If you want to talk about real champ disparity: Heimerdinger.

ModCaptainMårvelous··1 votes·597 views

Not so much his W, E or R...but his Q. His turrets.

Here are Heimer's turret stats:

150-575 HP (+5-40% AP) per level 12 / 18 / 23 / 29 / 34 (+ 15% AP) shot damage 40 / 60 / 80 / 105 / 130 (+ 55% AP) laser damage 1.75 AS 525 Range 10-80 Armor 25-65 MR 3 unit cap

Now compare Zyra's plants:

4-6 "Hits" per W level 29-114 (+15% AP) damage for both plants 0.6 AS 400 Range for Thornspitter, Melee range for Vine Unlimited cap but realistically around 2-5 are your usual

And Malzahar's voidlings.

3 HP 30 / 35 / 40 / 45 / 50 (+ 40% bonus AD) + 10 / 15 / 20 / 25 / 30 (+ 20% AP) bonus magic damage 0.83 AS Melee range 30 Armor 50 MR

So here's the real question: Why does Heimerdinger, whose kit relies more on setting up turrets, have statistically the most frail units?

Heimerdinger's turrets late-game get absolutely demolished by merely tapping them. God forbid it's a long-range ADC like Caitlyn who can ping them out of existance in one auto-attack or a hardcore AoE mage like Viktor. more importantly, they don't even bring that much more damage to a fight. They'll be demolished before any shots get off because of it.

Meanwhile, Zyra and Malzahar can dump their units out freely and get free hits in. Which is partially why they're so strong and MF is such a viable counter; she can bypass their HP ticks.

Tweak Heimer's turrets. Give his turrets the pip-system the others have or tweak his turrets to actually have strong stats late game. Because these things are pathetic comparative to champions who have the minions as a gimmick.

(PS: I didn't include Yorick because his ghouls are AD-based and are made to be quickly killed.)

6 Comments

fuffychan1 votes

Shaco

SaltyKracka1 votes

Because A: They're actually pretty goddamn tanky. B: They're not time-limited C: Heimer is cancer.

ModCaptainMårvelous1 votes

1.) False. 80 armor is pitiful. That's "standard ADC armor" and terrible MR. Plus they don't have the HP pool. 2.) That's all the more reason they SHOULD be tanky. If you expect a turret to stick, it should be strong enough to stick 3.) Subjective.

Either way, he needs help. Regardless if you like him or not.

SaltyKracka1 votes

A: You're pretending that lategame is all game, and that all champions are Caitlyn. B: By the time turrets aren't tanky, Heimer has 40% CDR and 5 ranks in Q, which means they're up again in no time flat anyways. C: Has literally never been subjective. Heimer's too polarized and polarizing to ever be healthy.

Either way, no.

ModCaptainMårvelous1 votes

1.) Again, wrong. Even early game they have less armor and MR than most minions. They're weak. Period. 2.) He certainly doesn't have 40% CDR at level 1-10 3.) That's not an excuse, at all. He's not as binary as Garen and even binary champions (Annie) see play.

And overall, you're being hypocritical. Zyra is ok to pump out tons of plants and Malzahar can swarm a map but Heimer having occasional objective control isn't fair or balance? Yeah, no, games don't work that way.

Arkale2 votes

Malz minions do more damage, but are melee and have less than half the attack speed... and the target has to have space aids or his ult on them...

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