Yorick Rework is out! Feedback from a Tier 7 Yorick main

Hemulen Magi··14 votes·8,215 views

https://lolstatic-a.akamaihd.net/frontpage/apps/prod/rg-yorick-champion-update-2016/en_AU/1c2f93d8a655bf7e0750ac468c0030bc494e5c04/assets/img/Yorick_comic_V1.png

Alright, so the Yorick rework has been brewing for years now, and it's finally on the horizon. As a Yorick main with around 200k mastery, I've been both excited and worried sick about this day. The re-reveal was recently posted to OCE: http://oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/yorick-champion-update

First off, the new artwork is excellent, and I must congratulate whoever worked on it. It captures the old Yorick much better than I expected, while also broadening his appeal. Really good job - I especially like the new Undertaker Yorick, which I happen to already own. https://lolstatic-a.akamaihd.net/frontpage/apps/prod/rg-yorick-champion-update-2016/en_AU/1c2f93d8a655bf7e0750ac468c0030bc494e5c04/assets/img/skin-2.jpg

Secondly, turning ghouls into Mist Walkers is a nice surprise. I like this much better than the old Inky, Stinky, and Hungry idea that was in the older rework concept. I will miss the original riders of the apocalypse references on ability, but overall this is a fair trade.

Saving the most important for last, is his kit. Overall, some aspects look quite good, while others leave me still feeling worried. To me, the most crucial part of making a rework land well with a champion's dedicated playerbase is that it must leave their established roles/positions intact and viable. Without knowledge of ratios or scaling, it's not yet possible to say if Yorick will still work in his 3 pre-rework positions, top, jungle, and support. Hopefully, the developers will keep an eye on Yorick's performance in top, jungle, and support, and will ensure that he is still capable of performing in all those positions/roles.As a primarily Yorick support player, I am most concerned by the loss of his revive on his ultimate. I have always seen Yorick as a supportive/enchanter bruiser/juggernaut, and his ability to cast his ultimate on an ally was key to his supportive/enchanter side.

I think that his new Q will work quite well with relic shield to allow him to continue to survive in bot lane IF the heal is high and balanced around a long cooldown (Yorick can't CS often as a support, so bigger heals less often works better in this case). I am thankful that he can generate graves similar to how Thresh generates souls, so that Yorick won't necessarily need to take the CS to use his full kit. I am a bit concerned that the mechanics for graves/mist-walkers described in the reveal are going to be very hard for jungle Yorick to make use of however, since he will need to generate at least three graves in one small location, which will be hard to do moving from camp-to-camp. Hopefully, this can be looked into somehow if jungle Yorick struggles. Perhaps large monsters should always produce a grave on death.

The new W looks like it has a lot of potential for supporting, though it turns him into more of a lockdown/disruptor support than an enchanter, which makes his role a bit more homogeneous with other tanky supports... I think that the concept behind Dark Procession (W) could be improved by adding a resistance debuff to enemies trapped within the walls, which would essentially work as a damage amplification for allies targeting the trapped opponents - this could be balanced around making the walls shorter-lasting if needed or the cooldown longer, etc. The damage amplification would make the ability feel more fitting on an enchanter-class champion, which is important to Yorick's identity in my opinion. This would also make the ability more jungle-friendly by improving clear times by allowing Yorick to cast it on camps to improve clearing by debuffing monster resistances.

The new E looks nice. It's essentially a combination of Yorick's old W effect and his Q proc's ghosting passive. Also, I imagine this will be his main poking tool, so it should feel comfortable on his E for existing Yorick players. I am really grateful that the developers tried to keep Yorick's new kit familiar to his existing playerbase. Thank you for this.

Lastly, the new R - I loved Yorick's old ultimate, and I am hoping I will enjoy his new ultimate. His old ultimate helped him win duels, splitpush, support his carries, and turn close teamfights into victories. I doubt that I will like not being about to directly control the maiden of the mist. I personally consider controlling 2 characters in fights to be a fun aspect of champions like Yorick, Mordekaiser, or Shaco. Sure, having the maiden control herself is one less thing to focus on in a hectic fight, but the chances of the uncontrollable AI reliably doing what you want is probably pretty slim. If for example, the AI sends the maiden off to go hunt minions during a teamfight, then that would be an utterly disappointing waste of an ultimate. I am actually very concerned with Yorick's ability to control any of his new minions, since if the AI of the mist walkers cannot be conveniently controlled, they will create havoc for Yorick by auto-pushing any lane now that they don't even decay while they are near Yorick - if there is no way to prevent them from autopushing, it will kill support Yorick and harm top Yorick.

Without knowing the numbers on the new ultimate ability, it will be hard to imagine how it will stack up to the old revenant. I doubt that it will scale as well as an ulted adc clone, but it might still be pretty powerful and may be even stronger than the old revenant early on. The loss of the ability to revive an ally in a teamfight is a pretty huge blow to Yorick's lategame impact as well as his utility. I am really sad to see the old ultimate go, and I don't mean to be critical but I am truly not convinced that it has been given a replacement that will be as flexible, powerful, unique, or interesting. I would really, really like to see some unselfish utility potential put back on the ultimate. Perhaps it could be given the Lissandra ultimate treatment, where the effect differs based on whether it is cast on an self/ally or on empty-ground/enemy. For example, an enemy-cast could send the maiden of the mist to haunt the targeted opponent, casting on empty ground could spawn the maiden with the split-push AI described in the reveal article, while an ally/self-cast could provide the original revenant + temporary revive. This might make balancing Yorick more challenging, but it would vastly improve his gameplay, providing flexibility and interesting decision making. It would also fit his lore theme, as he is torn between choosing to use his power to help protect and guide his allies (ally-cast utility), or whether the powers of the mist corrupt and motivate him to devastate his opponents (enemy-cast offense). I really hope this one ability will receive major attention to make sure it is completely satisfying to Yorick's established playerbase.

Thank you for reading. I apologize if this is too much feedback or if I rambled on in parts, but this is an important topic for me. I really appreciate the attention Yorick is receiving, and I hope we, the players and developers, can work together to make Yorick the best and most satisfying champion that he can be. I am really hyped and I hope that this rework is going to go all the way in creating an ideal Yorick who keeps his identity while modernizing.

Edit: I listened to Yorick's new voice-over last night: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgBHy5ddnCY I really, really like it. His script is excellent, and the quotes reveal a lot about his new character. The voice actor also did very well - reminds me of Legacy of Kain, Blood Omen. I think that adding a filter effect for a slightly more gravelly tone/echo and slightly lowering Yorick's voice pitch might be a marginal improvement, but it is already very good as-is. I definitely think the new voice-over is a great improvement.

30 Comments

Weathered6 votes

I played on the Playtest PBE Stream Riot just did. I can answer some stuff.

"Without knowledge of ratios or scaling, it's not yet possible to say if Yorick will still work in his 3 pre-rework positions, top, jungle, and support." He has some tough jungle clears, but is viable to an extent. Top is the main role, and support isn't very viable, unless you really rely on using relic shield with Q.

"I am a bit concerned that the mechanics for graves/mist-walkers described in the reveal are going to be very hard for jungle Yorick to make use of " You would most likely shoot for Q'ing all three of a 3 or more camp (like wolves) and then resurrecting them to take to the next camp for a leash.

"Also, I imagine this (Yorick's E) will be his main poking tool" He doesn't poke much, and is mostly focused on using Grasp+corrupting postion+Q heals to sustain like a madman till mid game.

"but the chances of the uncontrollable AI reliably doing what you want is probably pretty slim." Yes, it's unpredictable, but she is mostly used as a split pusher. Ghouls will follow the maiden down a lane to push, and you can go to a different lane. The creator on stream mentioned that the first descision they had to make was controlling minions or not, and they decided to not. They wanted to push the thematic of slowly building up an army of the undead to swarm the enemy.

Hemulen Magi2 votes

Thanks for the early information. What are his ability ratios like?

I am glad to hear he works well as a top lane split pusher, since that is probably his most popular role. I hope the developer can look into making sure he still works in the jungle and as a bot-lane support too though. Like I mentioned in the original post, I am mainly a Yorick support player, so while I know it's a rare playstyle on an unpopular champion, it's still hugely important to me personally.

Weathered3 votes

For ratios...

His Q has a VERY high AD ratio (which was acknowledged in the stream and will most likely be nerfed). His E has an AP ratio, but it isn't very significant. I didn't catch his R ratio, but it is mostly used for the extra % damage it gives for Yorick himself.

MunchCrunchLunch2 votes

{quoted}

For ratios...

His Q has a VERY high AD ratio (which was acknowledged in the stream and will most likely be nerfed). His E has an AP ratio, but it isn't very significant. I didn't catch his R ratio, but it is mostly used for the extra % damage it gives for Yorick himself.

ofcourse his Q has a high ad ratio. its an aa cancel. which means its 1.0 AD plus something.

Meep Man2 votes

Its 140% AD plus 30/55/80/105/130 The heal scales with level I believe and is about 12-40 I believe

Hemulen Magi1 votes

Thanks. Precise numbers are greatly appreciated. What is the cooldown like? Does the cooldown scale with ability level-ups?

Photos of Ghosts1 votes

There's now the full numbers on s#@20, but anyway: the Maiden's HP scales with his, her magic autoattacks scale with his total AD.

Rain NT2 votes

I personally dont like it when champions that needs change to play in a lane that they ARENT suppose to. I currently like his atm, I dont want them to nerf some of his kit just to buff other area so that he can "jungle" or so he can "support" if thats the case I rather him be completely reworked to tailor ONLY jungle or ONLY to support and lesser mediocre the other two lanes. He cant be viable all 3 lanes thats just not possible, if they wanted to make him viable all 3 lanes, then they wouldnt need to change him at all.

With that being said, I kinda like his new design, its different and looks hella cool. His combo will prob be EWQ now. Slow to help him land his W and his mist walkers will just swarm the opposing laner and cant escape

Photos of Ghosts2 votes

What kind of logic is that. Old LoL had champions always be viable in at least 2 roles... you can make a champ healthier without killing off off-builds.

Rain NT1 votes

Old LoL. They have killed off almost all of it. AP gangplank which I loved but understand why, AP yi, AD Fizz isnt as good anymore, Ap rengar. And im fine with it all, because they have a clear role and what they are suppose to do.

Meep Man2 votes

I can only comment on Top Lane so I will post here for my brother in Jungle and then our limited interaction with Supporick.

Jungle Yorick is slow for a bit, but then turns stupidly aggressive past the first clear in counter jungling. Yorick's ghouls' health and attack damage are INCREDIBLE in the jungle and make his clears stupidly fast and safe for his own health. It's important to use Raptor and Wolf camps as Ghoul spawners since they deal the least damage while also being 3+ camps for spawning ghouls. Once you have ghouls, you have 3 options: A.) Clear your side of the jungle, B.) Gank a lane with your W and use your E to direct your ghouls to the enemy laner, or C.) Use your ghouls to counter jungle. Going into the river does not expend ghouls to a lane, so counter junglingt helps preserve ghouls. Important notes as Jungle Yorick: A.) Yorick can duel a ton of champions with 3-4 ghouls, so try to find the enemy champion when counter jungling if you have good health. B.) Mist Walkers can tank turrets while approaching a lane, so Yorick pull off some very aggressive ganks under the enemy tower. C.) Maiden is strange for Yorick jungle. You can either use it to gank or put early pushing pressure on a lane. It can also be used to Solo some Epic Monsters like Rift Herald and Dragon, so use it wisely.

Now, for Supporick, I am saddened to say it's a lot weaker now. Yorick's W is particularly vulnerable to fast attackers, like an ADC, and his minions really do require last hits to summon. It's a very restrictive play style, but it can work to a degree. Supporick is really the best in the late game since this role most easily allows him to build Split Push items without sacrafising team damage, so Support Yorick is really used for the late game split push pressure without sacrafising potential team damage. Zz'Rot, Banner of Command, and maybe even Ohmwrecker can be rushed here.

Your only way to control your Passive and R is through your E or straight up attacking the target for R I believe so the E cool down is EXTREMELY important for directing ghouls and the Maiden. Don't go into the game thinking the Mist Walkers especially are at your command exactly. Go in thinking of them as a factionless army that really love to eat dat Mist, so you gotta coat the enemy in Mist to direct them around.

Jbels3 votes

Yeah, Riot likes to try their hardest to recycle old abilities into the new kit. Sion's W is a relic of his old kit, and the health stacking bit is as well

Hemulen Magi2 votes

It really goes a long way to make the rework appeal to the existing playerbase. I think they did a pretty nice job making Yorick still feel like Yorick. I am looking forward to trying the Yorick out.

Arakadia2 votes

Your username is so cool.

Hemulen Magi1 votes

Thanks, mate. [zombie-nunu-hearts]

Iplownedyou2 votes

Logged in to say this is a great example of constructive criticism and feedback...

...and surprised to hear support Yorick exists. If only I had more time.

Hemulen Magi1 votes

Thanks. : )

And there is still time to try out Yorick support if you just want to check it out before the rework. It plays like a tank with poke/zoning early on, then his ultimate is similar to Zilean's after 6, but you can also use the ADC clone to help take out turrets/dragons or deal DPS in fights. I personally don't take potions most of the time at the start as Yorick support, because his relic shield + ravenous ghoul already let him out-sustain practically any matchup. His item builds are flexible. You can go pretty much full tank, or you can grab something like Black Cleaver since his ghouls will proc cleave to soften enemies for your adc. You'll need one or two mana items (item 3042 item 3025 item 3110 item 3078 item 3800).

Communist Toast1 votes

I would very easily guess they would prioritize champs over minions in terms of his ult. just like zilean's bombs

Hemulen Magi3 votes

Part of it is that you won't be able to necessarily choose which champion the maiden targets. It would be frustrating if the enemy team has more control over who the maiden targets than Yorick does, since an enemy tank could likely just hit it to make it switch aggro to themselves off of a high priority carry.

VoidStaresBack4 votes

From watching it in action, it appears that the maiden and all ghouls prioritize the target(s) hit by yorick's e, allowing Yorick some control over who they attack.

Hemulen Magi1 votes

Sounds good, but I will need to personally try it out before I can reach a conclusion on whether it feels good to use.

Spoofghoul1 votes

this new ult will be beautiful item 3043item 3071

Wind Whistler1 votes

{quoted}

this new ult will be beautiful item 3043item 3071

That's what Yorick builds anyway, though?

Also, don't mind the name. I want to have all of the fun I can with this champ before he's removed from the game, just like Sion was.

DynamiteGazelle1 votes

I would really like to see the move-speed on q come back. It's such a unique little feature that makes you feel clever for utilizing properly. I don't like that the move-speed buff is on the e now because that means it can't be used outside of battle situations.

Sirsir1 votes

As a primarily Yorick support player

waitwut? Thats so.... genius :|

Jungle will probably be pretty good. Weaker early but transitioning into better after the blue wears off, and he actually brings some control to his ganks with his cage instead of just a slow. Hes guaranteed to be balanced with top in mind. Support is probably going down the drain tho, his only 'supporty' move is his cage, which breaks in TWO hits (number of champs in bot lane FYI). He also needs to last hit to get his ghouls and waiting for Relic charges aint gonna cut it.

Gusdel1 votes

The AI on he new ghouls will follow yorick tell he get near a lane. IF you start raptors get 4 ghouls when you cross over to wolves your ghouls will run down mid. He can solo rift herald easy with ult. You can keep your ult tell you walk into a lane then it just runs down the lane like a item 3512 minion but it will attack champions. Also getting ghouls early in the jungle is really hard the graves are to spread out and the CD on Q is 8 sec. No one wants to spend 24 sec on wolves, blue buff, red buff, or raptors to get 3 graves to get ghouls. His jungle is questionable at best. This is just 1 for the many issue with him jungle.

Sirsir1 votes

No one wants to spend 24 sec on wolves, blue buff, red buff, or raptors to get 3 graves to get ghouls

On the first clear you don't really have a choice in how long you clear camps, and after that your sustain is so good you don't need ghouls every camp. But you aren't Yi, you can't powerclear camps, Yorick is just gonna be a tad slow, but still faster than Nautilus

Blue Team: Starting red buff side, you can easily last hit both krugs and kill a small on the red camp, bam 3 ghouls (that probably won't live through the camp, but still). Last hit the other small and the Red with Q and you have two graves, kill a small in the raptor camp and you get 3 more ghouls to help with the camp. Cross the mid lane, you can last hit each one of those wolves to take blue with, and its not that hard to last hit the entire camp and mow down gromp and the scuttle (or gank a lane with)

Red Team: Starting Blue buff side, last hit gromp, take both smalls first in the blue camp BAM 3 ghouls to take out blue and help with wolves. Then, look it that its the RAPTOR camp Kite it toward red buff, you should get at least 2 graves from the smalls then last hit the big one, and again you can get every ghoul from the buff camp to take krugs or help with a gank

Sightless661 votes

So, I don't really mean to rain on your parade, but Yorick support is getting a lot worse with this rework, and I'm going to tell you from my experience stomping a Yorick support on the PBE (and playing him top lane) why it doesn't work.

I think that his new Q will work quite well with relic shield to allow him to continue to survive in bot lane IF the heal is high and balanced around a long cooldown

It's not. You're expected to spam this ability. Low CD, 25 mana cost, low heal per hit. You're not sustaining shit without using it a lot.

I am thankful that he can generate graves similar to how Thresh generates souls, so that Yorick won't necessarily need to take the CS to use his full kit

Oh yes he will. He gets one natural grave per minute (every 12 cs). Add in one minion kill per minute from using a relic shield stack, and you'll take 2 minutes to gather enough graves to summon 4 zombies. That's just not acceptable. You can't be sitting around just doing nothing and not summoning ghouls.

I'll also note that having more players around makes the zombies much easier to clear. We had a Lucian Sona lane going and we could pop the zombies before they did any real damage. It made that 2 minute CD he was sitting on to summon more very punishing.

He really does have to last hit to get those graves. The Q cd means he's balanced around taking last hits with it to keep the zombie train rolling. It's ungodly important for him. Without them, the only thing you have to fight with is the E, and it's not enough by itself.

The new W looks like it has a lot of potential for supporting,

Kind of, until you start looking the numbers, and how they very specifically make it weak bot lane. It's way too easy to pop when multiple people are around. It starts off with only 2 health, and you have to get it to level 3 before you get another point of health in it (the scaling is 2/2/3/3/4). That's one auto from each enemy botlaner to pop your CC. We broke it in about half a second after it got raised. That's really mediocre.

It's really not a good ability if you're fighting multiple opponents. It really, really wants to be used on a solitary person so you can jump them without anyone else coming by to ruin your fun and free your enemy.

He's going to be primarily a top laner, with maybe a small stint into the jungle. If you play right, you can summon the zombies for the larger camps. Stonewall made a jungle clear video on the PBE to show how it's done. Slow clear, but very well sustained. Still, not really doing anything that someone else can't do better.

an enchanter-class champion, which is important to Yorick's identity in my opinion.

I'm just going to end by saying that you're probably the first person I've ever heard express that opinion. Most people I talked to about him thought of Yorick as a very selfish champion, and played him as such. The ult reviving a teammate was just a weird little anachronism to them. A way of increasing their damage and maybe giving a temporary save to a teammate. Nothing wrong with you having different opinion of course. Just a unique take on a champion.

Hemulen Magi1 votes

Well, you've successfully rained on my parade. Lol... No, really, I do appreciate you gathering information on the new Yorick.

Hopefully, if Yorick's off-roles are struggling as much as you describe, the developer can put some time into some tweaks to resolve that pre-release or during post-release balancing.

Making his jungle role more viable could be as simple as adding guaranteed grave spawning for large neutral monsters.

Improving his support role could be as simple as increasing his passive grave spawning rate and balancing his Q around a big heal on a long cooldown at early levels, and then it could scale into pretty much the current PBE ability lategame.

Adding a flat resistance debuff to enemies inside his W could also help both jungle and support roles.

TerraRising1 votes

He won't work in the jungle. His abilities are geared towards split pushing (at least until he gets nerfed and forgotten again).

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