Can we stop having 86498645148965 "outside of champions…

Beatrice falls · 2018-08-27T11:48:33.344Z

Jesus fucking Christ man, I do not remember ever killing anyone (and I did play him for a while during s4 s5 s6) with only R > AA with 2 items. Yeah because that's his only source of damage right ? = 1 more source = 1 more source = 1 more source Electrocute = 1 more Sudden impact = 1 more Seriously, I'm not playing a FPS, neither do I have the Spidey sense to react so fast to such a burst of someone not even ahead (even a bit behind). Does anyone here have fun by playing this ? There is no counterplay to die in less than a second to any assassin that didn't even use their entire kit and have about 70% of their damage tied to things not even in their base kit. I'm taking him as an example, but it also goes for AP assassin such as (and I admit spamming her), I once managed to "3 shots" 3 squishies during a teamfight with W > R > , or just one shot any squishy with Q > R > , not even the entire kit being required. This is damn stupid

KrullyAug 27, 201833 votes

I have been saying that for years

TerozuAug 27, 201828 votes

It still hasnt been a year.

KrullyAug 27, 20185 votes

i got that future sense

THE RlVER KlNGAug 27, 201818 votes

keystones are a mistake

TerozuAug 27, 20185 votes

That's better~ [katarina-love]

Mokuto BunshiAug 27, 20181 votes

The old runes had a most powerful end choice as well: Fervor of battle Bonds of stone winds speakers etc.

The difference is that they all got buffs and a facelift

WimbledofyAug 27, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mokuto Bunshi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=00000000000000010001,timestamp=2018-08-27T19:51:05.130+0000)

The old runes had a most powerful end choice as well: Fervor of battle Bonds of stone winds speakers etc.

The difference is that they all got buffs and a facelift

What you just listed are all keystones... Do people not know that masteries existed at one point without keystones?

Mokuto BunshiAug 28, 20181 votes

But we were talking about keystones...

LordGeovanniAug 28, 20181 votes

which we established were a mistake but then you when around talking about powerful choices by quouting more keystones

ThefrostyvikingAug 28, 20181 votes

Half or more of those masteries were just stats though, and the rest were passives like bandits "poke enemy champ for gold", "hit enemy to give allies DMG AMP on that enemy" or "3% extra movespeed out of combat".

So almost all of the masteries that actually did something exist even now as small runes, the stats are loaded into your page combination choice or a small rune itself. '

SKT ReZaAug 28, 20181 votes

u dont even know they was masteries not runes, gtfo

Mokuto BunshiAug 28, 20181 votes

potato potaato you get what I mean.

Auz the RipperAug 27, 201812 votes

i wouldn't say they were a mistake, it's just they were implemented poorly. if 90% weren't just "MOAR DAMAGE" and all were more utility or resource management types, they would have been way healthier

J EevoAug 27, 20185 votes

This needs to be higher. I love glacial augment giving a slow to a champion that might otherwise lack it, guardian promoting sticking to your adc to shield them, Unsealed spellbook has interesting uses, and Predator would be cool if it didn't also boost the damage. Everything else pretty much just adds more damage, without really affecting how you play, you just do more damage in ways you already would, which is really boring.

SaltyToplaneGoatAug 27, 20182 votes

We should have just taken the chance to delete this outdated principle to begin with. Runes and mastries were never a truly necessary part to this game, and now all they do is cause problems.

MarothennanAug 27, 20182 votes

{quoted}

I have been saying that for years

Wasn't runes reforged released in preseason 8?

RavenMagusAug 27, 201812 votes

I don't think it was a mistake, just heavily overtuned with not enough compensation for the missing defensive stats from everyone's runepages.

Warlord RhinarkAug 27, 201819 votes

{quoted}

I don't think it was a mistake, just heavily overtuned with not enough compensation for the missing defensive stats from everyone's runepages.

It was change for the sake of change and it ended up failing miserably.

The original problem of runes was:

A. They cost IP.

B. They couldn't be changed in champ select.

Instead of simply fixing these two issues, they ended up creating what's possibly the worst Season of League of Legends.

The old system, whilst bland and unintuitive, was at least functional and balanced (to an extent, of course).

ZephyrDrakeAug 27, 20184 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2018-08-27T13:43:42.111+0000)

It was change for the sake of change and it ended up failing miserably.

The original problem of runes was:

A. They cost IP.

B. They couldn't be changed in champ select.

Instead of simply fixing these two issues, they ended up creating what's possibly the worst Season of League of Legends.

The old system, whilst bland and unintuitive, was at least functional and balanced (to an extent, of course).

and that the vast majority of them were completely useless. It was "balanced" in the sense that "you either pick this specific runes or you will lose 99% of the time"

MrFawknSunshineAug 27, 20189 votes

{quoted}

and that the vast majority of them were completely useless. It was "balanced" in the sense that "you either pick this specific runes or you will lose 99% of the time"

how is it different now? every one still takes the most optimal runes and if they mess up their runes they lose

ZephyrDrakeAug 27, 20182 votes

{quoted}

how is it different now? every one still takes the most optimal runes and if they mess up their runes they lose

define "mess up". Yeah people will take optimal runes, that doesn't mean that you don't have options though. Depending on the matchup you can be more greedy or more defensive in your rune choices. You going the greedy route against really bad matchups is you not knowing how the matchups works or overestimating your skill while underestimating your opponent

MrFawknSunshineAug 27, 20184 votes

{quoted}

define "mess up". Yeah people will take optimal runes, that doesn't mean that you don't have options though. Depending on the matchup you can be more greedy or more defensive in your rune choices. You going the greedy route against really bad matchups is you not knowing how the matchups works or overestimating your skill while underestimating your opponent

and you could do this in the old rune system too...

i had multiple pages designed for match ups

JbelsAug 27, 20181 votes

{quoted}

and that the vast majority of them were completely useless. It was "balanced" in the sense that "you either pick this specific runes or you will lose 99% of the time"

So lets just replace it with this cancerous new system instead of just removing what can't be fixed and fixing what shouldn't need to be removed. How is this system any better? Water Walking isn't used on anyone besides Aurelion Sol, the only runes that matter are the ones that directly increase your damage output, and Electrocute as a keystone has gotten so bad that its become the standard to use it on champions it wasn't meant for (Hello TLD meta).

The runes in the old system were there purely for early game stat optimization. Maokai took attack speed runes because his AA animation was ass and needed the extra AS to last hit well. Hecarim took movement speed runes because it helped him get through jungle faster while also increasing his AD thanks to his passive. Mages took Mpen marks because wave clear and better trading in lane. It made SENSE back then, even if many parts of the system went unused. Every champion had a specific setup for early game with runes. I haven't play a single tank that doesn't go bone plating ever since it came out.

SangreDeNocheAug 28, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Water Walking isn't used on anyone besides Aurelion Sol

*Cries in Bard *

Warlord RhinarkAug 27, 20183 votes

{quoted}

and that the vast majority of them were completely useless. It was "balanced" in the sense that "you either pick this specific runes or you will lose 99% of the time"

And the new runes system is any different? I still see the same rune builds over and over again, Ezreal always taking Kleptomancy, Zed always taking Electrocute etc. etc.

At least the old system was less impactful.

RavenMagusAug 27, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2018-08-27T13:43:42.111+0000)

The old system, whilst bland and unintuitive, was at least functional and balanced (to an extent, of course).

I would consider "bland" and "unintuitive" to be negative aspects. Thus, this is not change for the sake of change, but rather change for the sake of actually fixing something and making it better.

I greatly enjoy the new runes system. I just wish I could enjoy them for more than 0.1 seconds at a time.

Warlord RhinarkAug 28, 20181 votes

{quoted}

I would consider "bland" and "unintuitive" to be negative aspects. Thus, this is not change for the sake of change, but rather change for the sake of actually fixing something and making it better.

I greatly enjoy the new runes system. I just wish I could enjoy them for more than 0.1 seconds at a time.

I'd rather take something bland and boring that works, than something that's fresh and exciting but is only fun for 20% of the players in the game and is the cause of several balance issues.

RavenMagusAug 29, 20181 votes

Balance can be fixed though. Exciting is the hard part. Once exciting is made, the numbers can later be tweaked.

Theoretically, anyways. Numbers have not been tweaked very much lately.

Warlord RhinarkAug 29, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Balance can be fixed though. Exciting is the hard part. Once exciting is made, the numbers can later be tweaked.

Theoretically, anyways. Numbers have not been tweaked very much lately.

The thing is, "exciting" is subjective.

Something being balanced is, of course, also subjective, but I think it's easier to get everyone to agree when it comes to balancing, than when it comes to releasing something everyone finds fun.

RavenMagusAug 29, 20181 votes

Well, I haven't seen anyone claim the old runes system was exciting at all. Going from no people thinking it's exciting to at least some people thinking it's exciting is an improvement, if it can be balanced.

Warlord RhinarkAug 29, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Well, I haven't seen anyone claim the old runes system was exciting at all. Going from no people thinking it's exciting to at least some people thinking it's exciting is an improvement, if it can be balanced.

Big "if" there, because as it's turned out, Runes Reforged has done more harm than good.

InfernapeAug 27, 20184 votes

If Riot dealt with the frankly retarded amount of free damage RR added at the start of the season, the game probably wouldn't feel as shitty to play as it does now.

ned the kledAug 27, 20187 votes

it is to the point it forces you to have useless stats on champs like karthus if you pick presence of mind.. a lot of variety in the old runes system

they just had to make the runes free and all our problems would be fixed..

ZephyrDrakeAug 27, 201813 votes

[{quoted}](name=ned the kled,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=00000003,timestamp=2018-08-27T14:10:34.359+0000)

it is to the point it forces you to have useless stats on champs like karthus if you pick presence of mind.. a lot of variety in the old runes system

they just had to make the runes free and all our problems would be fixed..

love how people say this when it wasn't true. Please take off your nostalgia glasses for once

ned the kledAug 27, 20183 votes

dont know how having attack speed on karthus helps tho

SuperNova0079Aug 27, 20184 votes

it did in the old days when his attack animation was actual horse shit.

ZephyrDrakeAug 27, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=ned the kled,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=0000000300000000,timestamp=2018-08-27T15:25:49.899+0000)

dont know how having attack speed on karthus helps tho

don't know why you are going precision tree on karthus so that's on you not on the current system

ned the kledAug 27, 20183 votes

dont see who else uses presence of mind besides karthus and gp

ZephyrDrakeAug 27, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=ned the kled,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=000000030000000000020000,timestamp=2018-08-27T16:52:39.172+0000)

dont see who else uses presence of mind besides karthus and gp

if you need that when you can just go sorcery and get manaflow band and have pretty much the same effect then I have no idea what to say to you.

DemainaNyxAug 28, 20183 votes

Karthus starts in Sorcery and takes those runes anyway. But the reason you go Precision is for the cooldown on ult. His ult is 200/180/160 seconds, so 10% off that for a kill or assist is massive.

Additionally, Karthus can either go Goup de Grace to help ensure his ult kills, or he can go Last Stand so that when he's in his passive, he does even more damage. So instead of doing 7% more only to low health enemies, he can do 11% more damage to everyone because he's below the health threshold in his passive.

ZephyrDrakeAug 28, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Karthus starts in Sorcery and takes those runes anyway. But the reason you go Precision is for the cooldown on ult. His ult is 200/180/160 seconds, so 10% off that for a kill or assist is massive.

Additionally, Karthus can either go Goup de Grace to help ensure his ult kills, or he can go Last Stand so that when he's in his passive, he does even more damage. So instead of doing 7% more only to low health enemies, he can do 11% more damage to everyone because he's below the health threshold in his passive.

well I am surprised that you can take a domination rune on the precision tree since the ult CD reduction rune was moved to the domination tree a while ago... so there goes one of the options there leaving an entire part that he really doesn't care since he doesn't care about lifesteal or AS... he might care about the tenacity one I guess but that's more of "there is nothing else I can use here" than anything. Yes you can do more damage by going either Last Stand or Coup the Grace but is that what Karthus really needs when he already does a ton of damage?

Weiss GuertenaAug 28, 20183 votes

While it's hard picking a Domination rune in Precision tree, it's pretty damn easy picking Presence of Mind which was reworked to "takedowns, after a 1-second delay, restore 20% of your maximum mana and refund 10% of your ultimate's maximum cooldown."

My Waifu VanillaAug 28, 20183 votes

Shhhhh reading comprehension is hard.

ZephyrDrakeAug 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Weiss Guertena,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=0000000300000000000200000000000100000000,timestamp=2018-08-28T01:16:16.800+0000)

While it's hard picking a Domination rune in Precision tree, it's pretty damn easy picking Presence of Mind which was reworked to "takedowns, after a 1-second delay, restore 20% of your maximum mana and refund 10% of your ultimate's maximum cooldown."

if you are in such a desperate need for mana on Karthus who loves so many mana items and already is going sorcery to get what is essentially the "I don't run out of mana ever rune unless I spam nonstop even when nobody is around" rune then I have nothing to say

Weiss GuertenaAug 28, 20181 votes

If you are so thick to completely overlook the "10% off my long-ass CD ultimate for every opposing champion that dies within a 10 seconds of me casting it" aspect and still hold onto mana as the main reason to pick PoM, then I too have nothing more to say.

ZephyrDrakeAug 29, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Weiss Guertena,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PXxJEmrW,comment-id=000000030000000000020000000000010000000000010000,timestamp=2018-08-28T23:27:05.662+0000)

If you are so thick to completely overlook the "10% off my long-ass CD ultimate for every opposing champion that dies within a 10 seconds of me casting it" aspect and still hold onto mana as the main reason to pick PoM, then I too have nothing more to say.

so you going domination + precision tree? because the precision tree has no ult CDR rune anymore, it got moved to the domination tree... If you are going to try to look smart at least know what you are talking about since all you did was made yourself look like a dolt

Weiss GuertenaAug 29, 20181 votes

How can I even take you seriously when you refuse to take 20 seconds to check what runes actually do? So, let me try again. Don't worry, I will use short and concise sentences since you seem to have trouble grasping longer ones:

Ultimate Hat existed in Sorcery tree. Sorcery tree isn't Precision tree. It got reworked and moved into Domination tree.

Presence of Mind is a Precision rune. It got reworked into giving ultimate CD reduction. It didn't get moved out of Precision tree.

If it is still too hard to grasp, do the following steps: Type "google.com" in your browser. Type "lol wiki precision" in search box. Open the wiki page. Move your mouse cursor over Presence of Mind rune. Read the tooltip. Realize that you're the dolt who has no idea what he's talking about here.

PercentagesAug 27, 20185 votes

I'd kill to have my runes back...

Can we stop having 86498645148965 "outside of champions kit" damage ?

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