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When you nerf assassins everywhere, are you gonna look at---

UnbeatablePlayer··12 votes·1,922 views

the adcs who already give assassins who are ment to one shot you trouble? I saw a thread where they said they'd use this as an example: taking time to kill someone from .2 secs to 1 second. Lets use rengar here, full build rengar jumps on a GA caitlyn for example now, he kills her in 3-4 hits. She revives, rengars already been focused down and killed and she wins the fight because rengar couldn't do his job faster. That's nowhere near .2 seconds. Maybe if rengar is stupidly snowballing during 20 minutes or something and just kills her when he has crits within .5 seconds. No assassin that I've seen can come close to killing someone within .2 seconds aside from a snowballed talon, rengar, or annie. I love playing lucian too, but he can obviously weave around a bit and mess up assassins up. Not saying lucian is op (i'm saying cait is; please remove her from game thx), but assassins NEED to kill carries. There are so many tools everywhere to counter an assassins combo and protect the carries it'll be stupid if you nerf assassins to make them not kill adcs, squishy mids, etc fast just because people in low elo get frustrated from fed assassins. I dunno if I said what I wanted to right, writing this at night and I can't bother to correct anything. tl;dr stop nerfing good assassins because low elo plebs get mad after they or their team feed said assassin to reduce "frustration factor" Amumu

37 Comments

Nahui8 votes

It's an assassin rework, not an assassin nerf. The juggernaut rework vastly overpowered juggernauts. The ADC rework vastly overpowered many ADCs. The mage rework vastly overpowered many mages. Based on this trend, can you guess what will happen to many assassins?

They're going to try and figure out how to make certain kits not be feast or famine and play much differently than others. They don't want assassins to just be: Jump on, it dies, you win (Or vice versa), but this does not mean assassins won't still one shot. It just means they'll make the kits more interactive and probably complex which makes sense. Assassins' kits do seem to be the ones that should be the most complex. Instead of champs like Akali or Talon which are literally: Leap on, press buttons, it dies, hope to run away, kits will become more like Zed's and Ekko's that can still jump on a carry, but has aspects that adds complexity that prevents simple kills. Even with the hate on Zed, it's undeniable he's mechanically more complex than any of the other assassins really. Same with Ekko.

Melledoneus5 votes

I think assassins in general are going to be more fun and their self-utility is going to be emphasized the most. Mechanics-wise, assassins like Talon and Akali who lack sufficient counterplay when fed WILL see changes. I fear my favorite AD assassin, however, will end up like Malzahar.

Nahui2 votes

Just expect them to become a lot more slippery and evasive while losing the .5 second dead combo, but moreso drawn out to be like 2 seconds. Most reworks seem to have elongated damage of the champions.

Ralanr2 votes

I think I'm ok with this. As long as they don't start building tanky.

Melledoneus2 votes

I'm fine with assassins being slippery. But I am not fine with them having everything they need given to them on a silver platter.

Assassins are supposed to be fun not because they're freelo, but because they require thought, planning, and feel great when pulled off correctly. It's the idea of a challenge and the feeling of accomplishment when you rise to it.

Ralanr2 votes

Which is why I like playing full AP Ekko.

Fuck tank Ekko.

Melledoneus1 votes

Agreed.

The Yetii Rider1 votes

{quoted}

I think assassins in general are going to be more fun and their self-utility is going to be emphasized the most. Mechanics-wise, assassins like Talon and Akali who lack sufficient counterplay when fed WILL see changes. I fear my favorite AD assassin, however, will end up like Malzahar.

Talons new passive - Cloak of Blood. When Talon gets a kill, he gains 90% damage reduction and immunity to crowd control for 1 second.

TheAce1231 votes

Ryze rework overpowered

UnbeatablePlayer1 votes

Nearly every rioter reply i've seen has talked of frustration and they're clearly catering to the low elo players

Chaos6893 votes

I got downvoted to the game before skyrim when I posted the EXACT SAME THING. But you are SOOOO right.

Melledoneus1 votes

Calm down there, old man. We hear ya.

KONO RUBICK DA2 votes

The assassin's rework is here to makes them unique. Zed and fizz are pretty much the same champ when they are built with an assassin build. A lot of assassins are jump--->kill---->go back and that's all.

the problem is that they're going to do it by adding different utility into each assassin, which means that the tank build will be a problem to abuse this utility, remember Ekko ?

Now on ADC,nothing is planned, they already had their rework.

Leeerzeichen5 votes

No, the problem of assassin ekko is that it takes him too long to kill a carry (because he has a delay on his q, ult and relies on his slow auto attacks to proc his passive) and that he is not reliable enough. And because he needs time to kill someone and has counterplay they gave him teamfight presence with his aoe stun + nuke. This concept clearly hasn't worked, because ekko always had one of the lowest winrates in the game until his tank build got discovered.

Riots goal for the assassin update is to increase the time assassins need to kill someone, add counterplay to their skills and give them teamfight presence. I don't know how this update turns out and I think a few assassins will be broken after the rework, but as soon as they are balanced, they will be problematic again, because I really doubt that their concept works after ekko failed that hard.

If the game stays as it is right now, nobody will need a squishy champion who needs a second to eventually kill the adc. Bruisers and tanks already provide a good teamfight and can kill the enemy adc pretty well, WHILE being tanky and offering very limited counterplay.

Ralanr1 votes

Ekko's autos are pretty slow for someone who has a melee passive and isn't encouraged to build attack speed. His builds are meant to cap on a caster playstyle, but it should try and give him some attack speed for his skirmishes.

He's a skirmisher after all.

LordGeovanni2 votes

his builds are like that because plays refuse to build attack speed there is nothing preventing item 3115 and item 3091 from being viable on ekko but that the majority of players dont want to use it

Ralanr2 votes

Wits end sounds perfect actually.

UnbeatablePlayer1 votes

Yes especially for tankko >:)

Ralanr1 votes

...you shut your mouth.

LordGeovanni1 votes

ive been useing tank ekko since ekko was released but as a support not a top laner or jungler and wits end was in my build because i brought it over from working so well with braum who has a similar passive to ekko and leona who has 4 damage low damage magic damage abilities and passive it makes up for not being able to proc your own passive

LordGeovanni1 votes

wits end is kept as a bad defensive item they dont want to give it good stats to be strong its only really used as a niche for me i dont know other people who use it but once in every 400 games (and thats a season for me) and i only use it on champions who need to auto attack to out put damage and has a majority of magic damage Braum both parts of his passive Leona her skills keep her in melee range and one is attacked to an auto attack so the reset is good Ekko i havent touched support ekko in months but even though they nerfed his passive cooldown its still ridiculously low Chogath used to use it on him before they nerfed it and almost all the tank items with the pre juggernaut update all aimed at sejuani now only ap cho exists which is honestly better for him since ROA a mage item has more hp than most tank items with hp and almost as much ap as the top ap items in the game save death cap and seraphs embrace which they made the top guys Nautilus been useing it on him for years when i bought nautilus and carried him support sad day when riot saw it and nerfed support naut Thresh only on aram ive tried it with a few other characters who it should be good with but it sucks becuase though they should have good surviablty they dont Jax voli has good surviablity but he needs hp to much Volibear Taric worked on pre rework taric doesnt on post rework taric with fixed attack speed and loss of 2 damaging spells which also had utility and massive nerf to his heal. TahmKench so much nerfs on this fish i dont even want to touch him anymore. incase you havent guessed i play fighters and tanky charactes and find ways to give them damage riots been nerfing my play style since the end of season 4 good luck

LordGeovanni

brisers and tanks suffer that they have to reach the adc before they can do any damage losing a majority of their health in the process while some bruisers have mobility enhancement so does the vast majority of adc's have mobility to get out of situations and lifesteal built into their max crit builds that synergyse with each other far to well for how much they are allowed to build for the simple fact that they are safer than most other champions.

MunchCrunchLunch2 votes

i hope damage across the board is reduced. some champions can kill you just as fast as champs with their autos. i mean ad carries. i've been 2 shot by a kayle. died in half a second. and shes a carry

UnbeatablePlayer1 votes

kayle is most broken champ pls nerf

Lady Hammerlock2 votes

Actually the 2 fastest kills I've experienced

is Rengar :0.31 seconds note i was stupidly behind and he was stupidly fed

Leblanc i was playing ADC,I had a Maw of Malmor thinking that would stop her,she saw me and killed me in 0.35 seconds

deadlychuck2 votes

Unfortunately the problem you're highlighting in this probably will not be fixed with the assassin update.

Until riot takes the nerf bat too damage across the board, this will be a problem.

Burst damage gets affected uniquely by power creep. The reason that so many of these assassins had their CC (namely silences) removed in the past, was because as power creep moved along, they became to powerful.

This is why we are in this kind of "tank" meta atm. It's not tank champions that are controlling the meta, it's the champions who can be effective while building defensively. If you notice, average DPS has been increasing over the years, but average HP and HP/lvl isn't.

TheGrot2 votes

If you read the post that Riot asks you to read before posting on balance, they don't make changes because of "low elo plebs".

Akali is SO HOT2 votes

When it comes to Assassins they actually do. Akali has never really had a high winrate in high elo usually breaking about even when she's in a good spot and Riot has constantly nerfed her since season 3 because of low elo QQ. Same for basically every other Assassin

TheGrot1 votes

Did you read my comment, or accidentally reply to me as opposed to the actual post?

Only Play Darius1 votes

If the past class updates are anything to go by, they will be getting buffs not nerfs.

Spoofghoul1 votes

i really hope riot simply removes any %hp damage from them and have REASONABLE BASE DAMAGE so we no longer see this retarder tank assassin bullshit

Saianna1 votes

When ADCs and assassins were in their strongest (about half a year ago) I've seen assassin failing at killing his adc target byt like few % hp.

And then ADC lifestealed on assassin like on some kind of minion. It was so retarded I made a thread about it (thus the reason why i remember it)

Raiiji1 votes

If you play bad and miss a skillshot or something the adc should be able to kill you if he has the power to

it frustrating as the adc the tank who you're suppose to kill doesn't take any significant damage unless you crit 10 times in a row when he also has enough damage to kill you

We all have our frustrations

LordGeovanni1 votes

ad an average attack speed of 2 attacks persecond on a late game adc are tanks only supposed to last 4 seconds this inst even enough time to catch up to an adc useing kiteing tactics they end up faster than tanks doing more damage than tanks and they kills tanks before they can even get 2 rounds of their skills off and that is only 1 adc versus a tank the champion that is supposed to stand in the front of the team and take the brunt of the damage for the enemies 5 team members

Raiiji1 votes

What

Lugg1 votes

{quoted}

No assassin that I've seen can come close to killing someone within .2 seconds aside from a snowballed talon, rengar, or annie.

I can't go a week without seeing it. Assassins snowball so hard that it's unusual not to see it happen.

Oleandervine1 votes

Hate to bust your balls, but those "low elo plebs" will never become high elo opponents if they quit the game. If they quit, high elo suffers because no one is up there to play, so you get saddled with massive queue times and auto fill. So maybe if you pulled your head out of your pants and took a look at things, you'd realize that everything affects everything and that being nasty to lower ELO people just makes your game that much more irritating in the long run.

Edit: I actually don't hate to bust your balls, I enjoyed it.

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