied in with E in a large enemy clump. Shyvana does have a way to initiate with her ult but nothing outside of that, making it very go all in or have it for escape.

Juggernauts on the other hand usually are slower, but have more damaged-packed abilities (Darius Q on blade, Nasus stacked Q, Garen Q and E, even Mord's third Q). Shyvana kinda has this with her burstful Q, AoE W and % health damage on E, BUT at the same time Juggernauts also have some sort of CC (Darius W and E, Garen Q again, Nasus W, etc.) and Shyv has none of this outside her ult, which is only a small knockback and not a full fledged drag/push (like Poppy's E).

Honestly I just think she's in a weird spot right now. She has a good ult to be a diver, but that's all she has. She has the damage to be a juggernaut, but no CC in her basic abilities whatsoever. I mean Olaf, the one other champ who is kinda comparable to Shyv, has a basic slow on his Q which can lead to more slows. That to me is way better than Shyv only having CC on her ult. Idk she's just in an odd position right now and I just don't feel comfortable playing her when there seems to be a number of champs that can do her job better. At this point I wouldn't mind asking for another rework but more full-fledged and making bigger changes to her.

Mira Arya EntheApr 2, 20171 votes

Shyvana has none of the major Juggernaut fighting strengths. No in fight sustain and no CC.

She has one diver strength, a leap, divers have that on normal abilities. She also lacks their CC.

She has the weaknesses of both and her only redeeming value is high damage with some mobility, not much. Especially since her clear was gutted.

Forhonor321Apr 2, 20171 votes

Fair enough and that's why, sadly, I don't ever feel like I can pick her now a days. I just don't feel like shes worth picking anymore if she's suppose to fill a certain role. Any diver just does her initiation way better since they do have the tools and CC to do so and juggernauts are more than likely going to be picked top lane anyways, where once again they do have CC. And all of this is made worse when she has both of their weaknesses, with limited value of damage and some mobility. But even then, certain champs can just do it better than her, like Graves right now or even Rek'sai. I just don't ever see a reason now a days to pick her over one of these champs if I need them for her role. And that sucks because she's pretty much my is, or I guess now a days was, my favorite champ to play.

Hexs FortuneApr 2, 20171 votes

She was intended to be a champion who dives the back line a lot like Xin.

Why are you making false claims like this? Xin Zhao's dive can be as low as 6.6 sec cd. Shyvana ult has a much much longer cd than that.

Her diving potential doesn't compare to Xin Zhao in the least. Shyvana dive is a one and done per fight

Mira Arya EntheApr 2, 20173 votes

Shyvana has none of the major Juggernaut fighting strengths. No in fight sustain and no CC.

She has one diver strength, a leap, divers have that on normal abilities. She also lacks their CC.

She has the weaknesses of both and her only redeeming value is high damage with some mobility, not much. Especially since her clear was gutted.

cocacolalipsApr 3, 20172 votes

I don't think you know what a juggernaut is, neither sustain or crowd control defines a juggernaut

JUGGERNAUTS: When you think brute force, these champions should come to mind: powerful, durable, immobile and melee. They’re League’s hulking titans who, come late game, turn into super tanky carries who’ll pretty much destroy anyone foolish enough to get in their way. (from the juggernaut update page)

While Shyvana is not the prototype juggernaut, she dives (hehe) on the diver side a bit, she still has the above mentioned qualities, she may not be the most innately durable of the bunch, but there are not a lot of champions who can insta gib your entire backline in 1 combo while also rocking 5k health.