Fully built tanks should not die in less than 2 seconds to 2 people.

MajorPain9··43 votes·6,522 views

They don't even get to use there utility in that amount of time let a lone a team fight. There is no reason to even play one anymore.

I was fully built Nasus late game with Frozen Heart, SV, IBG, Randuins, Flask and it didn't even make a fucking difference. Not to mention I was ulted. Mind you with 400+ stacks.

They didnt even have to CC me! One second I was there the next I wasn't.

102 Comments

TheKingDodo18 votes

Lol, Vayne and Irelia be like, "FUCK YOU AND YOUR ARMOR!"

ChrisB54 votes

Riot Employee 1: Hey guys, out of curiosity, what can't be countered? What should we NOT ever do? Riot Employee 2: Lol imagine percent based true damage, that would be insane! Riot Employee 1: DUDE LET'S DO THAT!!! Riot Employee 2: Yes, I'm a genius!

Riot, why ): I guess lifesteal is a counter, in it's own way haha, but damn. Vayne is a force to be reckoned with! And Irelia? Oh god what a combo.

Budupops17 votes

stopped reading at 400 stacks late game

Decrit11 votes

In all fairness, the answer is simple: you wasted a ton of gold into armor.

Armor decreases damage by a % in a decreasing manner: while 100 armor reduces damage by 50%, 200 armor reduces only by 2/3. Also this means that the enemy had chance to abuse your weakness with magic damage, that negated 4 of your items! plus some of that was hp% in magic, so here it is. You needed to buy more mr, earlier and to get more hp and less armor. Iceborn is OK, frozen hearth should have been picked onlòy as a 4-5th item else they could abuse early of your weakness. Never buy more than 2 armor items, even if the enemy team is full AD since with a LW they can deny pretty much a big part of it ( in this case was not even necessary!)

I suggest you getting banshee ( after spirit) or mikael as mr choice (mikael has pretty good utility for teamfights, since you are most times always able to use it safely on allies), getting only 2 items for armor ( or 3 if you really need ninja tabi) and an hp item like warmog ( absurd health regeneration while in ulti! also it allows you to postpone his usage and the need to cast it all the time. hp is not always wasted on nasus). I don' t like randuin, if you have frozen heart that is enough.

To give you an example: me and a friend were premade bot, he was sona. He build a bit of ap and went top against a nasus that farmed all the time with the opposing laner disconnected, and he builded somewhat like you. he got deleted in matter of seconds, and sona got wards and all the stuff for supporting.

ChrisB52 votes

Dereet, don't forget that he went full onto armor, and completely ignored the Vayne/Irelia true damage aspect. Am I wrong to suggest Warmongs in the mix? I'm not too great at understanding the numbers. I just know armor and mr reduce ad and ap respectively before applying damage, maximizing health. Less health with less damage being dealt (armor/mr) can potentially increase the affects of lifesteal/spellvamp/heals. BUT with all the true damage... but there were a few things wrong, starting with the OP thinking he should 2v1 as Nasus with the enemy team being fed xD

MajorPain91 votes

I got caught out. I deserved the death. The problem with building a tank against so many ANTI tank champions is that if I build health Im screwed, and if i build armor I am also screwed. Build neither also screwed. I went with armor vs. health because they had a vayne with botrk, a irelia with botrk, and a fizz that comes with % health damage.

ChrisB51 votes

Well honestly, with as fed as they were (they were way ahead in gold), all I can really say is "don't get caught roaming." I know, that's lame to say, but it's the honest truth. It's why I get so upset when my team is behind and certain players roam. Grouping and communication/teamwork (pings wards etc) is VERY crucial, and much more important than individual build (which is still very important of course) etc. But hey, win some lose some. I do see your original point though, but it really doesn't apply since you roamed and were against two fed assassin champs. Nulls the original point trying to be made :P

Decrit1 votes

Hey man! you are absolutely not wrong, i mean i said that too! "getting only 2 items for armor [...] and an hp item like warmog..." Sadly, vayne' s w deals true damage on enemy health % so warmog would still be useless against that, but by getting it at least Nasus has better resistance to irelia, overall better resistance to any other damage dealer and an health regeneration that in this case it's not something to forget about. The true counter to vayne' s W are items like frozen heart or randuin for the slow and any damaging item... but the latter is not the case for nasus xP Probably adding a trinity could have been a better choice than gauntlet in this case, since there were Vayne and Irelia...

ChrisB51 votes

Clearly it's been a long day, I didn't even see that you typed that out haha. But good point! I didn't consider the attack speed reduction. I always forget frozen heart does this.

TauNoob19 votes

I simply don't believe you died in two seconds, my bet is that OP is exaggerating like the 50 other people on the boards.

Zair Umbras8 votes

If you have all those items and only 400 stacks with their team able to kill you, it would seem you lost lane and the enemies were then fed. Nasus is really, really bad when he's not on par with the enemies, not to mention there's a few tank killer champs, namely Malzahar, Cass, and Vayne. You're not really giving any information on this game and thus, we can't really give an opinion. Yes, you can get shredded pretty damn quick as Nasus or any other tank if the enemy's carries aren't CC'd and the team decides to kill you since there's no other threat close enough.

MrSc0tty6 votes

So, an Irelia (a champ who does a large amount of true damage) and a fizz (an all AP nuker with grievous wounds) attack a champ with 2 armor/mana items (totally useless), an armor/HP item (half useless) and a health/MR item (useful)

I'm assuming you got hit with a full rotation from each? Yeah. You'd be dead. Sorry.

MajorPain92 votes

Not trying to argue being dead. I was clearly out of position and accept that. I am arguing why a champion that is entirely defensive masteries and items should die before they can cast more than 1 spell.

TonyTonyMordecai1 votes

Fizz has a lot of stuff that makes immobile tanks like Nasus cry for days. Fizz's E, Q, W's Grievous wound, R's slow. Nasus is good, but only if you are able to stay on par with the rest of the members in the match. His stacks are the only thing he has for major damage, and stacking those takes time, and it takes landing all of them. AP Nasus(Mid) with stack building is pretty strong. If you wanna give that a go for kicks and giggles, you can definitely do that. It is a fun build... Until you go against Fizz or LB or Zed... But then again, you have your E which does pretty good damage on its own.

Jesus is Savior1 votes

{quoted}

Fizz has a lot of stuff that makes immobile tanks like Nasus cry for days. Fizz's E, Q, W's Grievous wound, R's slow. Nasus is good, but only if you are able to stay on par with the rest of the members in the match. His stacks are the only thing he has for major damage, and stacking those takes time, and it takes landing all of them. AP Nasus(Mid) with stack building is pretty strong. If you wanna give that a go for kicks and giggles, you can definitely do that. It is a fun build... Until you go against Fizz or LB or Zed... But then again, you have your E which does pretty good damage on its own.

AP Nasus doesn't stack at all.

He clears waves with E, which does not allow for stacking.

TonyTonyMordecai1 votes

Yes, this is true. Early game, he will be able to stack. Later on, it takes more control to not use E every time you have it up.

Mecha MaIphite5 votes

Do you play with 500 ping? Two seconds is more than enough to pull off a full combo with most champs.

JJI7441 votes

{quoted}

So, an Irelia (a champ who does a large amount of true damage) and a fizz (an all AP nuker with grievous wounds) attack a champ with 2 armor/mana items (totally useless), an armor/HP item (half useless) and a health/MR item (useful)

I'm assuming you got hit with a full rotation from each? Yeah. You'd be dead. Sorry.

To be fair, at that point in the match, Irelia's true damage has fallen off. 75 true damage per hit takes a long time to chew through 3k HP, even at max AS.

On the other hand, she had built IE,BT,BotRK, and Trinity. She had no lack of damage.

Fuaztin5 votes

'Fully built'. You were outmatched and outplayed. And you're a complete moron. Flask is not an item btw. You lost because you didn't get 500 stacks by 20 minutes. Ask nicely and I might upload a video on how to achieve that number. You can't have both iceborne and heart because neither of them have HP. You wasted your gold and this thread space.

MajorPain99 votes

A tank with HP walked into a bar, where he found two BOTRK, a Vayne and a Fizz. He died in two seconds. Then end.

I had 4 k health with ult up bud. No one should die that fast with full defensive items. There is absolutely no point playing a tank with utility if your just as squishy as an ADC.

Fuaztin3 votes

You had two items with HP. And one with MR. against a fizz. Stop it.

FDru7 votes

{quoted}

You had two items with HP. And one with MR. against a fizz. Stop it.

Better stack more HP against a Fizz with DFG though. This thread is so full of stupid it's hard to believe "They were obviously ahead, play better early game" Nevermind Nasus has 5 1/2 item build. so far behind lol

So yeah going to throw in my "3700 HP Rammus with Thorn, Sunfire, Mercs, Glory, Locket basically instakilled by a Lux + Yi with DBC up" here.

Baculus5 votes

Stacking armor without much health No MR against a Fizz/Rumble More Armor More Armor MORE ARMOR

WHY DID I LOOSE?!

MajorPain94 votes

Added a picture for proof. Fizz and Irelia deleted me less than 2 seconds. I wish I got a screan screen shot in game.

ValyrianBlade47 votes

Fizz and irelia had 15 kills each at the end of the game. Odds are they were both pretty far ahead (ESPECIALLY irelia, look at that cs, that total gold - she probably had a huge gold lead on you at the time).

On top of that, you had two great damage dealers attacking you. You said you got off nothing other than ult, so none of your lifesteal sustain was applied. You weren't anywhere near full tank - you had only 1 ap defensive item (SV) and fizz is an assassin. Further, you prioritized armour over health (frozen heart and iceborn gauntlet) despite facing an irelia with true damage.

I think it makes perfect sense you got blown up there.

MajorPain92 votes

Lets say I did have a banshees. What would that of added on to my lifespan? An entire extra second? You think thats acceptable? A full tank to die before he can maybe use a second spell.

ValyrianBlade13 votes

It probably would have added more than a second. The health alone would have added a second. The spell shield negates a lot of damage. The Magic resist negates more. Then consider that fizz probably burned all of his cooldowns, so his dps is going to drop by 70-80% if you survive the burst. If you survive the full amount of irelia's hiten style, she stops doing true damage.

So my point is you'd survive a lot longer. Maybe still die pretty quickly, but that brings me to my second point: A tank isn't meant to fight 1v2. Sure, maybe you'd have survived 5-7 seconds, that sounds right. If it were a teamfight, two huge damage dealers just blew all of their cooldowns on you and your carries will clean up the fight and win no problem. That's the point.

I'm not saying tanks shouldn't be a bit stronger possibly. Just that we need a better example where the tank is on level terms with the opponents and they can't afford to use all of their cooldowns to get the kill.

ChrisB52 votes

I was thinking just about the same thing to be honest, esp. since he claimed to be full build but clearly has a starter item in his build. One item makes a huge difference and you shouldn't complain you were eliminated during a 2v1. You essentially went against two assassins. If you had full tank, you'd have survived, gained lifesteal, survived a lot longer, and gotten at least one kill if you truly had 400 stacks. Second problem here is, like Valyrian mentioned, they had a significant gold boost. What I hear is "I should survive a 3v1 and not die quick" because of how far ahead they were in cs and the insane amount of feed that went their way in champion kills. You gotta be careful there. Nasus is actually quite the beast. I'd also ask to see your runes/masteries, as runes/masteries literally are game changers. Play one game without them as a test and... well, I did it on accident back when I was still a noob. The game was not very fun (lol).

MajorPain91 votes

Not complaining I was elimanted. I am complaining on how fast it happened. I should be able to react in that type of situation besides one spell. With full defensive masteries and pretty much tank items, im just finding it harder and hard to play a tank oriented champion.

ChrisB54 votes

But how did you only cast one spell in 2 seconds? I'm not understanding how you were so slow to react. I'd have gone ult, aoe, attk/q right away in well under a second.

Flemman1 votes

how many drake do they have i that fight?

LilxPaprika4 votes

i do think the tank masteries are subpar to the offensive masteries. by a small margin. the main thing being dangerous game tilting it. one of the biggiest issues too is that once your below 50% health your tankyness suddenly drops, especially vs a jinx or leesin. the stacking of exposed weakness also hurts a lot. suddenly incoming damages end up amplified by 10%. i,d like a tanky mastery that gave you 5% damage reduction at 50% or less to counter act it btw please tell me you went 9/21. play syyvana 9/21 thats what happens on the other extreme. so tanky and can still dole out considerable damage.

perserverence leaves wanting too. when it was first released it was noticeable. but with the amount of burst it doesnt have time to kick in.

GG Beers4 votes

I hope this is a joke, stacking armor vs 2 true damage champs and a burst mage.

SwordGrunt3 votes

item 3110 + item 3025 = Nasusitem 3070

Vesarixx3 votes

You staked Armor, bough 1 MR item, got taken out by a champion that deals % health magic damage and one that deals partial true damage (75 per attack), and you're surprised? Irelia was far enough ahead to build an IE and a BT on top of her core build, and fizz built all three NLR items, you think 55 MR is going to help in that situation? You need to itemize better, you were vs a rumble in lane and only had a spirit visage.

Your Nasus rune pages also only have flat MR, rather than scaling.

MajorPain91 votes

Better flat MR when starting against a Rumble top.

Vesarixx1 votes

Yes, but the only additional MR you built was spirit visage, considering the AD damage dealers on the enemy team were both champions that deal true damage and rely on attack speed, so swapping out armor for MR would have been beneficial, merc treads instead of Tabi, and BV to replace either omen or FH, or at least getting a specter's cowl instead of that last chain vest

Dystopiac2 votes

Sorry but that is absolutely natural.People think that Nasus is a late game monster-no,Nasus is a late MIDGAME monster.In the true,40+mins in lategame,Nasus is a lump of meat with only single-target damage,no defensive steroids aside of a lump of HP(yum BOTRK),no mobility,and no hard CC.Mikaels Crucible,QSS and a bit of peel and Nasus never reaches anyone while being shredded due to his lack of mobility and steroids.

Dystopiac2 votes

Also never EVER pick nasus against vayne,lucian,or kalista.Nasusing 101

TonyTonyMordecai1 votes

I don't mean to be a jerk, but maybe this was a blind pick? If it was ranked, then the vayne/lucian/irelia/kalista were picked afterwards. It tends to happen quite often.

Dystopiac2 votes

Thats why if you want to pick Nasus,you pick him dead last because you also need to know if the enemy ADC or enemy support also counters you(Dont pick Nasus into Janna support)

DaStruggIeEzreaI2 votes

You've got like no MR.. of course Fizz blew your low HP ass up.

MajorPain91 votes

3.7k hp is low hp?

Duke Anax2 votes

For a Tank yes. Especially with mixed damage and low MR.

Also in that game item 3050 would have been a better choice than item 3110

Gunpoint2 votes

I have no idea what you are talking about, I've seen Nasus's 4v1 goin tanky as hell. They probably just kited you around.

AquariusGine1 votes

You built badly, you spent too much gold on armor. Not nearly enough MR for fizz and rumble, both capable of dishing out massive tons of magic dmg. And vayne and irelia deal true damage, where are health items.

Frozen heart and iceborn gauntlet .. you can start by not building both together

RavenKouhai2 votes

{quoted}

You built badly, you spent too much gold on armor. Not nearly enough MR for fizz and rumble, both capable of dishing out massive tons of magic dmg. And vayne and irelia deal true damage, where are health items.

Frozen heart and iceborn gauntlet .. you can start by not building both together

Build MR, get completely shredded by Vayne and Irelia. And still Fizz, because MR itemization is trash.

TonyTonyMordecai1 votes

There aren't a lot of choices that lead to good things with MR. The Armor items lead to more health, the MR items have lesser on the final item. And when there is enough MR to make a difference, it doesn't give any health (GA, Void Gate)

Onerios1 votes

I actually think MR itemisation is in a decent spot once you remove dfg from the equation. Stacking BV, SV, and locket onto the same champion gives you a huge amount of magic damage mitigation, even before you take into account the aura for other team members.

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