Ekko 
will be changed in patch 5.15, the base damage of abilities will be reduced and the AP scaling increased, basically making it so pure tank builds on him will be less effective so you will have to build it with AP (like its supposed to)
Fizz 
has the exact same problem, tanky and AD builds on him are insane, making it so he requires AP will be as effective as the change.
Only Play Darius66 votesDo you not remember Season 4 Fizz where all his scalings were higher than they are now?
Be careful what you wish for.
disregardable3 votesAh yes. The terror of having an enemy Fizz on the opposing team. I remember that.
It is a bit of a different meta though. Who really cares if he dives and kills the ADC a few times?
RetroRage969 votesThe ADC.
Jase1351 votesThe team that owns the ADC
Nekusen14 votes[{quoted}](name=Jelly Mac,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NltjUrUO,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-07-30T19:22:22.915+0000)
Do you not remember Season 4 Fizz where all his scalings were higher than they are now?
Be careful what you wish for.
that can be balanced with how much base dmg is lowered and how much AP scaling increased. but the fact you are required to have AP to do any real damage should be a start, as it is now a tanky build makes him unkillable while still doing very good dmg.
360D3GR3SS8 votesLowering his base damage? what base damage. All of his base damage is terrible already. Ontop of this you will make his already poor laning phase even more poor.
ModAcademy Kayn31 votesWhat an assassin having a poor laning phase that they must work around as a challenge!?!? HERESY!!!!!
GOD FORBID That an assassin has trouble in the laning phase and only make up for it with immense kill pressure.
/kappa
360D3GR3SS10 votesExcept he will get no kill pressure because he has literally no base damage to kill. He will scale well but cannot scale well because he has 0 kill pressure from not getting his items. That makes no sense when I type it because it makes no sense that you would do this to him.
Marinaras Trench2 votesidk, farming gives a lot of gold
Anidan4 votesI'd just say to be careful with it and not strike with reckless abandon. His only skills with decent bases are ult ult and E, everything else is actually fairly low, with Sheen and its items being the main reason Q does any significant damage, while his W only does much of a dot if the enemy's health is low.
And even those abilities don't have too much in the way of bases, 70/120/170/220/270 +75% AP for Playful/Trickster; 200/325/400 + 100% AP for ult. His Q has a base of only 10/25/40/55/70 + (100% AD + 30% AP).
I wouldn't mind a nerf to his base and buff to scalings, but there isn't a whole hell of a lot to take from, to be honest, barring maybe his ult or E.
Jase1351 votesThere's also the percent health damage that comes with his W at "Critical health" which seems to be 50% that he can get you to with and Ult-Q-E combo.
Anidan1 votesThere are not many assassins in this game who won't take that same 50% hp and kill you all the same. Fizz isn't special in that regard.
Chatillon3 votesRIOT NERF FARMING. TOO OP
Jingerbeardman5 votesexplain zed
GhostOfShrimpmas26 voteshe's a ninja with knifes on his wrists
I Main Swain12 votes#zedexplained
Chatillon2 votes:') im so proud
Chaotic Reks2 votesdid someone say heresy?
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/b7/80/a1/b780a19ad70a7125baba4e4e3864b755.jpg
ModAcademy Kayn1 votesI was hoping this could come up again.
LeeDark4 votesHe already has a mostly poor laning phase. And he already has horrible base damage. What are they supposed to nerf, then?
ChaoticPinecone5 votesFizz's base damages arent anything amazing except for his W.
Right now, youre only complaining about AD Bruiser FIzz because its popular. If you increase the AP scaling and make him more effective as an assassin, his AP Assassin build will become popular and then its back to S4, when people complain that he can one-shot you without his shark.
Zenthon Prime8 votesI feel like there's an issue when all viable builds for a champion are complete cancer. It's almost like Fizz's kit is horribly flawed or something....
No but seriously Fizz needs a small rework.
Jase1351 votesFizz has been an issue before AD bruiser was a thing, nobody likes an invincible fish every 7 seconds bursting you down while you cant do anything about it, that's toxic to the opponents.
ChaoticPinecone1 votesnot disagreeing with that. but taking away his base damages and improving his scalings dont help.
Cupkek3 votes[{quoted}](name=Jelly Mac,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NltjUrUO,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-07-30T19:22:22.915+0000)
Do you not remember Season 4 Fizz where all his scalings were higher than they are now?
Be careful what you wish for.
^ This
Honestly, nerfing Fizz' ratios isn't going to make much of a difference. It won't stop the hate, because that's linked to his E. Focus on the Troll Pole.
Jase1351 votesSeconded.
Swollwonder2 votesI can hear the voices again...
Fadedpf19 votesIf you do this to Fizz her Q and E will probably 1 shot people. The real way to nerf Fizz is to up his E cooldown.
Diananmen Square2 votesHe already does that I think.
LatetotheRace2 votesIf you do this to Fizz her Q and E will probably 1 shot people. The real way to nerf Fizz is to up his E cooldown.
Or make his troll poll not effect turret shots
Jase1351 votesAnd not go over walls.,
DrMarshSwamp1 votesAnd not go over walls.,
And not allow him to choose where to land.
Like he already has one leap/jump, why does he get a second one on one ability in addition to a dash on another ability?
yukonl9 votesI rather have Fizz slowly stabbing me to death with a small chance of me escaping than Fizz one-shotting me immediately.
Zair Umbras2 votesAD Fizz against a squishy can actually be a 100-0 instantly in a simple R+Q+AA since the R amplifies EVERYTHING. Including BotRK, TrinityPhreak, etc. It's pretty scary. He's pretty much Jax, except with more burst, but no easy to land AoE CC.
Poske1 votesCompared to ap teemo even that combo does way less burst
Zair Umbras3 votesNot... really. AD Fizz can really 100-0 squishies. Must be a ton of AD Fizz mains in here or something if we're going to deny the fact that AD Fizz is a terror. Not nearly as much after they fixed his W to return the missing health damage to the DoT rather than the burst, but any squishy would be murdered just as fast as an AP Fizz as AD while still being tanky.
Llanite6 votesMeanwhile Irelia blows people faster with just a triforce and x5 tank.
Myrddin4 votesor fizz is fine playable and not meta warping so leave him be
Shikigami4 votesDo you understand what made the old Fizz strong? He had trash early scalings (so people maxed E for it's damage) and used his high AP scaling to carry lategame and one-hit carries. Right now, I think Fizz is in a decent spot. He takes a good while to scale and is easily abuse-able. Lategame, he can't really one shot a carry unless he gets an opportunity to widdle away at them alone for a few seconds (just like any reasonable champion should). He has great mobility, but if people hold onto their cc for when he gapcloses, he's an easy target.
Looks like OP got mashed by a Fizz in soloqueue right? :P
YumaS2Astral1 votesDo you understand what made the old Fizz strong? He had trash early scalings (so people maxed E for it's damage) and used his high AP scaling to carry lategame and one-hit carries. Right now, I think Fizz is in a decent spot. He takes a good while to scale and is easily abuse-able. Lategame, he can't really one shot a carry unless he gets an opportunity to widdle away at them alone for a few seconds (just like any reasonable champion should). He has great mobility, but if people hold onto their cc for when he gapcloses, he's an easy target.
Looks like OP got mashed by a Fizz in soloqueue right? :P
He can't one shot a carry? Lol, Fizz is one of the few assassins who can actually one-shot a carry in less than 3 seconds. He is also one of the very few who can kill tanks (not in 3 seconds, of course)
IDontShareToast2 votesHe can't one shot a carry? Lol, Fizz is one of the few assassins who can actually one-shot a carry in less than 3 seconds. He is also one of the very few who can kill tanks (not in 3 seconds, of course)
He can only one-shot a carry with his ult combo and if the enemy team was smart, they would have their adc in the back while the tank takes the ult. Also, when fizz gets out of his troll pole he's sushi. Trust me. I've played AP Fizz and unless I get fed early I am pretty much useless cus of how squishy I am. AD Tank way better:D.
Jingerbeardman2 votespretty much this. If you know what he can do and actually plan for it in order to prevent it he can be taken out rather quickly. Just because you are unable to anticipate your enemies moves doesnt mean he needs to be nerfed... it means you need to improve yourself and act accordingly based on just who it is your facing.
If you always find yourself losing to a champion in lane you need to analyze what it is YOU are doing wrong and not what they are doing right. Sometimes you can not always win your lane, that is when you ask for HELP from your TEAM. It is a team game, you dont have to go it alone.
Lucifer4 votesYes please. Trin force tanky bruiser fizz is fucking shitty to play against.
LVL 5 PORO3 votesFizz needs a nerf like no one else.
Valhalla Rising3 votesi dislike how much damage comes from fizz ult, also his immortality is stupid.
Hard Penetrator2 votesYa, having 1k ap veigar ult fizzle because of trollpoll is heartbreaking.
Sire Hippington2 votesjust that they do this to his tankiness(shield/ult-heal), so it hits mostly rather gimicjy spots(if you recive the shield, your enemies are usually stunned and don't deal damage anway, ult is on a high cd and situational) and doesn't impact his trades all that much.
If you nerf the damage base values and increase the ratios, you recive a very binary champion that is incredible opressive if ahead, because a lead means more ap means way more damage if the ratios get increased, but totally usless if behind cause less gold means less ap means poor damage with worse basestats. also, low base stats and high scaleings means weaker earlygame, so fizz probably would loose killpresure vs ranged laners and thus get buillied ery hard, which delays his itmes and with that the ap that he desperatly needs...midlane fizz would be pretty dead
what they could do is changeing his ult-debuff from 20% increased damage to 20% increased magic damage
Poske2 votesBut fizz is actually more healthy as a bruiser
AD fizz is more heatly then ap fizz
Maybe riot should push him in that direction
air tiger2 votesJust increase troll pole CD to somewhere around CD of troll pool.
