Boards›Gameplay

As a Taric player...I have to be honest

StoryDuck··7 votes·2,129 views

I love the new upcoming changes coming his way.

Base Mana Regen Per 5 increased from 5 to 8.5. Mana regen growth Per 5 lowered from 1 to 0.8

Starlight's Touch (Q) number & effect changes and number of charges have changed:

  • Mana cost changed from 60/80/100/120/140 to 70/80/90/100/110

  •     Cooldown now 3 seconds (recharge time unchanged)

  •     Max Charges changed from 3 to 1/2/3/4/5 based on ability rank.

  •     Base Heal Per Charge changed from [20/30/40/50/60] to [30].

  •     HP scaling on heal changed from [1.5% bonus health] to [1% maximum health].

  •     Bravado-empowered attacks changed from [reduce recharge time by X seconds] to [Bravado-empowered attacks grant 1 charge of Starlight's Touch]

Dazzle (E):

  • Cooldown changed from 15 at all ranks to 17/16/15/14/13
  •     Magic damage increased from 60/105/150/240 to 100/145/190/235/280

  •     Stun duration changed from 1/1.125/1.25/1.375/1.5 to 1.25 at all ranks

I have to be honest though, this will likely bring him to S tier or busted. He is one of my most frequently player champions and yes he needs some love but this may be too much love. I think the Q changes are great as they really give incentives to max Q after E instead of maxing E then W. I felt this was perfect as you could get some meaningful power out of his healing beyond just using it to proc his passive. I think the healing might be low still but I know it will be a greater heal then before as you can get 2-4 stacks pretty quick where as before it was always just 1 stack.

My concern about his power comes from the E changes. The reduced CD is cool but a 40 damage increase? I play a lot of Taric and he deals SO much damage early. I actually pick him as a counter to Draven because Tarics early damage is so high and however the math works out I always end up killing him before he can kill me or my ADC in those early levels (no snowball for you!). This extra damage is actually a big deal for Taric's early DPS and add on that the stun is longer at level 1 and I think this spells trouble for balance.

Honestly, I would like to see better scaling on Q, not to play passive but to keep his strong early game in check. If they feel he has enough room to have his E damage buffed it really should be spent somewhere else.

35 Comments

Stars Shaper4 votes

Wouldn't be better to level Q directly after level 3?

Levelling E doesn't add much since the stun doesn't scale anymore and I'd rather have more heals than more damage.

StoryDuck1 votes

Actually, the lower CD at higher ranks makes E even more powerful because you will be able to proc it more frequently in teamfights (don't forget how powerful his passive is). Add in the extra damage and it's even crazier and adds more reason for it to be maxed early. His healing is still too weak to justify maxing first and you want the damage in lane.

Stars Shaper2 votes

It sounds fair.

StoryDuck1 votes

Don't get me wrong Taric needs some buffs, but mostly for his mid and late game (ideally with more powerful Q) they are giving a MAJOR buff to his early game though and he was already very strong in the early game.

Big Lincoln1 votes

he's already the best support late game why would he need buffs there

StoryDuck1 votes

Correction, he has one of the most powerful ultimates for late game. His kit as a whole falls off in late game. If you are very skilled with Taric and time his ultimate correctly it is literally game winning in late game. However, he gains no power in his ult per level except for a shorter CD so you could make just as good plays in early/mid. I'm not saying he's useless, far from it as I love to play him, but compared to a lot of other supports their utility scales really well into late game where as his is a bit more static and he loses a lot of power come late unless he has his ultimate. Once his ultimate is down he can often be super punished in late.

AlienPrimate1 votes

I disagree. Taric with a full support build can win duels against fighters. He has a fairly strong AoE heal (assuming 3 charges) that puts windspeaker's blessing and ardent censer on his entire team. He gives his ADC about 50 armor. He has the mana to actually spam spells once late game hits. Taric is an absolute monster of a late game champion and no other supports can even compare to what he brings to the table once he gets his items. Other supports are better than him at other things, but he does everything. He can engage, peel, heal, shield, do damage, get in the enemy's face to fight or fight from off screen with his link, block skill shots to soak up damage, and as you said, he has situationally the best ult in the game.

Skias1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Stars Shaper,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KnEATYg2,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-07-09T14:41:10.080+0000)

Wouldn't be better to level Q directly after level 3?

Levelling E doesn't add much since the stun doesn't scale anymore and I'd rather have more heals than more damage.

Heals are too costly that early and E's damage got buffed. Its E - Q to three points, then W. Max Q the rest of the way at the end for your late game.

Dirty Bastard2 votes

We will be seeing plenty of Taric bans...

StoryDuck1 votes

That's what I'm afraid of. He is one of my favorite champions and certainly one I have mastered. I was playing him before his rework and loved him even more after. I will be very sad if he becomes permabanned.

AlienPrimate2 votes

This also scares me. Outside of about 10 games that I didn't get support, I haven't played anyone but Taric in ranked. I think he is already strong when you know what you are doing. They are just making him stronger for people like me who already get an S in almost every game using him while opening the door for the "Taric mains" to come out.

StoryDuck1 votes

With these changes I'll be queing Taric every game :) I also always get those A and S grades with him, even when I lose game. It's just so easy for others to forget he deals so much damage with his Auto attacks.

AlienPrimate1 votes

This should make you smile as a Taric player.

http://i.imgur.com/wvuMdo5.png

AlienPrimate1 votes

Another thing I was thinking is that his jungle viability will sky rocket. I already use him in the jungle as you can see in the picture I linked. The Q change will dramatically increase his early clear speed. Just get a Tiamat and all the camps will cower before your passive.

Skias3 votes

{quoted}

That's what I'm afraid of. He is one of my favorite champions and certainly one I have mastered. I was playing him before his rework and loved him even more after. I will be very sad if he becomes permabanned.

I don't think you have anything to be worried about. I'm a mastery 7 taric main and champs like Vayne etc still dodge the piss out of your highly telegraphed E. If Taric became meta, there are definite counters in game to him. Cait also makes his lane a nightmare.

StoryDuck1 votes

Vayne is pretty weak in laning at early, any ADC with semi-decent range can poke her out and it's never too hard to stun them right after they tumble to get that extra creep (I get them all the time with that). Cait can be hard but only if you let her poke you down, you really need to harass her and try to force an all in before you get too low. That said, you can endure a bit as long as you are not paired with some super short range ADC like Vayne, Sivir, or Kog.

Skias1 votes

{quoted}

Vayne is pretty weak in laning at early, any ADC with semi-decent range can poke her out and it's never too hard to stun them right after they tumble to get that extra creep (I get them all the time with that). Cait can be hard but only if you let her poke you down, you really need to harass her and try to force an all in before you get too low. That said, you can endure a bit as long as you are not paired with some super short range ADC like Vayne, Sivir, or Kog.

I'm rarely able to land stuns on plat Vaynes in lane. Most are smart enough yo sit on their tumble.

Naching2 votes

Now you maybe heal more fast... But much less than before..

I dont see the buff..he loses stun duration, he loses heal,Q mana cost more, passive CD reduction deleted ...

A troll passive only working for 1 abilitie... Pathetic..they will put that as a Q's passive instead of this nerf to all his kit.

Taric heals worse than before, you will need max E first because the CD.

StoryDuck1 votes

You always max E and you will heal more with Q because you will get 2-4 stacks of healing rather then 1 stack of healing. I Garentee that you will heal more in team-battles then you did before. The Q changes are a mid game/late game buff (although I'd probably only take it to rank 4). The late game duration of stun is lower yes but the early game is higher. My concern is about his early game power. He was already REALLY strong in the early game and dealing 100 damage with a 1.25 second AoE stun is likely too much.

I do agreee his heal is still poor. Which is why I feel that if Riot feels he can have 40 more damage that they take that power budget and add it to his heal value in late game perhaps a greater max health% healing.

Naching1 votes

Now for heal you need first max Q 5 ranks to heal 5 stacks, total: 150 heal

Before: 3 stacks: 180 heal rank 5

And you wil lose stun spam because you need up the Q 3 ranks to dont lose the passive bravado stacks and 2 to do equal the old taric heal at level 1, because if you dont do this, he is worse healing... Ahh but then you are worst with your E.

Now need to choose the way we are going to be worse.

StoryDuck1 votes

Alright, I get what you are saying but stay with me.

Before, you would heal for 180 +4.5% health (if maxed)

now you heal for 150 +5% health (if maxed)

The big change is in how quickly you build stacks.

Before you would heal for 180 +4.5% health then you would heal for 60 +1.5% health after every 4 passive empowered auto attacks (you always ended up short of 2 stacks, which always drove me nuts).

Now you will heal for 150 +5% health then 120 +4% health after every 4 passive empowered auto attacks.

Taric is all about enduring and lasting in a fight so the longer the fight the greater the healing he provided. Now that prolonged healing is much better. I think it is still a bit on the weak side but this is certainly better then before.

AlienPrimate1 votes

The buff is that at max charges on his Q, he will heal for 5% of his total health and not 4.5% of his bonus health. The heal scaling will go from ~65 to ~150. For E, I am planning on putting 3 points in it to reduce the cooldown to 15 which allows for permaspam of his passive and then max Q. Q mana cost is 30 less, not more. His passive still reduces the cooldown of all of his abilities and it still takes exactly 8 hits from it to lower his W and E cooldown enough to permanently spam provided his E is at least level 3. If you combo correctly, you should have at least 3 charges every time you use Q which is still 180 health + healing bonuses making it about 230 health every 2 seconds.

StoryDuck1 votes

Wooh, I missed that they were changing the health from bonus to total....that's actually a huge buff.

AlienPrimate1 votes

My guess is that it will likely get changed back to bonus after a couple patches. Healing for 200-300 every couple of seconds is almost Soraka levels of heal and it is AoE.

StoryDuck1 votes

Indeed, it's quite the buff to his healing. Now I can make the ADC a tank and heal them for Soraka amounts of health :) not busted at all.

Nymzo2 votes

A lot of people don't actually know this but Taric is the best support for teamfighting.

His ult alone is very strong if used correctly and if the enemy doesn't have enough disengage, they will lost the fight.

Not to mention the 2 ways stun and heals.

Buffing him will probably make him too strong, he's just a niche pick right now.

StoryDuck1 votes

That's what I'm afraid of. He will have a super strong early/mid and late. I get that he is the juggernaut of the supports and he should be punishing if you let him get into melee with you but damn! 100 damage + 1.25 sec stun at level 1? That's crazy power for early game. I love that they are making his heal an impactful ability but that with the extra stun damage seems a bit much.

Yaskamasandwich2 votes

We'll have to wait and see but I think these buffs are aiming to make him a late game support. Which he was always suppose to be with him gaining more from armor to buff another. This might not be as scary since he's forced to level up either E or Q first and usually has to level up E. It also should help his q heal more and promotes him to use bravado more. Especially with the snowball meta he may be kept in line with this change.

StoryDuck1 votes

Yeah, with the changes I'm goign to be playign around a lot with his leveling path to see the impact. Going from %bonus health to %total health is a big change for his Q and that early 1 rank into E is so powerful it might be all he needs.

Liquid Poro 2 votes

My only concern about taric is his ability with mana is way too high wasting so much mana.

StoryDuck1 votes

The high mana costs are to keep him out of the jungle or top lane. If you lowered the costs he would be in top and jungle a lot and Riot hates any support that can function outside of the support role. They go WAY out of their way to prevent supports being viable in other roles.

Skias1 votes

{quoted}

The high mana costs are to keep him out of the jungle or top lane. If you lowered the costs he would be in top and jungle a lot and Riot hates any support that can function outside of the support role. They go WAY out of their way to prevent supports being viable in other roles.

I still jungle and top. He's totally viable

Liquid Poro 1 votes

I understood about it sir.

Menkhor1 votes

Taric buffs. lol

Riot really has their priorities straight..

[slayer-jinx-unamused]

SuperGeon1 votes

Load him up in practice tool. Buy a sheen and a stinger. This will make him more viable top lane. You'll be able to get off so many more bravado auto attacks. The bravado auto attacks bring your Q back from CD after the second attack lands, it's less about the heal, and more about weaving those autos.

Combo #1

Auto > Q > Passive AAx2 > E > Passive AAx2. chunked

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by StoryDuck

Riposte
Memes & Games45 comments
137
votes
Assassins should be renamed to Escapists
Gameplay126 comments
127
votes
Why support mains are disagreeing and why the support role is suffering
Gameplay208 comments
107
votes
PSA: If your 6 kills to 26 deaths and 8 towers down 20 minutes in it time to give up.
Gameplay147 comments
107
votes
What really happened with Maokai's Rework
Memes & Games46 comments
106
votes
ADC meta is the worst it has EVER been in the history of this game
Gameplay161 comments
85
votes