Kog W Rework Idea to Avoid the Rooted Vomit Spew Scenario

ofart··7 votes·668 views

Kog's W had large scaling, duration, cost and base damage nerfs and the upside was that you could double your AS with it active (although your autos only do 55% AD). Combined with the ult. cost, mana reset and damage nerfs, Kog has been in a pretty weak spot. Multi-year Challenger players such as Imaqtpie (who often played Kog before the changes), remarked "Kog is garbage now" and Valkrin said much the same thing in different words. It isn't just a solo-que vs competitive perspective or having he right comp. He simply has fundamental issues that prevent him from being a good pick.

He's pigenoholed into an AS + on-hit build to maximize his damage as an "ADC" and he lost his poke pattern mid since the ult. does little damage to targets >50% HP. No one asked for this rework and he feels pretty unrewarding and uninteresting now. The old Kog had a lot of diversity in build paths, roles and styles. HOWEVER, Riot isn't known for reverting poorly designed reworks so I'm trying to find ways to make the current one suck less.

One big problem with the 2x AS W is that it is boring and removes a lot of the skill element of ADC. One you get to 2.5+ AS, it becomes almost impossible to kite and animation cancel without losing DPS. Thus, Kog becomes almost rooted for W's duration and he prays that the damage he does will be enough. Nevermind that his damage isn't even that impressive relative to Twitch, Vayne etc. and actually falls off late game compared to crit .builds, a bit problem is that it doesn't feel rewarding to use an ADC this way.

MY SOLUTION: Have W's active apply on-hit effects twice and increase the base on-hit damage to 5% max HP at max rank (this means 2.5% max HP but it gets doubled so 5% when active). He will no longer get ridiculous 5x AS but hit like a wet-noodle due to each firing 55% AD. However, he will feel like an actual carry when he autos and while he'll still lack escapes, he'll be able to kite like any other champion. The ratio is buffed because in the current version, he's essentially dealing 110% AD per auto and 4% HP since he autos 2x as fast. Now, it will be just a regular 100% AD and also I don't think his W damage is strong enough to justify Kog's many weaknesses right now.

8 Comments

Zero Skill Tank3 votes

Or nurf barrage's range bonus but make it so his AAs don't interrupt walking when it is active. Now that would be unique.

Odinakos1 votes

Unique but OP. They wanted to do that to Lucian R, just the ability to shoot while moving and condemed it too good even for a long cd ult, imagine on a normal ability. I know it does not seem so strong but it would be the worse thing since Le blanc release. Oh the nightmares.....

atomicwit2 votes

{quoted}

Unique but OP. They wanted to do that to Lucian R, just the ability to shoot while moving and condemed it too good even for a long cd ult, imagine on a normal ability. I know it does not seem so strong but it would be the worse thing since Le blanc release. Oh the nightmares.....

Lucian is a highly mobile carry with an entirely different kit and a good early game. It's an entirely different situation and Kog wouldn't even be doing more damage than now in the way it was described. With W active, he's essentially at 110% AD, 4% max HP (1.5% AP scaling). Instead, he'd be at 5% max HP (1.5% AP scaling) with 100% AD on each auto. For a typical 2000 HP target, that's 20 more damage and 10% AD with just 200 AD is also 20 damage. Keep in mind too that W's duration has been nerfed to a mere 6 seconds after which Kog is essentially a useless 500 range feeding machine.

atomicwit2 votes

It would be interesting but Kog is so easily killed if he steps out of line that I'm not sure how much they can lower the range if they do that.

hopeful42 votes

The whole idea of the rework was exactly to make him a literally immobile champion that does insane amounts of damage but the rest of the team has to protect him cuz hes a squishy rooted target.

You pretty much just suggest to revert the rework, which will make him again a worse/better version of Jinx depending on numbers.

The problem with current Kog is that the meta doesnt favour him due to shorter games and yes soloQ is an issue. You wont find any soloQ teams that are willing to play around you, even in Challenger. Maybe he could use a little buff but revert the rework? Dont think so

Orangesilk1 votes

No, it goes beyond a meta problem. He falls-off lategame, the way his kit works right now, he falls off lategame in winrate, that's outright unacceptable, Kog should NEVER fall off.

Rebonack1 votes

{quoted}

The whole idea of the rework was exactly to make him a literally immobile champion that does insane amounts of damage but the rest of the team has to protect him cuz hes a squishy rooted target.

You pretty much just suggest to revert the rework, which will make him again a worse/better version of Jinx depending on numbers.

The problem with current Kog is that the meta doesnt favour him due to shorter games and yes soloQ is an issue. You wont find any soloQ teams that are willing to play around you, even in Challenger. Maybe he could use a little buff but revert the rework? Dont think so

Nah.

Since Riot removed the AD ratio from his W, he falls off late game. He spikes in power mid game once you have Rageblade and Bork, but it's all down hill from there.

If anything, Riot didn't take the rework far enough. The goal was to make him the long range sustained damage centerpiece ADC. Problem is, he lost his late game hyper-scaling and his W doesn't have nearly enough uptime to allow him to be the sustained damage source he's supposed to be.

What Riot should do is axe his self-destruct Innate and move the double attack speed/%HP effect over to his Innate. Then make his W a toggle that slows him by 75% while it is active and either increase the attack range it grants it give it some new secondary effect. I think that would do a much better job of actually making good on the immobile hyper-carry concept Riot is shooting for.

ofart1 votes

Being able to kite doesn't suddenly make him a mobile champion. By that argument, Ashe, Varus and literally every other ranged champion are mobile champions too. That's not how the word is used in this game. This W change would just allow a bit more skillful play than his currently mindless W.

His problems have nothing to do with the meta or team comp. I've talked to several top Challenger players with extensive experience on Kog. He is simply not a better choice than other champions in any role or team comp. at the moment. His late game isn't even that good (winrate actually drops late game). On-hits fall off and he depends on them to maximize his benefit from W. Also, even other low mobility carries are much safer simply because they can use Warrior's Bloodlust and benefit from large lifesteal amounts from BT, BoRK, Mercurial... Kog has the worst early game of any ADC atm and only above average late game.

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