@Riot Vayne's Buff from a Vayne Main

Elohaven··16 votes·12,804 views

I feel a buff is needed but there's so many ways to go about it and more ways to benefit other ADCs as well as Vayne. However, buffing/nerfing champions individually to the game is more of a finetune as well so I see why.

I also don't mind the buff but there are better ways to buff Vayne from a "fun" standpoint because I understand how pissed people get when they play Vayne. I can't empathize though since Vayne seems pretty easy to me to face but with things like Akali or Rengar - oh man. Now, let's get why this buff is pretty excessive.

While it offers mechanical advantages and Vayne maxes W now, you could have just gave Vayne her Attack Speed grwoth and AD on her Ult back that you removed on Patch 8.1. Since sustain has been nerfed as well, Vayne will do better and remain the same with the same stealth she has now, have a better early/mid, but won't be a monster throughout the game or scale too fast due to Patch 8.11 and sustain nerfs (ignite buffs etc.).

It's simpler to me than making her tumble's CD get cut in half. You make both parties happy - but I'm pretty sure people would still complain at any point if Vayne got a buff.

Thoughts from community?

21 Comments

Dynikus10 votes

everyone I've talked to that also plays vayne agrees with you, myself included. This buff is going to make her less fun to play against than if they just gave her attack speed back.

wolf jade4 votes

If she wont be permabanned

FFrazien4 votes

She needs a rework, period. She is the only marksman champion who never got anything new in kit for 7+ years now. This number buffing will only make her more cancer.

Elohaven4 votes

A complete rework would upset a huge majority of the Vayne playerbase and risks her losing her identity. Vayne's kit is elegancy in simplicity. Her entire kits revolves around her Q and its proactivity.

In League, the universal law is that more proactivity = more agency in the game. People dislike the fact Vayne has so much agency over her fate or theirs. It's also an issue many ADCs face. AAs don't require much proactivity so marksmen have less agency over say a Sion or Cho'gath who can setup/decide fights really well or open a lot more opportunities with their abilities. Vayne's Q gives her so much proactivity but notice it pales to Yasuo's or Malphite's.

Yasuo is also a very proactive champion with his kit but his kit offers too much agency which is what players have a problem with. Removing Vayne's agency will make her lose her identity. She is supposed to be a weak early champion who is demonic or godlike queen late-game where she can dictate the fight just by her existence.

She has not gotten a change to her kit because there is no need. It's so simple but works really well. If Vayne gets changed, then Yasuo has to be changed too because I'm pretty sure the playerbase dislikes his kit more. Vayne's kit is so simple yet proactive and effective that it could be used as a champion base as seen as Kai'Sa but Kai'Sa was a very bad amalgamation of champions.

It's like Riot reworking Aatrox or your favorite champion. People will be genuinely pissed at a champion losing the identity they fell in love with. Vayne could use a VGU and tweaks but in terms of her kit - I say it is a solid design.

2DunksFromHell1 votes

{quoted}

A complete rework would upset a huge majority of the Vayne playerbase and risks her losing her identity. Vayne's kit is elegancy in simplicity. Her entire kits revolves around her Q and its proactivity.

In League, the universal law is that more proactivity = more agency in the game. People dislike the fact Vayne has so much agency over her fate or theirs. It's also an issue many ADCs face. AAs don't require much proactivity so marksmen have less agency over say a Sion or Cho'gath who can setup/decide fights really well or open a lot more opportunities with their abilities. Vayne's Q gives her so much proactivity but notice it pales to Yasuo's or Malphite's.

Yasuo is also a very proactive champion with his kit but his kit offers too much agency which is what players have a problem with. Removing Vayne's agency will make her lose her identity. She is supposed to be a weak early champion who is demonic or godlike queen late-game where she can dictate the fight just by her existence.

She has not gotten a change to her kit because there is no need. It's so simple but works really well. If Vayne gets changed, then Yasuo has to be changed too because I'm pretty sure the playerbase dislikes his kit more. Vayne's kit is so simple yet proactive and effective that it could be used as a champion base as seen as Kai'Sa but Kai'Sa was a very bad amalgamation of champions.

It's like Riot reworking Aatrox or your favorite champion. People will be genuinely pissed at a champion losing the identity they fell in love with. Vayne could use a VGU and tweaks but in terms of her kit - I say it is a solid design.

How many champions got reworked? How many identities were lost? If Riot reworked all time League most popular champion Ezreal that means they will change anyone who they decide, she's bound to get reworked sooner or later.

Shere Khän1 votes

{quoted}

How many champions got reworked? How many identities were lost? If Riot reworked all time League most popular champion Ezreal that means they will change anyone who they decide, she's bound to get reworked sooner or later.

Ez rework is a small rework on his w and nothing else changed really. His kit is basically the same where he stay as a skill shot reliable champ. Vayne is a different story.

2DunksFromHell1 votes

{quoted}

Ez rework is a small rework on his w and nothing else changed really. His kit is basically the same where he stay as a skill shot reliable champ. Vayne is a different story.

It is a different story yes, but I still think she's in a need of rework, I mean I don't mind the champion that much since I've been perma banning her since season 4-5.

Speeedy1 votes

just saying every rework champ is ridiculously strong

Daddy Ants1 votes

{quoted}

She needs a rework, period. She is the only marksman champion who never got anything new in kit for 7+ years now. This number buffing will only make her more cancer.

She isn't going to get reworked.

OneMustFall3 votes

As someone who also plays Vayne, I agree the buff is just excessive. I think Riot could give her a small stat buff back to her ult like make her Attack Damage go 30/40/50 instead and that'd be enough for her. She really doesn't need a lot and I'd rather see her undertuned than have her gutted into oblivion cause she gets overbuffed and everyone freaks out.

His Bonnie2 votes

im a vayne main too, and i think one of the main problems is that many people don't know how to counter her. every single support that takes summoner 14 against me as vayne as uses it as soon as i ult/ come out of stealth generally knows what they're doing. everytime i go up against a vayne i use it to keep vision on her. i do agree that the buff might be bad and i would like them to buff her ult back to 70AD lategame or a W buff. but i figure people are gonna get mad anyways even though the same people will call vayne trash when you pick her in champ select lol

Elohaven1 votes

A W buff would be dangerous with her Guinsoos+Lethal Tempo combo. I would say AD and crit on her Q since her issue is moreso damage to keep up and her ramp-up cadence.

macspam1 votes

theyre trying to make vayne more like yasuo because she requires too much skill

Vlada Cut1 votes

50% tumble reduction on ult cast is plain stupid. Her tumble is already on a 2 second cooldown, if I want to spam tumble every 0m5 seconds then I'd go on-hit with 40% CD. And the least I,want to see now is 40% CD + this buff. That shit is unbalanced from a perspective of another Vayne main.

Support 4 Lyfe1 votes

How about they just revert the R nerf they did a while back?

Daddy Ants1 votes

https://i.gyazo.com/7ba65a2b859a8c4dd279acaeaff28d7d.png

At this point, I'd rather they just revert this and not do this buff.

The things that caused this set of nerfs (Fleet Footwork and Relic Shield) were gutted in the same patch.

2DunksFromHell1 votes

{quoted}

https://i.gyazo.com/7ba65a2b859a8c4dd279acaeaff28d7d.png

At this point, I'd rather they just revert this and not do this buff.

The things that caused this set of nerfs (Fleet Footwork and Relic Shield) were gutted in the same patch.

She's gonna get changed sooner or later, just like every old champ should that doesn't do anything new anymore Vayne Pantheon Tryndamere Riven

King Livid1 votes

As someone who primarily plays juggernauts, (Mordekaiser Darius Nasus Vladimir I despise Vayne. If I could, I would ban her every game but I have to ban my lane counters.

I have no problem with Vaynes mobility, invisibility, or her knock back. But the % hp TRUE DMG pisses me off. Unless I am fed enough to one/two shot her, or the player doesn't know how to play her, it feels like I can't do anything. I get she is a tank buster, but she counters my picks so hard it feels pointless even playing. Unlike Fiora, there isn't any way I can position to avoid her dmg. if she gets close enough to auto me, I die. I have to pray my assassin (if I even have one) can burst her down before she bursts me down.

Until riot changes this I will rejoice everytime I see her banned.

Modl Ryden l1 votes

Everyone's allergic to buying item 2055 when it comes to fighting Vayne.

Maybe it it's to mechanically taxing to press whatever number the damn ward is bound to when she's around?

As far as the buff I think it's really cool. I don't think she will need anymore extra attack speed seeing that more Qs to reset attack timer is just as good, if not better, than getting attack speed as a stat.

Elohaven1 votes

Control wards stopped revealing invisible champions a season ago

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