There's still time to avoid hotfix-buffing Aatrox

Lil Homie busta··20 votes·10,848 views

Currently in PBE, his Q is one of the clunkiest abilities in the entire game, even when combed with his E (Umbral Dash);

His E active is underwhelming due to how long it takes to recharge and because he can only cast it 2 times when his Q has 3 casts;

His ult is counteractive: In most of cases you'll only use a part of it - if you ult before fighting, as intended, the chance is that it will end before you die or the fight will be over without you dying, which makes the revive quite useless. But if you use it before dying, you'll just die right after reviving and will not use the AD buff. Usually, you'll always lose a part of the ult, making it very counteractive.

Before you hotfix him on release - which can make him OP without actually fixing his problems -, why not making some changes while he's still on PBE? Here's some suggestions:

  • Deathbringer Stance (Passive): Cooldown: from 25 s to [25/20/15]s based on level.

  • The Darkin Blade (Q): [NEW] Cast time is reduced by level.

  • Umbral Dash (E): Charges removed. New Cooldown: [16/15/14/13/12]s (same as Q's); [NEW] If Aatrox hit a enemy champion with the edge of The Darkin Blade, Umbral Dash's remaining cooldown is reduced to [2/1.75/1.5/1.25/1]s; reduce the duration of the AD buff to 1s (currently 1.5s) to balance out this change.

  • World Ender (R): Blood well maximum health capacity reduced from [15~50]% to [15~40]%; [NEW] If Aatrox avoid lethal damage while World Ender is active, he absorbs the blood well's stored health over 6.5s - the double of the time he takes to revive - after the duration ends.

43 Comments

Barcid23 votes

Or. Get this.

Delete his E, make him able to move during his Q at a reduced speed to make him not even need the dash, and then give him an entirely different E.

Marothennan11 votes

would make too much sense

Lil Homie busta2 votes

They probably don't want it to look more similar with darius Q than already is.

edit: why the dislike? care to explain how a mid-range AoE attack that deals more damage and has an additional effect if the edge hits isn't similar to Darius Q?

BeatzBoyFTW3 votes

You mean Riven.

Lil Homie busta1 votes

Both.

But it feels a lot more like Darius's, because of the "move away from the enemy and press Q to hit with the edge" thing.

Automated Riven1 votes

As much as it's three charges. His q is literally the opposite of riven. Rivens is a dash. Aatrox makes you stand still. Riven is purposed to help you stay on top of the enemy. Aatrox wants to be away from the enemy.

To campare the two based on the triple cast is extremely short sighted.

Velzard of Koz1 votes

People compare it because you'd always want to use it with E and then the dash-slash scenario seems rather similar.

Automated Riven1 votes

then people have no idea how to play riven. you dont ever always do anything.

Velzard of Koz1 votes

I meant you want to combine Q with E on Aatrox.

Automated Riven1 votes

oh, ya I suppose.

Velzard of Koz1 votes

But Camille's W doesn't matter?

rayzo1 votes

^^^

Lil Homie busta1 votes

Besides, they want to make a similar pattern with Darius's Q, but instead of maneuvering manually, you do that with another ability, creating a combo-like pattern.

Teridax682 votes

I agree with this. Devoting an entire slot to an ability almost exclusively meant to be used as a band-aid to another ability does not feel like the most efficient kind of design, and simply leaves Aatrox with one ability feeling piddly, and the other feeling dysfunctional. There's a lot more that can be done with Aatrox's theme, a small hop doesn't really get to that.

Khristophoros8 votes

How about just cancel the update because it sucks in every possible way

Lil Homie busta5 votes

Sadly, is too late. Aatrox is dead. Might as well roll with it and adapt but maintain his legacy and old memories.

Khristophoros8 votes

Honestly it's just not acceptable. Riot is ruining him completely. I don't care how much they wasted on this remake. They should can it.

HekaPimp8 votes

Idk why but I really want Aatrox World Ender to deal ap scaling aoe magic damage just like his current Ult.

Nyarlathοtep

No. It sucks to have ratios that you cant use.

CaptainAntiHeroz1 votes

It's for people who like to have fun in A game by one shotting someone as ap jhin or Pantheon.... It's for the sake of choice

Nyarlathοtep

Cool. Nice opinion. In my opinion i find it fun being able to use all of my kit.

LordGeovanni1 votes

If they gave him other ap scaling abilties I would have been okay with that.

DarkinPrime5 votes

OR just dump this shit design and fix the old aatrox.

Z3Sleeper1 votes

I think it's a great design it's just currently very underpowered.

E cooldown is abysmally long and passive is unusable in lane and only usable once, maybe twice in a teamfight.

Tin Obliterates4 votes

They could just let him move during his Q while in his World Ender form.

And maybe increase E's range during World Ender too.

The Yetii Rider4 votes

The way Aatrox's ultimate almost seems like a complete mess of 'when do I activate this?' reminds me of reworked Olaf's Ragnarok.

Ragnarok gives you armor and MR passively, but if you use the active to get the speed boost and charge in, you lose the armor and MR bonus for the duration.

So...you can either try to close the gap while being tanky or rush towards them while ignoring CC. Not to mention, the AD boost you get from it is pretty much useless UNTIL you get on them, at which point the duration is almost up.

And the weirdest part for the opponent is that Olaf becomes harder to kill AFTER his ultimate ends, because that's when he gets that nice armor and MR buff back up. It comes back immediately, rather than waiting until Ragnarok is off cooldown. So...I dunno. The entire ability is strange.

AirKingNeo2 votes

By 2-1s CD on E, I think you mean reset because waiting even 1 second before using your next Q is a long time combo-wise.

Lil Homie busta7 votes

Well, currently he has 3~1s of delay between charges. It would be slowly combo-wise indeed, but i think that's his new juggernaut aspect: slow but brutal combo; so no, not a full reset.

AirKingNeo1 votes

I just want something smoother to play.

Buffing his E during his Q is already difficult and needs a larger window.

Power Cosmic2 votes

He is not that fun so I don't think OP-ness will fix anything

Sewer Side2 votes

C l u n k y

Meme

Sire Hippington2 votes

I think the ad on E should be removed entierly, it's counterintuitive and means you have to aim you're Qs in a way that causes you to need the dash to land them if you want to mac you're damage, wich to feels wrong as it means aiming you're Q right imidiatly gets punished with less damage...That power would be better used elswhere in the kit, like the ult whch does very little in combat and feels pretty meh, you gain that big optic boost and about nothing changes unless you die.

Pika Fox2 votes

Hes only on pbe a few more days, and pbe isnt where they use to test for balance.

Emo Twink1 votes

having cast time reduce with attack speed could be an option too, im not 100% on his builds but maybe itll help w/ ones with attack speed

Z3Sleeper1 votes

None of them use attack speed. He doesn't synergize with it in any way whatsoever other than the bonus AD from ult.

They just need to reduce cast time with level.

Automated Riven1 votes

Literally just allow him to move during q. And then adjust shit after.

Nevrankroaton1 votes

I am getting really mad at people thinking the passive CD should be shortened that much. A full Q rotation with edge remova 4 second for each Q, which mean 12 second. It mean that when the CD is 15s, Aatrox can freaking almost recast it after a full Q rotation. And his passive ISN'T weak. I would only put it at 20 sec, at best, and I am not sure it is the thing I want to overbuff.

Q cast time, I am really not sure, I understand where you come from it will make Aatrox unbearable late if his Q cast too quick, we talking about a spell with a BUMP on the edge and some very good damage.

E is okay, but on your whole post, I kinda like this change the most.

Don't agree on Aatrox R, it is basically punishing player for not finishing him off during his ult so they can kill him later. It also mean he gain MS out of combat, FREE AD and a freaking dive option where it doesn't matter if he dive and if you don't kill him, he heal anyway.

It is way too strong, no way.

Let people play him, wait a little to see how it come with all the balance that will come around and then we will see about buff/nerf.

Z3Sleeper3 votes

Oh man using his passive TWICE?! That's insane!! We can't possibly approve such a blatantly overpowered suggestion.

/s

Aight so his passive is completely useless in lane because you will ALWAYS use it on a minion. There is no control over this, you WILL use it on a minion.

Later in teamfights he will use it all of 1 time. He can potentially use it twice in a teamfight if he somehow manages to hit all 5 enemies with all 3 Q blade hits (basically impossible). So yeah, that's absolutely pathetic.

Nevrankroaton1 votes

Play poppy or Urgot (early level urgot) and you will understand how clueless it sound to whine about a passive going into minion.

You just need to time when you want to make your trade with it, if it is on cd, why not starting the trade and because of your Q bump + E, procing the passive? Why not just also taking into account the fact his passive get 18 sec reduction if you use perfectly your Q/W/E in a rotation? We talking an aatrox lvl 3 here.

I want you to realize that you passive is, at freaking lvl 1, a 8% max health physical damage attack along with an improved grievious wound. Lvl freaking 1. To give you an idea, Urgot passive (which is his main damage option and the thing that make him such a mid game monster) do 40% of his AD along with 2% with 30 sec CD. And urgot whole kit is tuned like this, while aatrox had his Q, an AD steroid, etc.

You can't say it is why, this thing deal 16% of max health at lvl max, 16% for god sake. With a full rotation that goes perfectly, it is 20 sec of reduction, it mean you have a downtime of 5sec that isn't even 5 sec since during these 5 sec, you will have use all of your abilities.

Along with reducing healing AND shield.

Aatrox passive ISN'T weak.

Z3Sleeper2 votes

Poppy: Ranged basic attack. Provides a shield afterwards that you can use to trade with.

Urgot: Ranged basic attack. 6 charges. Extremely short cooldown (2.5s). Max damage: 770% AD +45% maximum health.

You really picked a terrible example with urgot.

8 pErCenT mAX hEaLtH lEVeL 1

Gnar W level 1: 10 +6% maximum health. Ranged and grants massive movement speed.

Go on, tell me more.

Nevrankroaton1 votes

Did you just used Urgot lvl 13 stat on his passive and MAIN damage source which make his kit entirely balanced around it against Aatrox lvl 1 passive coming with a kit that is strong and other variable like the range of Q, the healing from having E, free AD stat, etc?

But again, I am glad you are using Gnar, the monster and terrible design of toplane, about his W passive (which is truly a talk about his passive at all, thank you) when I was using other top laner using their passive.

Anyway, I play aatrox in the PBE, I sure know what I am talking when I say I can proc the passive, do a whole trade and then proc the passive again, it is fact. If you think it is weak, please think so, you won't use him at his full capacity and I will, which will make you say he is weak or riot destroyed him while I will truly be able to see how he can live in the current meta.

Cyka

Z3Sleeper1 votes

Did you just used Urgot lvl 13 stat on his passive and MAIN damage source which make his kit entirely balanced around it against Aatrox lvl 1 passive

You can't say it is why, this thing deal 16% of max health at lvl max, 16% for god sake. With a full rotation that goes perfectly, it is 20 sec of reduction, it mean you have a downtime of 5sec that isn't even 5 sec since during these 5 sec, you will have use all of your abilities.

In response to that silly.

You can't proc passive on the enemy cuz your passive is never up. Idk what dumb opponent you were up against that didn't just wait for you to waste it on a last hit.

Decrit1 votes

That is obviously intentional

They want him to slam harder and slower, so the Q leaves the character not moving. Not everything needs to be flashy, and the power of his Q is that it deals damage in a wide area and each strike brings a CC zone.

The E as it is it's made to make him not as much as immobile to land some stuns easier, but with a price - since it's not using the dash to actively dash to an enemy but to adjust the edge he might put himself in a position less favorable to attack.

So, the E gives a choice with compromise and does so with a 2 charge system so it cannot be applied for everything - especially because the 3rd hit of the blade benefits most of it and if you use it the first two times you don't have it for the 3rd.

Plus this all ties in with his passive, that refreshes slightly with each spell cast and blade hit but in order to do so needs to be used first, then hit the blades later which, at easly strikes, can be easy to dodge unless you dash back, losing ground.

They are all powerful spells, but need to be thought up.

I honestly don't like this kit for the interaction between E and Q, but for whole different reasons than the ones listed here.

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