It's not even that Bard is a bad champion.

Salt Miner 49 Er··74 votes·21,467 views

It's that people who're playing him in solo queue are poor at communicating or working with the team and doing silly stuff like:

  • Leaving their partner unattended for extended periods of time to collect Chimes. No warding, no trying to set up a gank with a jungler, just Chimes.
  • Acting like he's an aggro based support like Leona entirely when he has only one damaging ability outside of his passive.
  • Aimlessly wandering.
  • Pro-actively fucking over their team with his ultimate rather than using it as a setup tool. I'm even guilty of that for ulti'ing Talon in the middle of the enemy team after he popped his.
  • Building Bard like AP Support Sona. You have, again, ONE OFFENSIVE ability. Sona has MULTIPLE and she has lower cooldowns which leads to more Lich Bane procs. Stop it. Right NOW.
  • item 3512 Not building the best item in the game

159 Comments

DWT1234510 votes

they just need to give his chimes more rewards so it feels worth it.

Major Sparkles32 votes

I feel like the chimes are in a good place right now. However, his meeps could possibly use a lower cooldown.

Fried Noob19 votes

I just want his chimes to not decide to spawn really deep in the enemy jungle at the 3 minute mark. It's like Riot WANTS bad Bards to suicide for the chimes

Kitten of Evil38 votes

Chimes spawn too slowly or rewards scale too slowly. This can be shown mathematically. 2 chimes spawn every 50 seconds. Your passive upgrades scale up to 145 chimes (sure, there's an infinite flat scaling after, but let's say 145). So let's say I want to collect 145 chimes as soon as possible (so, not missing a single one). How soon can I do that?

145/2 = 72.5 spawns, let's round it to 73 spawns because spawn #2 and #3 are only one chime each. 73 spawns x 50 seconds = 3650 seconds, which = 60.8 minutes

So to get the full benefit of his passive, you have to play a 61 minute game. I can't remember the last game I played that lasted that long. But let's say you just want to get that 4th meep (95 chimes)... well, that would be 48 spawns and exactly 40 minutes. Still a pretty long game, and that assumes you don't miss a single chime.

Compare this to, say, Cassiopeia's stacking passive. I don't think I've ever seen a Cass struggle to get at least 250 if not 500 stacks by the end of a normal game, and even getting to 250 is a big power spike for her (25% CDR and 5% more bonus AP)

Major Sparkles13 votes

You make a very good mathematical point. Perhaps Riot will give Bard a little tune up later.

qetzel8 votes

I thought the cap was high exactly so that Bard would never reach the cap. Collecting chimes should always be a part of Bard's gameplay.

Think of Thresh - at one point, Thresh's souls had diminishing returns, so late game, Thresh didn't bother collecting them. This is not what Riot wanted, so it was changed.

With Bard, they removed the possibility from the beggining. Sorry for the bad syntax...

junglerboy164 votes

There isn't a cap, 145 is just the last chime count that gives you something other than damage. Bard's Meeps scale infinitely, but up until 145, the Meep attacks don't have their full utility effects like a maximized slow and lowest possible cool down and maximized Meep count.

junglerboy165 votes

Making it spawn every 40 seconds would help a ton because 73x40=2920 seconds=48 minutes and 40 seconds. It is still a long time to get them all, but getting that many actually has a MASSIVE impact on the game, because at that point each Meep has a base damage of over 450 and slows for 80%. It just means he can ramp up to usefulness more quickly early on because they really become impactful at around 70 chimes, which would only take around 25 minutes instead of 30-35 minutes.

Pastramka2 votes

One doesn't have to collect them right away.

he is like: "Oh!! A Chime over at mid! And there are 3 more on the way to there!!" http://www.reallyree.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/how-to-spring-clean-your-makeup-bag-3.gif While his ADC gets pawned. And the turret gets to 2/9 HP.

I don't understand the urge to collect them right away, at the expense of the ADC being pushed behind turret and denied CS - in the best case scenario.

Leaver8 votes

I really like Bard but currently he is a squishy support who needs to be in range to auto attack and to land his incredibly short range Q, he doesn't have the base stats to function well up close to the enemy but he doesn't have the range he needs to sit back at a distance, it feels like Riot has given him the stats of a squishy mage sort of support without the necessary tools for him to do well in that role. Even if you build tank items you will never actually be tanky because you have such poor HP and armor

Kitten of Evil5 votes

Acting like he's an aggro based support like Leona entirely when he has only one damaging ability outside of his passive.

Building Bard like AP Support Sona. You have, again, ONE OFFENSIVE ability. Sona has MULTIPLE and she has lower cooldowns which leads to more Lich Bane procs. Stop it. Right NOW.

If I could like this more than once I would. Lich Bane is such a noob trap item on him.

Tis a nice day3 votes

I still think item 3025 is situationally useful for its slow and a bit of waveclear which Bard sorely lacks.

Oleandervine5 votes

I have some thoughts on Bard. First off, Ancient Coin is a horrible start for him, especially since he can't really utilize the passive while roaming. Starting with item 3303 is better for him early game so he can sustain his income if he gets the chance to roam. If, a little later, you want to bypass the coin and go straight into item 3096, that will do better for him. Following his income item, a mana fixing item is a must. I reccomend item 3165 or item 3222 depending on your needs. Personally, I prefer the book because I think he can do exceptionally well with the poke. Another GREAT item that seems really made for him is item 3285. It has very desirable stats for him in the movement speed boost and the high AP, coupled with the extra damage from proccing the passive with his Meeps or his Q. If you can't afford it (or, alternatively, something to run in tandem), item 3023 can be exceptionally effective for helping to root out opponents while you roam, and, again, providing extra speed and AP with CDR.

Some things to note while playing Bard:

  • Your chimes spawn nearish to you at set intervals. So if you time it right, you can try to be near where you need them to spawn, and hopefully away from the enemy jungle.
  • While the Chimes help Bard immensely, you can be functional with the few you can collect in your bottom half of the jungle and in lane. As the game progresses, you'll eventually get a good supply. What I mean is, it isn't incredibly necessary to run off and collect chimes willy nilly. Bard is still the support and you need to stick really close.
  • For now, most players are ignorant of Bard's abilities. Tell them how to utilize them, especially the health packs.
  • Bard's ultimate has an INCREDIBLE range. If you can time it well, you can ult a mob of enemies from a great distance and give your team time to respond to their advance. This means you can ult the dragon and prevent the enemy from stealing it if your team reacts fast enough.
  • Bard can ult towers. This is incredibly useful when an opponent thinks they're safe. Just ult on the edge of the tower closest to the terrain wall; generally, most players never stand there and you can usually put only the tower in stasis, allowing your ADC to quickly wipe up the enemy.
  • You can ult an area with Bard using the mini map, similar to Jinx' missle, Ashe's enchanted arrow, and Caitlyn's snipe. This saves a lot of time when trying to quickly ult an area in need of stasis.
  • Magical Journey is a great way to keep moving around the map and to escape in a pinch. It is also a wonderful tool for flooding your team into the Dragon/Baron pits to disrupt the enemy's attempt to take them.
  • Magical Journey makes Bard a master baiter. If you can collect your jungle and ADC near your exit, you can often get an enemy to follow you into a trap they can't easily escape.

Anyway, that's all I got for now, and while I do think he needs a few loving touches here and there in regards to his chimes and the order that he gets bonuses for his Meep, as well as a much needed Champion prioritization for his Q, he's a fun champ if you have a competent team and an ADC who understands how you actually support them.

ABlueQuaker5 votes

It's just that he's a Utility-Tank that Riot wants to build and play like a Mage-Support even though he has no meaningful damage or AP Utility Scaling in his kit.

junglerboy165 votes

item 3023 is a godlike item on Bard. It allows him to roam faster, scout with the ghosts (and set up kills with the long range scouting slow), and has a nice little bit of AP. It is usually the only AP item I would consider buying other than maybe a item 3060 if you need siege or lane pushing power. Bard scales hard off of base stats, and gets real damage from meeps and chimes, not so much AP.

Everyone is like "build him AP" or "build him tanky" but really, as bard you want to build every little bit of utility you can scrounge together. Rush sightstone, rush mobis, get enough durability not to explode, and enough AP to give you a little extra damage sustain. Bard is a pure support, and trying to get damage doesn't help him. Above all, move speed and engage/disengage items are excellent on him.

DrathTurtle3144 votes

Bard is awesome, the people who play him need to learn how to support before they learn how to roam though. DO NOT LEAVE LANE UNATTENDED WITHOUT ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF YOUR ROAMING!

While I agree that an aggressive build really is ineffective, I haven't figured out how I want to build him though. any suggestions? and I do occasionally build item 3512 as a luxury item, though more often then that its a item 3060...

Salt Miner 49 Er2 votes

{quoted}

Bard is awesome, the people who play him need to learn how to support before they learn how to roam though. DO NOT LEAVE LANE UNATTENDED WITHOUT ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF YOUR ROAMING!

While I agree that an aggressive build really is ineffective, I haven't figured out how I want to build him though. any suggestions? and I do occasionally build item 3512 as a luxury item, though more often then that its a item 3060...

Most successful builds i've seen are Shurelya's and Sightstone. item 3800 could work too if going full ham.

Only Play Darius6 votes

Wtf is shurelya's?

HeWolf20 votes

Talisman of Ascension.item 3069 .

He called it Shurelya's because this item is the "new" version of an "old" item called Shurelya's Reverie that had a similar active.

JevelFaithful14 votes

That moment where you realise you read Shurelya and didn't notice the "mistake".

I've started to call it Ancient Coin or Shurima instead of Shurelya too.

Auryiel8 votes

NO NEVER I REFUSE!

;-;

krawkaw2 votes

{quoted}

Talisman of Ascension.item 3069 .

He called it Shurelya's because this item is the "new" version of an "old" item called Shurelya's Reverie that had a similar active.

the good old days

Kitten of Evil7 votes

I build him item 3117 item 2049 item 3023 item 3800 core, then item 3190 item 3110 ... though I haven't once been able to afford all six items in a game. The first four I consider core -- Mobi and Sightstone speak for themselves, Righteous Glory like the guy below mentioned, for helping catch fleeing or ulted enemies but also it gives tons of HP... and Twin Shadows is amazing on him because MS, CDR, and its active makes roaming safe.

Tis a nice day6 votes

item 3023 is an amazing item for making sure you're perfectly safe while roaming. Wish I could see more of it in-game.

CharbertoLamonzo2 votes

i havent even played him but this build looks perfect for bard

SpecterVonBaren14 votes

The thing is, if you don't leave lane then you're useless. I'm a support main and I don't leave my ADC unless they're in no danger or they're toxic as hell and I consider Bard trash because he has zero lane presence. He has a conditional, super easy to miss cc, a heal that needs to charge, and an ult that's very conditional in when you can actually use it without screwing someone up. He has no damage, and no tankiness so if the enemy support is anyone that isn't named Soraka then they can just focus down you and/or your ADC and do it easily.

Sorry if this is coming off super aggressive but I have never felt so useless to my ADC when playing any other champion, even when I've tried things like support Nasus or support Trundle I felt more useful.

tempname9527 votes

That 'heal that needs to charge' can be placed pro-actively behind the turret, 3 times, so the ADC can heal themselves, even if you're off roaming. His stun is actually rather easy to use if you know how to position(something anyone silver+ should be able to do somewhat decently), and his magical journey is AMAZING for jungle ganks just after you finish collecting chimes. A good bard will bring the jungler with him through wandering passage just as the enemy laners push up to your tower.

Sammystorm2 votes

I think he is a better jungler.

Kuroi863 votes

item 3069 item 3361 (You can do this or get the vision totem and item 2045 , your call) item 3025 item 3190 item 3800 item 3285 item 3009 Q, Auto becomes insanely good for seige and harass prior to team fights. Bonus shield for team, plenty of move speed to boot.

BADxW0LF2 votes

I have been building a shit ton of movement speed items for him. item 3274 item 2138 item 3285 (yes for the extra damage for wave clear if needed) item 3069 item 3512 item 3800 item 3023

Also run ghost on him for that extra ms instead of flash. i like to ensure that when i need to collecting, i have the highest ms possible.

Asdeft1 votes

{quoted}

Bard is awesome, the people who play him need to learn how to support before they learn how to roam though. DO NOT LEAVE LANE UNATTENDED WITHOUT ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF YOUR ROAMING!

While I agree that an aggressive build really is ineffective, I haven't figured out how I want to build him though. any suggestions? and I do occasionally build item 3512 as a luxury item, though more often then that its a item 3060...

I am still experimenting, but I think tanky is definitely the way to go. I feel like frozen heart is really, really good on him, but I guess it is good on everyone. I have only built the talisman of ascension, but I think the Face of the Mountain may be better. I only play support when I am duo, and I am having fun. I try to rush that 25 chime upgrade on meeps because it is so nice to have the aoe slow, and then I stick closer to my adc and just collect chimes when they freeze or back.

DrathTurtle3141 votes

item 3110 good on everyone? what about Zac Shen Zed DrMundo Mordekaiser Kennen Tryndamere Shyvana Rumble Aatrox? I'm sure there are others, but all of these waste the mana stat if they build frozen heart.

To the point of the original comment, I usually build ancient coin(item 3301) and leave it there, frozen heart is usually my second or third item, and I play him like any other roaming support. I don't roam when I wouldn't normally roam and I usually only collect the chimes from my tri-brush to the entrance to dragon pit and the ones in lane between my tower and the bushes. Doing this I can usually get 10-15 chimes by the time I start roaming.

Asdeft2 votes

{quoted}

item 3110 good on everyone? what about Zac Shen Zed DrMundo Mordekaiser Kennen Tryndamere Shyvana Rumble Aatrox? I'm sure there are others, but all of these waste the mana stat if they build frozen heart.

To the point of the original comment, I usually build ancient coin(item 3301) and leave it there, frozen heart is usually my second or third item, and I play him like any other roaming support. I don't roam when I wouldn't normally roam and I usually only collect the chimes from my tri-brush to the entrance to dragon pit and the ones in lane between my tower and the bushes. Doing this I can usually get 10-15 chimes by the time I start roaming.

Hey man, you know what I meant. It is just a strong item on anyone you who can use it Teemo

Yeah I just collect the nearby chimes whenever I can and only roam when I see a really good opportunity. i know he is meant to be a roaming support, but that doesnt mean to leave your adc in the dust. I think bard could honestly use a couple buffs to him like maybe 10 move speed, some extra durability and q missle speed to make him feel a bit better.

Zone of Endless4 votes

Also it's only the first week of him being released where everyone is learning to play him. Seriously people, save your QQ after a month or two when people can get a grasp of him then. And riot please refrain from buffing/nerfing a champion until after one month as well where we can see how they really perform

ScurvyNave3 votes

How about when you're Karthus in the midst of a team fight and you cast your R and see how low the enemy is..... and then Bard ults you, your team but none of the enemies. Goodbye karthus ult, good bye team fight and game.

I was so pissed I practically Sion ulted my computer into the wall.

Honestly Bard is one of those champs like jarvan whose "helping" is more often a form of hurting.

TonyTonyMordecai3 votes

I'm Bard, I'm Helping!

DarthSpectrum3 votes

He plays like a high risk/high reward champion. On paper, his kit sounds really OP, but atlas in practice, it is more often than not a double edged sword.

In the past few days, I have been killed countless times because of my Bard, or have won games solely because of the Bard on the other team. Just tonight, while the enemy team was traveling through their Bard's portal, I (Jinx) threw a E at the exit and watched as they all helplessly land on the trap. Needless to say, it led to a triple kill for me.

That is not to mention all the ultimate misfires around SR. His ult has just a high chance to back fire as for it to be useful. He is just not a reliable champion and adds unnecessary stress when playing with and against him.

LoRdJeSuS69694203 votes

No damage, no CC, no tankiness.....throw in the ability to harm your own teammates and you have a terrible champion.

Oleandervine4 votes

{quoted}

No damage, no CC, no tankiness.....throw in the ability to harm your own teammates and you have a terrible champion.

No CC? Sure, he doesn't have it in spades like Lulu, Braum, Thresh, or Leona, but he has as much CC as Sona, Karma, Soraka, Zilean, and Annie. His Q slows if it strikes an enemy, and of course stuns if it strikes a second or a wall. Once you collect a mere 5 chimes, his Meeps slow for 25%. It doesn't seem as impactful because people devalue slows that aren't Thresh-Box or Zilean-Time Warps with their insane 99% caps, but a slow is a slow, and I've had games with Bard where I could chain Q, Meep, Exhaust to keep an enemy sluggish so the ADC could stick to them for the kill. The largest problem with Bard right now is the players. He's brand new, he's been out for less than a week, and people do not know how to play him. Sure, I think his chime rewarding and the priority of his Q could use some tweaks, but those are very minor tweaks that are far from the accusations of weakness that everyone keeps throwing at him. The exact same thing happened to Kalista, Gnar, and Azir on release, and they were buffed, only to have them become cancerous to the game until they get clubbed over the head by the nerf bats (which for Kalista, hasn't happened yet). So let's give Bard at least until the next patch to see lots of play and allow the players to get used to him. If people still think he's overly weak, then maybe the buff talks can happen. But right now, it's too soon to pass judgement.

Auz the Ripper3 votes

I'd say the only thing he truly needs would be a little higher AA range. 500 just puts him in far too much danger to use his meeps I'd say 525 would give the best balance of safety and danger

arcinex2 votes

The only times I have enjoyed playing with a Bard so far is him being on the enemy team (freelo4dayz) or playing jungle for my team.

Ultîma2 votes

I honestly believe that people simply haven't gotten used to Bard yet. His kit has some of the most versatile tools in the game, 3 of 4 of which can be used both aggressively and defensively. That's an insane amount of utility in a champion.

Lets not forget the other champions that people accused of being worthless upon release;

Yasuo, Lucian, Aatrox, Xerath Rework

Next thing you know, they make an appearance in a pro game and everyone quickly changes their tune. I've seen some absolutely fantastic Bard plays at gold/platinum level and I have reason to assume he could be even more potent at higher ranks.

Auz the Ripper1 votes

The main difference is all of those champions had/have spathes of damage

Bard does not

Ultîma2 votes

Bard isn't defined by his ability to deal damage - he isn't Annie - nor is he supposed to be.

Thresh was pretty underestimated for at least a month following his release until he was seen constantly in tournament play as well.

People are unreasonably skeptical of new champion releases, and woefully inefficient at playing them on top of it. There's artificial inflation of the win/lose ratio and general efficacy of every single release. Bard just happens to be unintuitive for most players because roaming isn't a requirement for any other character. Given time, someone will find that sweet-spot for his gameplay pattern and he'll be terrifying.

RedTao1 votes

The trick with learning to play Bard is to not play him with the Meta in mind. I put a post of how to play him somewhere here but feel free to send me a message if you want me to give you a run down to how I found the most effective way to play him (In my opinion).

Byesexuality2 votes

I don't even want to play him as a support. I've seen him only played support by other people, and its always terrible to watch because the communication is terrible between and ADC and the Bard. Honestly I've relegated myself to only playing him top lane and insofar as I'm concerned he's a decent champion. I'd rather use him solo lane top, he's got decent sustain with his W and his Chimes, and people just flat out don't know how to react to him at all. Not to mention you can use your R on your laning opponent and set your jungler up for a good gank. I just don't see him being a good support, just because communication is something vital to playing Bard Support. Bard

Meep Man2 votes

Is item 3512 a good item on Bard? I mean, he is allowed to roam and will naturally come to points to place them.

SouL1ess2 votes

ulti'ing Talon in the middle of the enemy team after he popped his.

You fking monster.

Sincerely, Talon main

Anonymousaur2 votes

Bard is super squishy my glob! I suggest building tanky-ish cooldown stuff. Of course mobility boots and sighstones too! But everything else I feel like more health on him and cooldown reduction for that ult.

I'm probably wrong but people are just experimenting builds on him so that's fine. It's good to experiment unless you are building things that obviously don't make sense with him.

Qsario2 votes

Once people realize that you can ult just part of the enemy team and make every fight a 3v5, I think people will change their tune about Bard.

I think he's actually OP in the right hands and trash when people don't know how to use him (i.e. almost everybody right now).

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