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Need Help Learning To Jungle, Please

Xonra··2 votes·578 views

Trying to pick up the next closest role to support, as I've mained it for a while. Just can't handle adcs anymore diving in and dying, then flaming me, having no idea how the matchup let alone their own champ works, and refusing to drop a single ward while flaming for half an hour about wards with 4 on the map already.

At least as Jungle I can get yelled while not having to babysit an entitled adc.

Soooo, with that out of the way, any suggestions are helpful. I am open to champ suggestions, build suggestions, people to watch, you name it. I just want to learn and I'm willing to take anything ya got :)

I will have to change my play style a bit I'm sure as outside of Nautilus, I play a lot of Morg and the like. I like playing CC champs as I'm not much for being the "Carry". I prefer to facilitate the kills with champs like Ori in mid, Renekton or Maokai top, and only adc I really play is Ashe.

Hope that helps.

16 Comments

RogueWill3 votes

Main jungler here, been playing since season 2 and peaked at plat last season.

  • The first thing you need to know is clear times, basically on the jungle you gotta be able to deduce what is the clearing times of you match up so you can predict what their moves woudl be and react properly. Get a game with every common jungler that your own and it should give you an idea for who is good at farming and who isn't so you can see who will prefer ganks over staying on the jungler completely. On the same topic as match ups you also want to figure out who have strong early game and would prone to invade and who champions have ridiculous bad early game and are easy to invade.

Nautilus for example has really fast clearing if he has blue but really slow otherwise, he will stay almost full HP inside the jungle but will have trouble moving it around it, he is a good defender of invades but lacks the tools for pulling invades himself. So against Naut you want to steal his camps when he is not around, abusing his low MS to outrotate him. If he goes for invades make sure your team is either close or stalling the enemy laners since you will most likely win a 1v1 but will lose any 2v2 and further. Wukong as a second example, also has fast clearings which becomes much faster if blue is available, he will struggle on the first clear thou. He will stay around half HP inside the jungle, he is moderate good at invading and moderate good at defending. Due to his bad sustain and mana pool he will lean on heavy ganking style or heavy counterjungling over farming or controlling style.

  • Second thing you need is risk managment, this is the jungler most important thing. Decide something and stick your guns to it. Decide what to trade and when to trade it so you can set the flow of the game and won't have to be reacting to it. Unfortunately this come with experience so you will ahve to develop it for yourself.

  • Third. Play to your strengths, no to your weakness. After you pick a champion make sure you know what he excels at and what he does mediocrity and try to pull the balance towards your strengths despise what your teammates tells you. When I play jungle all the time I hear that the enemy jungler has ganked "x" so many times more than me, or that he has "x" more drakes or simply that he is some high KDA while I'm still 0/0/0 and to some extent that is ok. You want to help your teammates as much as you can but you gotta accept that there are some things that some champions are better than others and trying to play their game is setting yourself up for failure. For example if you are against a xin and you are playign Rammus you know for sure he is going to give more map pressure than you, his CD are shorter than yours, his clearing are faster than yours and his sustain in the jungle is better than you so trying to gank as many lanes as xin will let you on a disadvantage since those are xin strengths not rammus. Rammus want to go for a late game/mid game teamfigths. he wants 2v2, 3v3 and such figths and he wants to transcicion towards that game as soon as possible so he will go for towers intead of dragons (which he takes forever to kill) also will go for sure ganks and not any gank since his time needs to be balanced with farming but his Q lets him cover great ammount of distances fairly quickly.

Xonra1 votes

"you gotta be able to deduce what is the clearing times of you match up so you can predict what their moves woudl be and react properly"

This is probably going to take me a while. I've played for a while, but not in the jungle, so while I know matchups as far as laning and team fighting, I don't know them well, and in some cases at all as far as clear speed. I can assume in some cases, like of course Shyv is gonna clear faster than Sejuani, but speeds, and so on are probably going to be a while for me to learn.

Thankfully I'm used to seeing who ganks a bit earlier (like a Xin Xhao) and who really likes to farm their butts off (this one can vary from person to person I've noticed. Some Yi's won't gank till forever, and some I see jumping me after their first buff).

What's your thoughts on trying to focus on junglers that are less blue reliant, and passing off first blue to mid? (like Rek'Sai for example)

Is it best to still give second just for the sake of XP?

RogueWill1 votes

{quoted}

"you gotta be able to deduce what is the clearing times of you match up so you can predict what their moves woudl be and react properly"

This is probably going to take me a while. I've played for a while, but not in the jungle, so while I know matchups as far as laning and team fighting, I don't know them well, and in some cases at all as far as clear speed. I can assume in some cases, like of course Shyv is gonna clear faster than Sejuani, but speeds, and so on are probably going to be a while for me to learn.

Thankfully I'm used to seeing who ganks a bit earlier (like a Xin Xhao) and who really likes to farm their butts off (this one can vary from person to person I've noticed. Some Yi's won't gank till forever, and some I see jumping me after their first buff).

What's your thoughts on trying to focus on junglers that are less blue reliant, and passing off first blue to mid? (like Rek'Sai for example)

Is it best to still give second just for the sake of XP?

The only reason I would give my first blue is that I stole a buff on the other side and thus I don't need the XP. XP is far too valuable early game to give the first blue

Cubíx1 votes

So I'm kinda the opposite where I main jungle and then made support my secondary for a while, I think the two roles are very similar. CC champs are very good for jungling so you're in luck. Although he isn't the best in the jungle nautilus wouldn't be a bad place to start. Other's could consist of sion, zac, sejuani (all tanky engage junglers).

I play more of assassins like kha'zix or ekko, though I do enjoy shen and sion. I also thinks its good to learn to use trackers knife (the warding one) since you already support you know warding is always helpful.

Also starting out as tanks its best to go with item 1039 and 3 health potions, because that gives you pretty good early sustain and allows you to gank effectively at level three.

Xonra1 votes

{quoted}

So I'm kinda the opposite where I main jungle and then made support my secondary for a while, I think the two roles are very similar. CC champs are very good for jungling so you're in luck. Although he isn't the best in the jungle nautilus wouldn't be a bad place to start. Other's could consist of sion, zac, sejuani (all tanky engage junglers).

I play more of assassins like kha'zix or ekko, though I do enjoy shen and sion. I also thinks its good to learn to use trackers knife (the warding one) since you already support you know warding is always helpful.

Also starting out as tanks its best to go with item 1039 and 3 health potions, because that gives you pretty good early sustain and allows you to gank effectively at level three.

Good advice, and a good place to start. Thank you.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

I left some general tips below, so hopefully those will help you out.

If you are looking for CC champions to facilitate kills, I'd recommend trying some of the following: Gragas Sejuani Zac JarvanIV Rammus RekSai

I would suggest watching videos by high-ELO and/or professional junglers (i.e. Nightblue3, Stonewall008, Valkyrin, and foxdropLOL). They will typically provide a lot of useful tips while playing and you can often see or hear their decision process and some optimizations throughout the game.

Off the top of my head, some basic optimizations may be:

  • Use hard-CC when the monster camps are about to attack you to cancel that attack and delay their next.
  • Each of the smite buffs are quite useful in different situations. Be sure to take proper advantage of them.
    • Raptor's buff is great for ganking
    • Gromp buff provides extra damage during clears and fights, especially for champions with a lot of health
    • Krug's buff reduces the damage you take while clearing and lets champions without CC kill Scuttle Crab faster
    • Wolf buff is useful when you are being counter-jungled or invaded (or after your initial towers have fallen).
  • If you have a weak early clear, Krugs -> Raptor's -> Red Buff is probably the route that conserves the most health.
  • Kill the little Raptors and the little Krug first on single-target clearers. They deal a significant amount of damage for their health value, so you will be healthier if they die early.
  • If you think the enemy jungler will invade you early game, it can be safer to start on a buff camp rather than a little camp since you are less likely to be where they are looking.
  • Attack Speed is extremely efficient at clearing on most junglers. I'd recommend using about 15% on champions when you need to speed up their clear even if they don't use the stat much later (with a few exceptions, such as Nidalee and Evelynn).
  • Keep a pink ward out (or in your inventory) whenever possible. This is important for every champion, but I thought I should emphasis it. There isn't really a good reason not to.

As far as ganking is concerned:

  • When possible, conserve your gap-closer while ganking. If you can get to the enemy champion without using your mobility spell(s), then you can save it to catch them after they try to escape (Flash, dash, blink, etc).
  • You should should try to stay between the enemy and their escape route. You should be trying to move backwards (towards their escape) in-between attacks so that you can body-block them and slow their escape. This also leaves you closer to them if they try to dash on blink past you.
  • Use Raptor's smite buff to determine if you have been spotted by wards when ganking to reduce the risk of them escaping or receiving a counter-gank.
  • It can be risky to gank top-lane while Dragon is up since the enemy team can just group and take it 4v3. I'd recommend ganking top-lane early if possible (after your initial clear) and when Dragon is down; that lane can be quite snowbally due to isolation, so you want to get your ally ahead.
  • Learn to recognize the general times when buff camps spawn during games. If you see the enemy gank bottom lane while their top-side buff is up, you can go steal it from them.
  • Watch when top and bottom lane initially go into lane. If that lane has leashed for their jungler (missing health, mana, or showed up to lane a bit late), then you know where the enemy jungler has likely started and where they will end their clear (where is closest for them to gank).
  • If you have killed the enemy laner, you can either allow your laner to freeze or shove the lane into the enemy tower. If you shove the wave under tower and the next minion wave is coming up, it can be helpful to proxy it to ensure that the wave fully resets and the enemy laner misses as much as possible. This is very situational though and you will have to learn when through experience.

Other tips:

  • Whenever possible, walk up to the enemy champion during a gank and save your gap-closer for after they use their escape abilities.
  • Watch the enemy laners when they go into lane. Whichever lane shows up later and/or missing mana will likely indicate which side of the jungle the enemy jungler started on (which is useful for predicting gank paths and for counter-jungling).
  • When against aggressive early counter-junglers (i.e. Shaco) it can be a good idea to start on your buff camp and/or to start on a different side than you usually do. If he invades your buff, you've already taken it and/or you aren't there to be killed.
  • Watch the minimap to see when and where the enemy goes to ward, which laners are pushing, which laners are vulnerable
  • Know, roughly, how most laning matchups go so that you can prioritize which lanes are the easiest to gank or require an early gank to decide the matchup.
  • If you have blown an enemy's Flash during a gank but haven't killed them, swing back around immediately after an gank them again. Many people don't expect it
  • If you've killed an enemy during a previous gank in top lane, kill them again immediately after they return to lane. They likely won't have wards up yet and a second back-to-back death can be enough to completely crush any chance that opponent has to recover the lane.
  • Top laners rarely bother warding the lane bushes. As such, lane ganks can be quite surprising and effective.
  • When you kill an enemy laner, shove the minion wave into the tower so they miss gold and experience and so that the minion wave will reset to the middle of the lane. If you can get away with it, clear the upcoming minion wave as well to ensure the reset and maximum missed minions.

You will learn a lot through experience, but these tips should help you at the start.

Xonra1 votes

Think out of everything, Ganking will be my weakest point. I'm so used to either being in a lane alone and moving from there in very specific instances, or being unfortunately at the hip with an adc, so my timing is likely going to be very bad for a while.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

You might want to remove the quoted text. It's rather long and doesn't really need to be repeated.

You'll get the hang of gank timing and pathing with experience. When first starting, you should try to gank whatever lanes are pushed towards your own tower since they are generally the easiest targets.

I'd highly recommend against tower-diving until you are more experienced; it is really easy to screw up.

And remember, don't feel like you need to gank every lane. If you don't see any good opportunities, farm up and ward the enemy jungle or river to prevent the enemy jungler from ganking your allies. Forced ganks will often backfire.

Xonra1 votes

Yeah used to using the other view and not having that there when I reply, so didn't think about it. forgot I switched it earlier to look at something.

I'm hoping playing some CC based junglers will help a bit with ganking, but from my few times of attempting jungle, my biggest issue was trying to find pathing, timing, and ganking for lanes that had little or no real CC (like a Zed or Yasuo for example that are just aggro).

When a laner just goes in when I come to gank, it is very easy for the enemy to know what's up and it means I sometimes have to burn flash to get off my CC. That is probably more a non-team issue more than anything as far as comps.

Tower diving is just something I'm not a fan of in general in my division of ranked, as few people know how to swap aggro, know when to go in and leave, and so on.

Last point you made I think is what I will have the most trouble with. I tend to play with "help them, go, go now. Help." And I will admittedly make mistakes sometimes trying so hard to help everyone, even knowing before and after the game I shouldn't have.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

The main issue with trying to help everyone is that you tend to fall behind yourself since you aren't farming enough.

Focus on farming efficiently to have a reliable source of gold and experience and gank when you see an opportunity to do so.

deadzombie9181 votes

Umm... Nightblue3 probably wouldn't be the best to watch, as he mains assassin junglers that can carry extremely hard. FoxDropLoL, Redmercy, and Pants are Dragon would be better choices. (Comment directed at post writer) If you want to learn some Rammus, Trick2g (high elo tanky jungle player) has a couple videos for him

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

While Nightblue does play mainly assassin junglers, his commentary and advice is generally applicable to most junglers. Focus on farm, pathing through the jungle, objective control and recognizing opportunities are useful no matter who you play.

However, those other junglers are good options too.

Xonra1 votes

Thank you

Xonra1 votes

Thanks for all the responses so far guys. Appreciate it.

Aldapsayar1 votes

lol, now the whole team will start flaming you bc of their bad game )))) Keep it up, and don't let idiots ruin your mood!

Xonra1 votes

Thanks friend

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