^. when you nerf her riot. keep that in fucking mind please. if assassins cant assassinate. then vayne shouldn't be able to adc if she wants to be the best assassin in the game.
CerealBoxOfDoom13 votesassassins aren't duelists, there's no reason vayne can't "out duel" them
they should simply be capable of killing her
Astôlfo45 votes"they should simply be capable of killing her"
It'd be great if that was actually possible.
CerealBoxOfDoom4 votesis there some special reason she can't be assassinated?
Astôlfo37 votesYou jump on her. She Condemns you. She autos you 2-3 times with targeted autoattacks. You die.
CerealBoxOfDoom6 votescondemn has a delay condemn has a travel time assassins can overcome a single displacement or need to be able to not that it should even matter
Why is she being given a chance to condemn you? Kill her faster with a less cheesy build or try an actual assassin for once
Vesemir10 votesexcepts assassins do no damage anymore. Vayne would kill new LB before she can burst her because she has to wait to deal max dmg. You dont kill Vayne faster due to her invisibility in every 2 seconds or less.
CerealBoxOfDoom2 votesno, a select few assassins no longer deal fast burst anymore which also isn't entirely true.
Also those that lost their burst are able to close the gap twice now.
Not sure what leblanc's deal is but since were going that route, kass, elise, ahri, and fizz can kill her just fine.
Vesemir4 votesSo its ok to dump some assassins to thrash can and leave the rest? in which universe any of those champs you mention can 1v1 Vayne? Ahri depends on skill shots, you dont hit skill shots easly to stealth high mobility champions. Vayne can get a QSS and move out of Fizz ult if it ever hits her. Vayne can condemn Kassadin the moment he ults and kill him in 3 shots. And wtf is Elise doing on your list. More logical list to kill Vayne is: 
. And Zed needs to be an experienced one.
TheHappyReaperz1 votesFizz ult can't be QSS'd. Elise has hard cc, combined with a gap closer and high burst. If your Kassadin, you can ult away after your condemned, placing you outside her AA range, and then try to assassinate her again, now that condemn is on a cooldown.
Astôlfo8 votesAnd then you realize it doesn't matter when you die in 2-3 autos.
Vesemir4 votesYou know Vayne gets a speed boost in her ult right? Kassadin would die before his ult comes out of cd. And i think you can QSS and walk out of Fizz ult.
TheHappyReaperz1 votesYep, and condemn shoots you away from her. In a theoretical situation, you should have enough time to ult away, without dying. Also, 100% sure you can't QSS Fizz ult. Same with Fiora ult and Zed ult.
Astôlfo4 votesYou can't QSS the shark. You can QSS the slow though, from what I remember.
And congratulations, you just blew all your abilities to achieve nothing.
ShaolinToilet3 votesTypical circle jerk
weeaboomer3 votesYou know Vayne gets a speed boost in her ult right? Kassadin would die before his ult comes out of cd. And i think you can QSS and walk out of Fizz ult.
What season are you stuck in? You can't qss and walk out of fizz ult anymore.
CerealBoxOfDoom1 votesahri also doesn't necessarily care if vayne is stealthed or not.
didn't qss stop working on fizz ult? Either way vayne has to get QSS and fizz can kill her without the ult
elise is just one more who can close the gap. AP elise does exist you know.
experience isn't an excuse, skillshots really aren't an excuse unless its that hard to land on vayne. 99% of the playerbase sucking at a champ is irrelevant, that's their own fault
Vesemir5 votesUmm i main Ahri with mastery 7. Grinded my way to plat in s3 by playing Ahri and Lee only. Ahri does care if she is stealthed or not. Skillshots are hard to land because you have no way of knowing where Vayne is wit her mobility and speed. Elise would get destroyed by Vayne in any possible scenerio. You know QSS exists right? Not just QSS also 
exists aswell as 
. She can get 3 of those if she needs and will kill you when you are struggling to do any damage.
CerealBoxOfDoom1 votesif she has those she isn't going to be dealing the type of damage she needs to be the best at everything gg.
btw its pretty hard to edge at night ahri when she has a lot more control over when she engages you. Vayne has to tumble to stealth, you have an idea of where she is and now she's even revealed by the shimmer isn't she? If she's holding her ult that's just more damage you don't have to worry about her dealing all the time.
If she's stacking MR then you save gold by getting penetration instead of hard damage, good for you
Vesemir5 votesHmm penetration you mean 
and 
and Liandry passive wont be effective because she is a glass cannon. If she builds 
she will nuke you to oblivion. Vayne will do damage no matter what. Her kit is just broken and there are no defensive AP items against AD except Zhonyas. just destroys the champs that require to CC before killing the opponent.
NineTailedMystic2 votesNot to mention Ahri needs vision for W/R to target people.
Astôlfo28 votesYou realize no assassin except Kha and Rengar can kill in under like 2s now? And assassins need to use their mobility to get to the ADC in the first place. Please, stop talking. You're embarrassing yourself.
Ralanr6 votesI mean, a proper Talon ult combo can probably burst her down.
Astôlfo8 votesIf a Vayne let a Talon hit his full combo on her, she is trash at Vayne.
Ralanr6 votesI wasn't aware that Vayne could see invisible people coming.
Astôlfo2 votesHe's not invisible. Q breaks stealth.
Ralanr6 votesSo? If it's a point blank Q it does a lot of damage. Then all the daggers converge.
Q, W, daggers, TLD proc, AA if you got all three procs, and ignite just in case, dead.
Astôlfo6 votesAnd she Condemns you out of the way, Qs out of Rake, and lifesteals back 20-30% health bar even with Ignite. And now you're dead.
Ralanr2 votesThen W and Q while Q is thrown. More likely to get the proc off.
And wtf is she building that gives her that much life back with GW?
Really Vayne's biggest issue is her Q burst build. DPS Vayne gives you more time to react from her reaction.
CerealBoxOfDoom1 votestalon doesn't need full combo to kill her though
Astôlfo6 votesUm, yes, he does.
CerealBoxOfDoom2 votesrengar is not an assassin
but no they aren't the only two champs that can kill vayne that fast.
Astôlfo41 votes"Rengar is not an assassin"
And here is where everyone stops listening to you.
GULAG 4 U4 votes.-.
TheSingularity7 votes^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I giggled when I read his comment XD
First thought was.....
"So rengar, the champion who was popping champions in less than a tenth of a second with 
is not an assassin?"
but no they aren't the only two champs that can kill vayne that fast.
Tell me the others plz. Assuming vayne laggs or is drunk, 
could pop her faster depending on how fast the player mashes their keys. 
could do it, but annie kills everything.
One problem here, sure a certain class eg assassins are required but a tiny pool of select champs, in this case kha, reng, lux and annie.... should never be a prerequisite to deal with a champion.
I have the same issue with 
. But he isn't OP he just DEMANDS a specific pick in order to survive his laning phase (ranged or illaoi).
False 0018 votesExcuse my potty mouth.
HOW DUMB IS THIS BITCH???????
CerealBoxOfDoom2 votesdumb enough to have higher standards when people are bitching about how strong vayne is against actual assassins maybe. But like I said maybe they made a significant change.
False 0018 votesVayne is overpowered. Needs to be nerfed. If you think not then I frankly do not care because either way Riot is planning on nerfing her so fk off.
CerealBoxOfDoom1 votesnerfs don't mean overpowered
I was here first, you came to me, you fuck off.
"It currently looks like Vayne's one of, or the strongest, marksmen right now. That means she's worth looking at. Conclusion might be that we should buff weaker marksmen, adjust items or masteries, or that it's just meta that she's strong and that's appropriate. Looking at her in the first place seems pretty important though.
As a heads up your capslock or shift key seems to be stuck. Makes your words appear angry and less coherent." ~Meddler
he didn't even confirm anything, what are you talking about exactly?
False 0015 votesso many people were asking them to nerf vayne in yesterday's q and a so they came out and said that that was planned for patch 6.24
Cavemantero2 votesYou jump on her. She Condemns you. She autos you 2-3 times with targeted autoattacks. You die.
Yeah...Condemn is broken on Vayne. A ranged poppy or alistar 'push' with a long stun option. Its a real nice ability but its on an adc who's strengths and kit are too good as is.
Just like Ezreal's arcane shift with that stupid low cooldown which is even more broken. Riot still hasn't figured out that these 'fun' abilities aren't fun to play against = broken. No reason anyone should get a free flash built into their kit.
MunchCrunchLunch8 votesthats ridiculous. there is no such class of champions classified as duelists. duelists are champions that are simply bullshit in 1v1s. wheather they break their own class or not. its not a thing. not healthy for the game. I don't see anywhere in riot's official information that "duelists" is a thing. an adc job is to push out dps in team fights. not splitpush and outduel people. AND dps people in team fights. thats not healthy. you cant be best at everything. assassins excel in splitpushing and 1v1s and small skirmishes and they stink in team fights.
you know just about every single duelists in the game sucks in team fights. hell. even one adc known as quinn. is a great duelists. however she sucks in team fights because she doesn't synergise well with building attack speed and dps. however vayne has both burst and dps. thats ridiculous
imagine if Jax was one of the best melee team fighters in the game while being the great duelist that he is. yeah that would be healthy right?. but you know because adcs are in every game we usually don't care if they are bullshit or not because one or multiple adcs at any time in the history of league are completely broken.
TyrekGoldenspear3 votesThe closest class to duelists would be skirmishers.
Noblewind3 votesYeah, she's a little too strong, but Vayne isnt supposed to be easily outdueled late game, she's the hardest single target carry in the entire game. This was never a good idea for basically any champ to try before she was top tier, before assassin changes, etc. And you're right, assassins aren't even duelists, they need to ambush at the right times.
The main issue with all of these assassins VS vayne posts is they speak of these hypothetical 1v1 situations where assassin A uses their combo, and vayne B uses hers, C happens. That's absurdly simplistic for this 5v5 game. You don't balance based on 1v1 for 2 completely different roles. At late points in the game you are with your team, and she is too, there's far more at play than the combos you and vayne can do just to each other.
weeaboomer2 votesVayne's steroids are meant to help her in dueling situations, they seem to ignore that. ADC nerfs, pen nerfs and TANKS becoming more relevant, why wouldn't vayne start looking stronger? I remember similar QQ posts around the cinderhulk era, you know, a meta that benefits a tank buster?
InfernoFøx3 votesVayne isnt a typical adc bud. She is a God tier adc for that reason. Whats the point of playing an ADC if every single one can die by a zed or a leblanc. Her kit is fairly balanced. You just have to understand her strengths and weaknesses. Any fed adc can destroy a not so fed assassin.
Astôlfo23 votesUm. ADCs are supposed to die to assassins. You have no clue what you're talking about.
weeaboomer3 votesUm. ADCs are supposed to die to assassins. You have no clue what you're talking about.
And you're ignoring the fact that vayne's identity is being able to outduel her opponents. That's the point of her steroids.
