Why it's so hard to come back from rough games, and what I miss about the Old Rift

Total Eclipse··38 votes·1,529 views

Riot has gone through and nerfed the experience gains across the board (natural stats). Meanwhile, all items have been powercreeped over time (gold given stats). These two effects work together to make the game, by definition, more snowbally. These changes have also made burst champions very favorable, and 2v1s can be over in less than a second at 10 minutes. These changes have also made ganking rather cancerous, both by the snowball handed to the laner recieiving, and also with how good the early clears are. The overall safety of jungle is too high, thanks to the powercreep on items. Jungling items are INSANELY good for staying healthy on your first back- I want to feel like the enemy jungler is playing with fire when he ganks me, instead of it being a guarunteed bad situation for me every time because he will literally always be full hp thanks to jg items right now.

With all of this snowball crap in mind, let's focus on the meta right now. The meta strategy is simply to match what your opponent does while having more gold than them, or, cramming advantadge down their throats (extreme mobility on a bonus AD ratio champ, old reworked Ryze, invisibility ambushes, hard cc from offscreen/out of vision, etc). Right now, the team with the most gold more or less owns the big objectives on the map.

A blanket nerf to items roughly on the scale of what they did to Rylais but to EVERY item, primarily excluding the base stats on tank items, lifesteal, and maybe movespeed effects, would just make the champions feel like they do their roles more properly more often. When making plays both on the macro and micro is supposed to be about how you play the champion, not how many times you got ganked in the first 15 minutes of this game.

The map is sort of a wasteland right now. It seems like, with the updated rift, there's more unprotected territory. I think, the scuttle bug should give you a turret. And whenever an objective spawns it will be disabled. The old jungle had more thick but consistent walls. Now that the turrets feel so far away. Something more built into the actual parts of the map you play on would be great. Kind of like Skarners passive, but in a more intuitive and natural way, like mini-turrets that spawn outside of the lanes. If there was a strong incentive to keep junglers in their own jungle, like if you get reduced experience from killing enemy jungle camps, thereby increasing the cost of counter jungling, we could return to a sense of sides. When I played this game in season 4, it felt like I had a base. I could depend on my turrets to save me from lots of stuff. With how stupidly fat top lane is on the map, getting to your tower from a gank AND having that tower do anything at all to save you is very rare. Having tri warded used to make me feel fairly safe. This lack of a feeling of "having a base" means that you get a less reliable base line playstyle. Falling back on your "base" should be realistic and base line rewarding. Right now, if you die to a gank, there's a good chance that you will miss an entire wave, and if it resets, you're automatically a free gank or miss CS. If the other guy slow pushes right, you can be SOL when it comes to opporunities to do anything, because right now the safety zone from being ganked is roughly 15% of the availible lane. This is why top lane gets gank kills more than mid for the majority of junglers.

Also, imo, I freaking miss the Hell out of the old-fashioned creeps. Tightly rounding the perimeter of minions, like its a traffic cone, felt like what a Champion would do. Riot, the Lego minions are way too real right now.

11 Comments

SSrikeShadow14 votes

I agree that the snowball is anti-fun. The login, queue, pickban/dodge phase and load time make for the game to be about 50% waiting and 50% playing. Either the wait times need to decrease by about 80% or the games need to last longer before it becomes so clear the game is lost. Currently the game is basically over at 15 minutes about 80% of the time. Sure there are those 20% comeback games, but only in low elo for the most part.

In pro games comebacks from a 5 kill/tower deficit at 15 mins is game over 99% of the time. In fact, in pro games first blood is game over 20% of the time....haha. The point is that this game snowballs so much faster than real skill games like chess - ironic because chess is so much less complicated.

korg0232 votes

The one of most annoying parts is how client is separated from the actual game and most of the time goes to client closing and game opening and then loading screen and then loading screen some more time and then actual game. JESUS! not to mention pick ban phase and waiting to find match. I with someone do comparison video between league procedure to get into game and Dota 2, OW, Paladins , HOTS etc.

Swaid2 votes

Its why I tend to play more Heroes of the Storm; while it is simplified, that isn't a bad thing; complexity does not make a game good and League is quite complex, so much that I have a real hard time introducing newbies to it.

korg0232 votes

It wouldnt be a problem if by the time you actually get grasp of what is going on they change it completly with mid season patch or pre season patch. Its just so hard to keep track of changes even for us veterans not to mention people who just started playing. Imagine someone new finally understanding how some things work and Riot changes so many things in their pre season patch and he is just bamboozled what is going on.

korg0232 votes

Think of jungle camps as some little annoyance junglers have to spend very little time over to get huge amounts of XP and Gold for the effort they are puting in them. This is all done so Junglers can just go from lane to lane and gank gank gank gank gank etc. This is just one of many many changes Riot did in this game to boost action and constant action. Second thing they did nerf towers so we see more and more action dives, all ins and encourage people to actually dive someone 2v1 very early game (when it should never happen) and survive after that. So League is slowly becoming a game where we are going to have this arena style battles and kill all grinding feel that i fell in love with and farming peaceful early game so we can benefit from our items later feel. Taking towers ,inhibs and nexus is now secondary objective(its a paradox since you need it to win game so some people may not get my point) but the real objective is constant fights and only fights while you get items basically over time and for free. With XP catchup mechanic they encouraged even more ganking for junglers its basically imposible to be ahead from good counterjungle or farming jungle anymore to the point where famring jungle is considered trolling and will probably become reportable in the future. Thank you Riot for basically ruining 90% of what i fell in love with league ,for ruining feeling of being ahead in levels and rewarded for doing good job as a jungler. Thank you for making it totally different game from what was it in season 3 and 4 and not different in a better way but worse with your hilarious balance changes towards LCS and competitive killing it for us SoloQ and causal players. Thank you Riot!

Nea1042 votes

Add their shameful forced 50% win-loss ratio matchmaking system :D

RainbowIcee1 votes

The issue is that league is a number heavy game and there's only 2 ways to win a match. Have the enemy team surrender or destroy their nexus. Were there a 3rd option then the chances of better come back and strategy would be open. But as it's stands the only "come back " you can do is to punish the enemy team for throwing.

korg0232 votes

Its very hard to come back when you have Rift herald who literally eats towers and baron buff who just pushes lanes for you. Not to mention occasional elder drake and elemental drakes for team that is ahead. There are so many things in favor of winning team that comebacks are close to zero. Before you could try to stall game and waveclear under tower but today its close to impossible. Very very snowbally and favors winning team alot! Some would argue that "the winning team should get those advantages and have easy time finish of their deserved win" well its not really fair when the losing team has only option to surrender since chance of comeback is 10% and trying to defend is waste of time. There is no game that should be decided early mid game we all need to wait late and see what happens. That was the case in season 3-4 but nowdays its just impossible as i said.

RainbowIcee2 votes

that's the thing because league is number heavy and not skill heavy come backs are just punishing throws. A backdoor strategy is also very weak in this game because the idea of that has been nerfed to desperate attempts so the only thing you can do is stomp or get stomped. This is why i personally don't feel league has "come back" mechanics it's just bump heads and see which one hits the hardest.

deadlychuck1 votes

I think that's a simplistic view of what's actually causing problems.

The problem is that league use to be a very heavy numbers game, where you had to make rough calculations on the fly and knowing the numerical advantage you had could both allow you to steam roll the enemy, but also allow the enemy to recover by taking advantage of the obvious weaknesses in a kit which focused on numbers.

The problem is that riot has been trying to force change into the game that makes it less of a numbers game, but without changing literally everything. Which is where you see the problem coming from, because you have all of the old systems, being filtered through a new system which don't work together.

They're passing a blue light through a red lens and we're having to deal with this purple pile of shit that they've created.

deadlychuck1 votes

Attack Damage.

Everything about riot's design has been centered around AD and it has always naturally snowballed, due to it's reliability, natural 1:1 scaling, multiplicative stats.

Health and AP (the two other primary stats) have been heavily neglected by riot and this is what you get.

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