http://orig00.deviantart.net/8502/f/2014/015/0/a/mordekaiser_is_no_longer__1_by_eltonel-d729tog.jpg
Even a distant "Hue!" echoing through the G&B boards would be enough to show us you still monitor the Metal guy.
RiotRiotRepertoir48 votesWe're not ignoring Mordekaiser-related things. Is there a Morde question you'd like to have a conversation about? One thing I've noticed about Morde threads is that they often feel like they're "thanks for screwing us" or "CertainlyT sucks" threads, and it can be hard to have meaningful conversation about anything when that's the tone of the conversation. They just come across as ranty or personal attacks.
That said, I'd be willing to talk about some Morde stuff if we can keep it a conversation. :)
Big Lincoln20 votesWe've been asking for a lot...
I mean, most of this guy's threads aren't insulting CT, they're proposing ways to fix the rework so that he can be strong where people actually want to play him.
like, as much as I resent his base stats being gutted, his shield being so weak, I would be willing to look past that if I could just have my W's DoT back. There's no reason it doesn't when it has a health cost, that you don't even get to use the full spell.
Malicious Metal13 votesThank you for your support. I never wanted these threads to get this out of hand but always tried to suggest potential fixes and spark a discussion rather than bashing Rioters.... Except the other thread. I'm deeply ashamed how that turned out to be. I truly lost face once I abandoned civilized feedback in order to rant on rioters.....
Malicious Metal37 votesGreeting Repertoir, I deeply apologize if you think these kinds of threads are simply Riot bashing in a wicked disguise but I assure you, we Mordekaiser enthusiasts don't harbor any ill will against what has happened to Morde but rather the lack of follow up. That being said, I highly value your response and shall jump right into what I'd like to have answered!
First of all, his notorious Harvester of Sorrow (Great choice for a name btw) and its restriction. It used to be justified with the double damage of a whopping 600 + 1.2 AP but nowadays it's been halved damage wise and I can't get my mind off it not being accessible in SOlo lanes. Heck, I'e been playing a lot of Mordekaiser Top lately and think givving him his AoE would completely fix him without making him stomp every matchup like Darius D:
Secondly I think his passive has been toned down a bit too heavily. I know it was very toxic in conjunction with his endless E harass filling it quickly against minions so how about upping the damage conversion back to 30% while only making it a THIRD against minions. A buff for this iconic ability (Always shield, never die) as well as toning down his lane bully presence.
Metal! Yes, this is more of a visual nitpick but being the Master of Metal comes with certain...Expectations. How about giving his abilities a bit more UMF in terms of VFX. Dig the Q sfx though, really crisp.
All in all I'm positive Mordekaiser could potentially be tweaked in order to please everybody by giving him access to solo laning but opening him up for duo. Heck, who wouldn't love being able to play their main in all the lanes?
But yeah, it all boils down to tweaking his W bit since it inhibits him from being viable solo. His waveclear would be returend to him BUT less of up-front like pre-rework and his bully nature has already been taken care off so I don't see any harm being done giving him his W. It was such a great feeling putting your old Creeping death on you and mentally going all "Bring it on!"
Anyways. I can't express how grateful I, no, WE are for you to have the courage to break the barrier of distrust and ill-will that has been festering in the Metal hearts and tackle the problem :D Much appreciated, If you're attending worlds I hope I'll get to thank you personally given the circumstances.
HUE!
Malicious Metal!
Decrit11 votesAlso adding some more visual hue (hue) to the mace while Q is on. I believe many get crazy about that damage, even tought is telegraphed and not immediate, because can' t manage to understand in which phase is the mace.
Crowe Stalker1 votesMaybe a flavor buff, he laughs if he hits his third Q against a Champion? Singed laughs when he flings...
The Chuckler4 votesSinged NEEDS laugh, laugh is his power, laugh is his LIFE
RiotRiotRepertoir13 votesHi Malicious, I'll try to answer some of this stuff to the best of my ability. I'll preface all of it by saying none of these are promises one way or the other.
First of all, his notorious Harvester of Sorrow (Great choice for a name btw) and its restriction.
I know we did a bit to help this in 5.18 with it being castable solo for the back-end component, but it seems like there's probably just more work to do on that front. I agree that it having no dot while solo feels particularly awful.
Secondly I think his passive has been toned down a bit too heavily.
Is it just that it never fills up enough? Is it specifically it's not very useful for fighting champions while solo? I have to admit I don't personally have a great read on this.
Metal! Yes, this is more of a visual nitpick but being the Master of Metal comes with certain...Expectations. How about giving his abilities a bit more UMF in terms of VFX. Dig the Q sfx though, really crisp.
This won't be what you wanted to hear, but it's probably better than silence, so... I'll just say it's unlikely that the visuals will change much in the current, as the artists that worked on them have other allocated responsibilities and such. Truly sorry if we missed the mark for you and others on the visuals.
who wouldn't love being able to play their main in all the lanes?
I feel for you on this one. It sucks to have something you enjoyed taken away, especially when you didn't ask for it. I think we'd like to do a bit more for the solo-kaisers out there, and now that the dust has mostly settled with Juggernaut post-release as far as balance goes, we can hopefully do more of that.
Big Lincoln4 voteson the topic of the shield;
it having a worse generation makes it a lot harder to generate shield with your Q. also losing W means you lost your means of consistently building it up, and E isn't really able to sustain the shield on its own.
the shield itself is bigger but Mordekaiser is mostly stacking health and movement items, so the shield is honestly a lot more fragile than it used to be pre-rework, where he was mostly going damage with health+resistances.
TerraRising7 votes[{quoted}](name=RiotRepertoir,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MAwZOiOv,comment-id=001900010001,timestamp=2015-09-24T00:27:21.288+0000
This won't be what you wanted to hear, but it's probably better than silence, so... I'll just say it's unlikely that the visuals will change much in the current, as the artists that worked on them have other allocated responsibilities and such. Truly sorry if we missed the mark for you and others on the visuals.
It's not so much that you missed the mark, but that you missed the mark and openly refuse to go back and fix them.
RiotRiotRepertoir29 votesTo me, being open about being incapable of changing them is better than ignoring your questions about this subject because I know you won't like the answer.
TerraRising11 votesTo me, being open about being incapable of changing them is better than ignoring your questions about this subject because I know you won't like the answer.
I'm not going to argue that knowing the answer is better than not.
I am going to argue that Riot shouldn't be doing drastic visual and gameplay changes to a champion, in this case Mordekaiser, without being willing to revise and redo all parts of the work post release. Not only isn't there much "oomph" to the champion's particles, every skin feels the exact same now. It's like telling new players not to spend money on any of Morde's skins because they'll just look and feel like the base one.
But, alas, Riot has put their stamp on the champ's visuals, declaring him "done" except for some tweaks to his solo-lane game.
Sukishoo1 votesPretty sure they just said it's that they're currently incapable of doing more work on the visuals, not that they are unwilling.
TerraRising3 votesPretty sure they just said it's that they're currently incapable of doing more work on the visuals, not that they are unwilling.
I'll quote Repertoir:
This won't be what you wanted to hear, but it's probably better than silence, so... I'll just say it's unlikely that the visuals will change much in the current, as the artists that worked on them have other allocated responsibilities and such.
The artists in question have either moved on to projects they were already working on or were given after they declared Morde "finished."
Either way, the point's been made. Riot's declared Morde "finished" visually and they're almost done with him gameplay wise (if Cassiopeia is any indication of their efforts to make fans of a specific champion happy with their insane changes).
Sukishoo1 votesNo. Again it says "other allocated responsibilities" that in no way says they are ever 100% done with a champion. They just can't move their resources over to him again at this time.
TerraRising3 votesNo. Again it says "other allocated responsibilities" that in no way says they are ever 100% done with a champion. They just can't move their resources over to him again at this time.
When I say "they're finished with Morde," I speak of the immediate future, which is the next 3-6 months. There's always the possibility of an "eventually" when it comes to Riot. Hell, RiotScruffy said on twitter that he thinks Morde needs more work, visually.
Beyond that, we're at an impasse. I still contend that if Riot or ChampUp wanted Morde's visuals improved, they'd have someone on that right now. They don't, so it won't be.
Malicious Metal13 votesWell, it DOES feel really disappointing to cast it unto yourself only to see this little circle of ghastly blue around you that's doing absolutely nothing.^^
As for his shield, most people already pointed it out, it's the issue of not being able to fill it properly and being deceivingly tanky. You see your 800 shield strength but won'r be able to fill it as easily since Morde has lost quite a bit of AoE damage and he won't build as much AP as before, making stacking the shield somewhat difficult. It WAS toxic before though, when one E could fill it to the brim while simultaneously poking your opponent and obliterating minion waves. This bully behavior wasn't really fair and by shifting Champion/Minion rates a bit we could make him really feel like Iron man again without making him return to his unhealthy roots.
No worries about the VFX, Morde's in need of a visual update so I expect you to do a better job the next time you revisit his visuals. A little note saying "MORE METAL" posted at the Visual update team's desk might just be enough :)
Well, there was ONE benefit to allowing Mordekaiser to go duo. My brother mains support so we could always duo bot, making for pretty hilarious games with BardKaiser lanes. It would be really nice to get to play Top and even mid again(I've been playing the new Morde jungle due to his insane W heal as well) since we won't always get to play bot lane and some team comps won't specifically pick an ad mid/top/jungle to compensate for the lack of tower sieging potential.
Still, I tip my Deathcap to you for popping into a Morde thread and discussing the Master of Metal
~M.M
JedenVojak3 votesIs it just that it never fills up enough? Is it specifically it's not very useful for fighting champions while solo? I have to admit I don't personally have a great read on this.
Well, it doesn't ever really fill up, or if it does, it just runs out really quickly even while not being hit. Before, when you were in a lane vs a very long ranged opponent, you could sort of shield off their poke enough that you could maneuver them around in a position for a good Siphon. Right now you can't even really avoid any over their poke, let alone block it with your shield, and you have no real choice but to just take everything to the face.
Raid Boss Morde9 votesWhy did Mordekaiser get so many nerfs to his already low base stats? I'm not sure if any Rioters noticed, but Mordekaiser now has the lowest HP regen in the game, lowest Movement Speed (tied with others, but every other champion who has 325 movement speed has a gapcloser/blink or CC). 113 champions have HIGHER Armor than Mordekaiser now, which makes no sense, because he is made of armor. He's squishy, even though he looks tanky.
Also, he has the 7th lowest Base HP for some reason, and 2nd lowest Attack Speed at level 1. His attack speed was never a problem, no point in nerfing it.
Please just fix some of his base stats, it really doesn't make much sense. Even Vlad has a higher health regen than Mordekaiser, and he has a very strong heal on a low CD, and can make his own health regen higher with a skill.
Decrit5 votesMany other people have stronger points than mine and so i let them speak the most, but there is this thing that bugs me a lot: the W increas on shared xp.
While i agree it is good to have fallback mechanics so morde does not get too much behind, i also think that the passive gain is either unneded or is power budget that could have been spent elsewere, like making more interactive fallback mechanics that maybe help him cover dinamically his weaknesses ( rather than putting a multiplier that works as band-aid) so it feels more fair to use them, or feels more fair when the opponent in duo lane manages to stomp away mordekaiser from the lane with skill and coordinated effort.
I won' t delve on where or how it should be compensated for that, sicne there are many things that can be done, just wanted to share my point on that.
Also, any tought on having his Q affect on a minor extent turrets? Historically ranged adcs are the ones that are required in order to siege towers, but if i have to imagine a melee champion able to take down ( or just heavily damage ) turrets then i think about someone either quick enough to get in and out of the turret and deal bursts of damage, or somebody with a shield that is able to withstand the enemy defenses, drop few but powerful attacks while it has cover fire and then fall back. Mordekaiser should not have this power because is played like an adc with an hard support, actually i would love to see more classes working on with hard supports, but i think it should because of his innate kit ( shield + 3 hit Q with heavy damage regenerating shield on turret ).
Kaeblen11 votesI've been reading a lot of these Morde posts, and the complaints/suggestions seem pretty uniform to me.
It's true that many comments also whine and moan, complain, rant, etc. On behalf of those who have done this at least once, I apologize.
I can't speak for everyone else, but I just want to move past all this anger, and make a champion that everyone can be comfortable with.
Taigongwang9 votesYou have to ignore the bashing that there is in those threads, and read the good feedback posts. Most people want to talk this out and figure out what can be done so that people can have Mordekaiser back in a way they enjoy him.
The 'thanks for screwing us' comes from the fact that this rework was an experiment on a champion that while he didnt have a big player base, he has a player base that LOVED him how he was before. He was a solo lane bruiser mage. Now, I'm not entire sure what he is.
The 'CertainlyT sucks' comes from him blatantly ignoring the feedback from PBE and then trying to put the blame on the PBE testers, as well as him performing this very disliked experiment.
What the players want is someone to open up another talk about WHY they dislike the new Morde, and HOW Riot can fix it. There has been a SEVERE lack of communication on this rework from the start, and people are starting to get fed up with it.
Jaghatai4 votesI think that the sheer amount of "undo this mess" is valid feedback that shouldn't be ignore.
"Thanks for screwing us" is valid feedback.
Rants against losing your main or favorite champ is valid feedback.
And those feedback loops are going to get louder and more angry the more they are ignored. I for one have all but quit the game over Mord being changed like this.
If Mord wasn't Mord, I wouldn't be playing League. So, when Mord was 'killed off' - it ruined the game for me. The champ that got me to stick with LOL and has been my go to. The one champ I always felt like "if I've masted one champ in this game .. it's this one" was completely destroyed... it ruined things for me.
I'll probably start playing more again. But I'll be honest ... I will not play Mord the way he is right now. And any time I see him in my champ select list I have to fight the urge to quit the client and stop playing.
Nuclear Panda7 votesthe guy has like 20 threads of actual, intelligent proposals to mordekaiser and i think MAYBE he has gotten one rioter comment going "k"
luckmallory14 votesHue!
Malicious Metal14 votesHue!
Goodnight Nunu11 votesHue!
Burnt Iron King13 votesHue!
DemaciaClown15 votesHue!
ShadowParker14 votesMalicious Metal, not gonna lie man. I really respect you for constantly making well thought out morde threads. Keep up the good work!
Matezoide13 votesI'll be honest.
I legit quit the game after the Mordekaiser rework went Live.
No regrets so far.
At least i managed to carry a few games as him just before the rework, so i got to enjoy my last moments with him.
Valenten2 votesI mean they didnt nerf him into oblivion they honestly made him to strong and thats the problem they are dealing with now for the most part other than some solo lane troubles. They made his w a self cast but he is perma banned cause people are afraid of him so Riot cant get new data.
Matezoide6 votesThats not it. He is just not fun anymore. He doesnt feel like Mordekaiser.
They completely removed his metal effects. I dont care about his power.
Valenten1 votesI mean he wasnt all that fun in the first place cause of how straightforward his playstyle was. literally poke until I can full combo them and kill them. he still has some metal effects on his W but yea they did take a fair bit of them out.
Matezoide6 votesEh, i had fun as him. Always having to go through the thrill of getting ganked was exciting, and the amazing late-game where i could just face-tank three guys and walk away with a triple through my huge AoE was always amazing.
Not to mention his amazing pushing and watching my Ult slowy kill a target that managed to dash away. He was simple, but i had fun.
The removal of the metal effects just sucks though. He isnt the Master of Metal anymore...they gave him the standard Shadow Isles effects. Yay for spooky green! Because Karthus, Thresh, Hecarim and Kalista werent enough!
Koldheartedjsp11 votesThey can't accept they turned him into an abomination nobody wants to play as or against. It's fucking retarded.
Dreadlocks10 votesThey said all the juggernauts have been toned down but their ban rate is still too high, ultimately not giving them sufficient data to actually see if they need more nerfs or not.
At least thats what Meddler said.
Hue!
Malicious Metal25 votesThat's not the point I'm trying to make. Other Juggernauts that are being discussed for less than Mordekaiser get Red responses and their thoughts on the matter whereas Mordekaiser didn't get ANYTHING. Heck, there wasn't any communication during his rework either while the other Juggernauts got extensive feedback support by their designers. Is this favoritism or is Riot just clueless what to do with Mordekaiser? Because it sure seems like it D: Heck, he was actually a rather conflicted character Identity-wise and would have benefitted greatly from a Thread similar to Taric/Poppy^s where riot took in some player feedback to effectively sketch out what the most defining points of a Champion's theme and identity are.
Hue!
Dreadlocks2 votesFrom what i remember they did say they didnt know what the hell to do with him and so they planned to go crazy with it.. and they did lol
Hue!
Malicious Metal6 votesGoing Crazy is all fine and dandy with new champions but what they did with Mordekaiser should have been preceded with some extensive community involvement! Heck, he might just be the champion whose rework didn't solve any issues of unhealthy design but added even more gimpy mechanics and alienated the player base. And what the hell's wrong with just saying Hi? Or at least Hue! XD
Hue!
Ralanr1 votesThat's pretty much the case. They wanted to experiment in the hopes of trying something new and fun. Whether it worked or not is up for debate (I can already feel people disagree with that) but that's what experiments are for.
Heck that might be why CertainlyT was assigned to the task. His champions are annoying, but no one else can do what they are capable of mechanics wise. Not trying to defend him as a designer, just saying it makes some sense that he was put with Mordekasier...though honestly I don't know if they have a choice in the matter on which champ they get to work with.
Whatever the case may be, he may go back to the drawing board. Only time will tell.
Malicious Metal16 votes
Back to the drawing board!!
Jacknife6 votesThat's pretty much the case. They wanted to experiment in the hopes of trying something new and fun. Whether it worked or not is up for debate (I can already feel people disagree with that) but that's what experiments are for.
Heck that might be why CertainlyT was assigned to the task. His champions are annoying, but no one else can do what they are capable of mechanics wise. Not trying to defend him as a designer, just saying it makes some sense that he was put with Mordekasier...though honestly I don't know if they have a choice in the matter on which champ they get to work with.
Whatever the case may be, he may go back to the drawing board. Only time will tell.
There are better ways to experiment for this game :P what they did to Morde mains was like taking away a child's favorite toy, tossing it into a blender for 3 seconds, and handing it back saying "hope you like playing with that!", all completely unwarranted too. As for CertainlyT working on Morde, you do bring up a good point, he always made really cool stuff. The thing is, compared to all his other champs, you can tell Mordekaiser was half-assed. All the other kits C.T. makes are based around a central theme and expanded from there, to the Nth degree. Morde barely got any of that kind of love to his kit, at best he got a situational dragon. Everything else done to him was basically number changes, with a new feature thrown in here and there, they still basically did the same stuff. He could've done so much more to help him, but due to apathy or time constraints, he half assed it and turned in what he had. The A+ student of innovation turned in an assignment worth a D...
Hue for the Master of Metal 
Malicious Metal7 votesI still believe firmly they simply rushed the rework. Given enough time to truly pin down his character and not try to push it out asap would have been way better than leaving him only a shadow of his former self.
He definitely needs more work done to him, heck, RiotRepertoir said himself he thinks he'll need a sion level relaunch to fix him long-term
Birefringence10 votes[{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MAwZOiOv,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-09-22T20:01:15.340+0000)
http://orig00.deviantart.net/8502/f/2014/015/0/a/mordekaiser_is_no_longer__1_by_eltonel-d729tog.jpg
Even a distant "Hue!" echoing through the G&B boards would be enough to show us you still monitor the Metal guy.
Looks like he is the next Cassio.. :<
Ariel the Cruel4 votes
