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Elise Viable to be Laned? My thoughts on how to Balance her to today's meta.

TheFallenShaw··1 votes·843 views

I've been trying to figure out a good top or mid build for Elise.Elise

Right now as she stands everyone even the pro's like one's from Cloud9, Only really use her for Jug. They also go on to state that late game she becomes a glorified support. Funny I thought she was a classified first as a Mage, with a secondary role as a fighter by Riot themselves.

That being said a mage = Squishy but high damaging spells, and a Fighter = Med damage and Half tank.

Currently she's either squishy with med at best damage, or fully tanky support, Neither of which was what she was meant tobe.

I suggest giving her proper slight buffs to allow her to be what she was designed todo. In the current Meta Elise is what I'd call 3rd teir jug or last teir laner. That even being said I've been trying to figure out a proper Item build designed to maker her right for either. On jug i've fallen short. Lane... not sure yet. My whole problem with Lane Elise is the item's she would need in my personal opion to be able to be used would take perfect cs and still fall short on the gold needed to complete. I think with this set up on items she just might make a decent laner how to get them idk. item 3027 item 3128 item 3089 item 3068 item 3102 and either

item 3111 or item 3047 depending on enemy teams main damage dealers.

Problems with useing this in lane... the cost, which is just shy of 16,000. I say this is a problem bc she needs all her ap items to deal decent damage all of which are costly (9200) + rod of ages requires 10 mins game time to get full power which is needed, and the fact games useally end around 12k on average.

Problems with her being Viable

Low Hp for dueling Low damage output High Mana cost Items needed early cost too much Items needed by mid cost too much 1 cc easy to miss and short stun compared to others. E or Repel range too short Repel requires target to move

Viable Options Her rework: to make her viable...

Increase Hp per level to +90 from +80 (gives a a base hp of 2015 @ level 18) increase base movespeed to 350 from 335 (Will make spider form actually able to catch people like Yi who's base is 355) Incease % damage on both Q's to 10% from 8% (2% increase) Increase scale on ability power of Q to 5% from 3% (2% increase) Increase Skittering Frenzy's heal to 5% from 4% (its just annoying haveing these 3-4%s I me come on round upto 5s and 10s) Increase duration of Coccon's stun at max level to 2.5 from 2 Instead of Increaseing range of Rappel Rework to allow movement before decending upon target

And finally a rework to her ult since it is an ULT. ((Changes in Bold))

Spider Form: Elise deals 10/20/35/50 (+30% Ability Power) bonus Magic Damage per attack and** takes 10% reduced damage** and gains 15 Movement Speed.

Spiderlings: Spiderlings deal 10/20/30/45 (+10% Ability Power) damage and take** 25% reduced damage from multi-target abilities**. Max 2/3/4/5 Spiderlings.

Changed from:

Spider Form: Elise deals 10/20/30/40 (+30% Ability Power) bonus Magic Damage per attack and gains 10 Movement Speed.

Spiderlings: Spiderlings deal 10/20/30/40 (+10% Ability Power) damage and take 20% reduced damage from multi-target abilities. Max 2/3/4/5 Spiderlings.

Mostly all Small Balanced buffs for her to bring her back from the bottom of the Pit to a respectable 1-2 teir Champion, and actually make her more of a Mage and Fighter. As you can see I've put alot of thought into this guys. So please let me know your thoughts about her making a come back in the comments.

PS: to you trolls, Yes I know what the change to Rappel will do, allowing her to pull outstanding ganks, but its no more op than a Shaco, or Nocturn comeing out of no where.

9 Comments

BrutalCabbage1 votes

I'll start by saying your laning build is not going to work, because it's focused on AP and has no magic penetration. Elise scales awfully with AP, and builds Liandry's and Sorcs as her offensive items, if you want a third get void staff. Elise doesn't have the burst for DFG either. Lane Elise is also absurdly toxic and has low counterplay, it's not a thing for a reason.

She's been a dominant pick for so long Riot had to gut her into oblivion both in kit and items. Golem was remade so that it would no longer work on her. It was given a passive that requires the owner to be hit by creeps to work, and Elise has spiderlings to soak up damage so it doesn't proc. It also doesn't give tenacity anymore, which she can't build in other ways because she needs Sorcs to somehow scale into lategame. She is now forced to get Wraith which sucks on her because of garbage ratios.

Season 5 will provide an item similar to the older Golem, which will for sure help, but will increase jungling difficulty and move the focus away from aggressive junglers (Elise being one of those). Our best bet is to wait and see what happens, even though I feel she'll need a minor kit rework.

TheFallenShaw1 votes

I'll start by saying your laning build is not going to work, because it's focused on AP and has no magic penetration. Elise scales awfully with AP, and builds Liandry's and Sorcs as her offensive items, if you want a third get void staff. Elise doesn't have the burst for DFG either. Lane Elise is also absurdly toxic and has low counterplay, it's not a thing for a reason.

She's been a dominant pick for so long Riot had to gut her into oblivion both in kit and items. Golem was remade so that it would no longer work on her. It was given a passive that requires the owner to be hit by creeps to work, and Elise has spiderlings to soak up damage so it doesn't proc. It also doesn't give tenacity anymore, which she can't build in other ways because she needs Sorcs to somehow scale into lategame. She is now forced to get Wraith which sucks on her because of garbage ratios.

Season 5 will provide an item similar to the older Golem, which will for sure help, but will increase jungling difficulty and move the focus away from aggressive junglers (Elise being one of those). Our best bet is to wait and see what happens, even though I feel she'll need a minor kit rework.

Actually the ap aspect is focused on the +3% increase on her Q for every 100 ap a person has. and makeing her tanky to be a fighter.

Basically I figured it would work like this:

416 ap = 12% Q = 8%+(3% per 100 ap)

20% damage to current hp upon useing Q switch to spider Q = 20% of missing hp

DFG gives 120ap + cdr + its passive -15% targets max hp +20% magic damage delt to target for X seconds ( I forget how many)

So I figured combo them together start with Q then W hit DFG switch to spider Q

Figured the only thing in this whole combo affected by magic penatration would be her spider form basic attacks/base damage of Q and W.

AtheosisX1 votes

All those buffs at once would probably make her go from mildly underpowered to massively overpowered. Personally, I think it's best to identify the things that are really holding a champion back, and then to address those things one at a time, rather than trying to buff every perceived weakness all at once. That won't turn out well.

TheFallenShaw1 votes

All those buffs at once would probably make her go from mildly underpowered to massively overpowered. Personally, I think it's best to identify the things that are really holding a champion back, and then to address those things one at a time, rather than trying to buff every perceived weakness all at once. That won't turn out well.

I'm sorry care to explain, I don't understand either of your statements there?

1st mildy under powered... she's put as 3-4th teir in ever teir list even as jug. Meaning there is god teir 1st teir 2nd teir then Maybe her

and 2nd, What exactly would make her OP? most off the buffs are barely noticable. The two main things I could even think u were talking about would be her rappel change and move speed. Her base move speed would still be slower than some champs Yi for example at 355 and Rappel needs reworked it currently is kinda retarded barely goes same distance of a flash and if the target is moving they get out of range by the time the animation is done. If used in an attempt to escape, the range is to small to jump to any jug creeps and enemys will just wait for u where you went up. till you come down. The change to Rappel i proposed would acutally make it useful again, as of currently Q is used by pro's as a gap closer instead of Rappel for reasons stated above. When Q was origionaly meant to be a finishing move. Rappel is currenty nerfed so bad I consider it useless

AtheosisX1 votes

I'm sorry care to explain, I don't understand either of your statements there?

1st mildy under powered... she's put as 3-4th teir in ever teir list even as jug. Meaning there is god teir 1st teir 2nd teir then Maybe her

and 2nd, What exactly would make her OP? most off the buffs are barely noticable. The two main things I could even think u were talking about would be her rappel change and move speed. Her base move speed would still be slower than some champs Yi for example at 355 and Rappel needs reworked it currently is kinda retarded barely goes same distance of a flash and if the target is moving they get out of range by the time the animation is done. If used in an attempt to escape, the range is to small to jump to any jug creeps and enemys will just wait for u where you went up. till you come down. The change to Rappel i proposed would acutally make it useful again, as of currently Q is used by pro's as a gap closer instead of Rappel for reasons stated above. When Q was origionaly meant to be a finishing move. Rappel is currenty nerfed so bad I consider it useless

Her win rate is 49.1% in Diamond currently. That puts her in tier 3 which is generally the mildly underpowered tier. Tier 3 is not Urgot tier. So if you buff her that much you will almost certainly send her skyrocketing past tier 2 and 1 into god tier. It's a heavy-handed approach that is very likely to result in making her overpowered.

Grand Eleven1 votes

I think she's fine being laned as is. she has snares, disengage, solid range, build her more bruiser due to constant potential pressure (haunting and ryalis for a good blend of haelth and mp) and she does fine.

PS: before calling people trolling for not agreeing with your idea, maybe understand what an insane amount of power movement is in this game. There's simply no way you do if you honestly think a champion can be balanced around what is effectively a a target-free stealth.

AloneInTheCrowd1 votes

Lane Elise oneshots , the end of discussion .

TheFallenShaw1 votes

Thanks for reply Atheosis, I still think she could use some slight buffs maybe take out the movespeed, and when I was talking about the Rappel change I did not for example mean that little Circle of hers would move with here just that she could move to one of the edges and decend. Currently that needs a target to do it. On the Movespeed side her spider forms Movespeed is really lack luster 10ms is just not enough. the HP buff i suggested would only add about 180 hp at 18 so I don't see how that would be a big factor by the time level 10 comes around 100 exstra hp is basically offset by items as the game has moved into the mid game phase.

TheFallenShaw1 votes

My main complaint about Elise is that she's a very hard champion to use, even just pick up. Unlike most champions the user must be able to combo 7 skills instead of 4. That fact alone should put her in 1-2 teirs due to the High skill cap with her in my mind. To me basically champions overall strength should be like : Low skill camp = low teir , High skill cap = High teir.

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