How to counter pick Nocturne 101

IP Masquerena·Jul 20, 2018·23 votes·12,246 views

http://prntscr.com/k8sxes

53 Comments

FrozenDeath14Jul 20, 201825 votes

[deleted]

Around999PeopleJul 20, 20183 votes

I should not be laughing as hard as I am

BLIGHTBRINGERJul 20, 20181 votes

###Laughs in Pyke

TekkenPlayerJul 20, 20182 votes

I'm telling you Heimerdinger mid and Rammus jg needs to make a comeback as a necessary evil. The balance is off course for the ongoing onslaught of divers+assassins, so their help would be fine

FlashesJul 20, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=AÏnz Ooal Gown,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LM4YHof7,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-07-20T12:16:56.151+0000)

I'm telling you mid and jg needs to make a comeback as a necessary evil. The balance is off course for the ongoing onslaught of divers+assassins, so their help would be fine

He's being used in bot lane instead

remakoroJul 20, 20182 votes

Sasuga Ainz-sama! [sg-jinx]

Malix FarwinJul 20, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=AÏnz Ooal Gown,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LM4YHof7,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-07-20T12:16:56.151+0000)

I'm telling you mid and jg needs to make a comeback as a necessary evil. The balance is off course for the ongoing onslaught of divers+assassins, so their help would be fine

upvoted because of name

NoPaxtJul 20, 20181 votes

Poppy

TyroneWatermelonJul 20, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Stark of Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LM4YHof7,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-07-20T11:35:31.715+0000)

His ult makes him unstoppable.

remakoroJul 20, 20181 votes

and he also has spellshield... Probably worst way to "counter" him...

Auz the RipperJul 20, 20181 votes

I mean not really, noc's countered by peel and poppy has loads of that; so if the ADC has the slightest intelligence and buys a legitimate defensive item (I realise how big a if this is) so they dont insta-die then poppy can pull him off

remakoroJul 20, 20181 votes

Noc is what? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVgJd-skxhk

And if you wanna peel then there is much better choices than Poppy. Especially considering that her W gonna do nothing to Noc.

Auz the RipperJul 20, 20181 votes

Of course there's better picks against him, but you said she was the worse way to counter him and there are so so much worse picks against him

charge attackJul 20, 20181 votes

There’s a reason he’s 100% pick/ban in competitive.

Auz the RipperJul 20, 20182 votes

Another part of that is that the pros can use the vision denial of his ult to its peak power

Daddy AntsJul 20, 20181 votes

Don't think Blitz app is accurate.

Blitz app says Vayne wins lane vs Jinx.

???????

Arcane Blue BoiJul 20, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Don't think Blitz app is accurate.

Blitz app says Vayne wins lane vs Jinx.

???????

well i think its based on statistics so.. [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

IP MasquerenaJul 21, 20181 votes

Considering it's her only winning lane, with a 0.4%, I am guessing the app just doesn't have enough data on the match-up, and the only data it has is that the Vayne player was slightly ahead of Jinx, hence why.

Also you need to keep in mind that currently almost only Vayne OTPs play her, while Jinx is considered a "pick up and carry" adc, so having a Vayne OTP play vs a 1st time Jinx is indeed in Vayne's favor.

So yes, my guess is that that "pick up and own" mentality people have about Jinx is what gives that advantage to Vayne, as most of the Jinx newbys don't know how to abuse the rockets vs Vayne.

HibekiJul 20, 20181 votes

I like how nocturne was considered unviable, had his items nerfed, and the most minor buffs in the game and now hes opop

AnagsJul 20, 20185 votes

Because they didn't change the jungle, runes, and loads of other stuff. The game changes so fast there is probably OP shit people don't even know about yet.

This isn't surprising at all in league. Hell, it happens all the time.

HibekiJul 20, 20182 votes

Exactly, everything was a complete constant.

No junglers in particular beat the crap out of Nocturne

No picks in particular worked well against him

No picks arose in particular that worked well with him.

He got the ult buffs, saw basically no play outside of experimentation, and only after the NERFS did he start seeing play.

Nobody complained about him EVER until he was played more often. He was the same as he was before, except now people complain about him for no reason.

If a month ago I ask "Do you have a problem with nocturne's performance?" and people answered "No." THAT ANSWER SHOULDNT CHANGE BECAUSE NOTHING HAS BEEN DONE TO HIM OR HIS ENVIRONMENT.

HaIlMonitorJul 21, 20181 votes

This is how I feel. I think it might have to do with the pick play style is so strong right now too.

JMoormannJul 20, 20183 votes

Which is why I feel like people could be a little less harsh to Riot's balancing team. If it takes the entire worldwide community from Bronze to LCK over half a season to find out Ardent Censer is OP, how is Riot's small team supposed to notice?

BijeesnyJul 20, 20181 votes

They should have stuff like this in mind when they're working on changes, especially if changes are massive like runes.

IP MasquerenaJul 21, 20181 votes

But then not all changes are that massive. The ardent changes surely weren't, same for the Banner ones, they weren't massive, and it took the best players months to find out how OP the item is.

And keep in mind that the pro players and high elo ones are looking for every small advantage, regardless how small it is, so if they had trouble finding it, then yes, Riot has an excuse.

HaIlMonitorJul 21, 20181 votes

He has been strong for a while, just people liked to complain about old stuff. Even last season he was really strong into specific match ups, but now he is the best and not just really good.

Z3SleeperJul 20, 20181 votes

He was already on the rise prior to the most recent patches. Nocturne players discovered Lethal Tempo's effectiveness on him and I started seeing him in high diamond because of it about 2-3 months ago.

Now that he got buffed despite his growing success of these players he just went off the rails. I think he's fine now after the hotfix though.

HibekiJul 20, 20181 votes

He wasnt even buffed, apart from 8% AS at level 1, the last few patches have been straight nerfs. The only real buff hes gotten was the ult changes, and the damage portion got reverted.

chipndip1Jul 20, 20181 votes

2 more seconds of globally not being able to see jack shit isn't a minor buff...

HibekiJul 20, 20182 votes

In solo queue it is jack shit. In pro play its relevant because youre disrupting planning and communication.

In solo/duo, the nocturne ult is "Is he ganking me?" and after one second, hes not there, and you say "Oh. hes somewhere else."

And thats it.

The duration is only relevant in pro play.

chipndip1Jul 20, 20182 votes

Except it reduces your ability to use targeted spells for longer and paralyzes your whole team for longer unless they're bronze enough to just walk into enemy champions while they have extremely limited vision.

The utility buff on his ult is massive.

HibekiJul 20, 20181 votes

it really isnt, you back up preparing for a nocturne gank as you woul anyway, see hes not there, then walk back and the ult is over.

chipndip1Jul 20, 20181 votes

...you realize that 6 seconds is longer than you're giving credit for, right?

Crescent DuskJul 20, 20181 votes

{quoted}

...you realize that 6 seconds is longer than you're giving credit for, right?

Better lose a couple CS for 6 seconds than feed. All he virtually is is a diver. He's super squishy in 2v2's unlike some tank JG's and in a 2v2 I'd much rather have a Sejuani or Skarner or even Camille.

Nocturne just happens to be oppressively strong against squishy ADC's and assassins and that's distinctly what people are picking to play in mid and bot. Put a Vladimir or Swain midlane or bot and Nocturne's threat drops by a ton.

KinnikukoJul 21, 20181 votes

Also you saying gank implies that the whole game involves laning

HibekiJul 21, 20181 votes

It basically does, when 80% of the time whoever gets first turret wins it pretty much is basically just the laning that matters.

Nanuk PihoqahiakJul 20, 20181 votes

Only relevant in pro play? I'd argue it causes more chaos in solo queue when you aren't communicating with your team in the first place. At least on a team, you can communicate the extent of what's happening while your friends have their sight obscured.

RainXBladeJul 20, 20181 votes

From what I can recall, Nocturne was untouched throughout season 5 to season 7.

NøctμrneJul 20, 20181 votes

Nocturne is a garbage champion and can br countered very easily, and is in high elo. I really don't get why people have issues against him, not a single nocturne I've played against has ever caught me and killed me, but that may be due to my understanding of him and my knowledge of his weaknesses.

SUPERMOVAAJul 21, 20181 votes

[deleted]

NøctμrneJul 21, 20181 votes

Lol, you're making some assumption's and pointless trash talk without understanding anything. Nocturne is my favorite main champ because of what he's supposed to be. I think he is complete garbage, he has no escape, he has no counterplay and just one shots people who are "out of position. "

I'm hard stuck D5 because of all the terrible players I keep getting that sound as toxic as you seem.

If you don't get how easy it is to counter him with a shield or stopwatch, then that's probably why you keep complaining.

IP MasquerenaJul 22, 20181 votes

This post was about how statistically, Nocturne has no bad match-ups for solo que.

You can first pick him or pick him into anything and he will do good. He's the single jungler who doesn't have a solid counter pick. So no, it's not "easy" to counter him unless he's an absolute bad player who first times him.

Having no bad match-ups and the fact he's not a Nidalee level of complexity either is what makes him strong. He has a 52% avarage winrate across all elos, with 51% avg winrate at D+. So I'm sorry, but the stats show he's not "trash", but the lack of actual counters, easy to learn, safety with his extra movespeed and spellshield, and good numbers make him one of the best junglers currently.

NøctμrneJul 22, 20181 votes

His biggest counter picks are graves and kindred, any ranged jungle who can effecitevely kite someone. Nocturne is typically far too slow to run away or chase them.

I have also vouched on many occasions saying his kit is terrible and unhealthy in this game, but as it stands any needs would make him completely unviable.

His other counterpicks also fall to the other roles, picking Ezreal or kai'sa ADC, picking supports with hard cc or saves like zilean. Anything that can stop him. If his ultimate is stopped or he doesn't pull off a one shot then it's game over for him.

NøctμrneJul 22, 20181 votes

His biggest counter picks are graves and kindred, any ranged jungle who can effecitevely kite someone. Nocturne is typically far too slow to run away or chase them.

I have also vouched on many occasions saying his kit is terrible and unhealthy in this game, but as it stands any needs would make him completely unviable.

No flash no lifeJul 20, 20181 votes

I feel like kindred would be a good pick against him, both for 1v1 or for saving teammates. Need input from kindred players though since I only warwick in jungle.

BLIGHTBRINGERJul 20, 20181 votes