From what I'm reading their reason is to HELP ASSASSINS burst the ADC. They REMOVED the attack speed reduction and armor reduction....
So now exhaust is just a slow and a damage dealt.... Wtfff?
Time to run Ignite then.
GULAG 4 U9 votesbecause it's a 0 counterplay point and click fuck you button. that's why.
Lord Desert1 votesYou need to have skill to use it, thats the counterplay... You only have 2.5 sec and you need to exhaust the tread BEFORE ´they deal their dmg, if you exhaust to late OR to early you waste your summonerspell. And with 3+ One-Shot guys in every game it is not that easy because you need to watch out for every one of them. If exhaust is suddenly op/broken after years, why doesnt take everybody it?
The only ones with exhaust are gp (because he has a global ult to compensate the lack of tp), supports that want to protect their carrys, and mids that face to many assassins. So why doesnt every toplaner and adc take exhaust too? If it is "broken" even they should take it...
GULAG 4 U1 votesSo basically 'I can't do shit unless you fuck up?" Because reactive 'parry' style attacks are totally not possible to be used at their full extent, right.
And exhaust is the most used summoner spell after flash, so yes, it is pretty broken.
Lord Desert1 votesNo Im telling you that you can bait out their exhaust because its only a 2,5 sec window and also your dmg is reduced by 40% you still do alot of dmg! And everybody is forgetting that you can cleanse exhaust. You know paper, rock, scissors? If you have way to many rocks( Assassins), people start to look for counters, in this case paper(exhaust), but you also can counter their paper with scissors(cleanse, bait out their exh etc.) Thats how balance works...
Only if things get out of hand and there is no good available counter to something, THEN Riot should butt in and tweak it... Which is clearly not the case here.
Boots are the most commonly purchased item in the hole game, does that make them op/broken? Why isnt flash nerfed than? It is the most used summoner! Do you see that just because it got more popular doesnt mean its broken?
And basing on action-reaction, if the amount of assassins/one-shot guys drop, exhaust will be taken less. The uprise of assassins and burst caused the uprising of exhaust. Lower the overall effectivness of them(aka. longer games, less 1shot potential) then everything will go back to "normal".
McFatal1 votes[{quoted}](name=Lord Desert,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IxdTubBb,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2017-03-07T23:04:49.656+0000)
No Im telling you that you can bait out their exhaust because its only a 2,5 sec window and also your dmg is reduced by 40% you still do alot of dmg! And everybody is forgetting that you can cleanse exhaust. You know paper, rock, scissors? If you have way to many rocks( Assassins), people start to look for counters, in this case paper(exhaust), but you also can counter their paper with scissors(cleanse, bait out their exh etc.) Thats how balance works...
Only if things get out of hand and there is no good available counter to something, THEN Riot should butt in and tweak it... Which is clearly not the case here.
Boots are the most commonly purchased item in the hole game, does that make them op/broken? Why isnt flash nerfed than? It is the most used summoner! Do you see that just because it got more popular doesnt mean its broken?
And basing on action-reaction, if the amount of assassins/one-shot guys drop, exhaust will be taken less. The uprise of assassins and burst caused the uprising of exhaust. Lower the overall effectivness of them(aka. longer games, less 1shot potential) then everything will go back to "normal".
go try and bait out exhaust 40 minutes in as a melee and watch what happens.
go try that and send me the link of the enemy team just leaving you to walk away and you fighting them again for free.
GULAG 4 U1 votespossible if you are playing a melee champ with 3 get out of jail cards.
oh wait.
McFatal1 votespossible if you are playing a melee champ with 3 get out of jail cards.
oh wait.
i forgot how 1 riven q is the distance of flash.
oh wait, im not a moron.
:)
GULAG 4 U1 votesI'm joking lol. I wasn't referring to riven (I just realized it really sounds I did). And riven technically has 4 dashes lel.
Lord Desert1 votesMcFatal1 votes[{quoted}](name=Lord Desert,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IxdTubBb,comment-id=000200000000000000000001,timestamp=2017-03-08T02:17:57.021+0000)
- You can cleanse exhaust and Assassins dont need ignite anymore so they can take cleanse.
- Currently there are 2-3 Burster/Assassins in a team, so if one of them gets exhausted the otherones still can fullfill the job
- "Bait out" means that you can go in and maybe trade your ult cd againt exhaust, you dont aim to kill them, it is enough if you force them to back. Or you could wait out the time. Or you safe your biggest nuke until the exhaust expieres.
- Normaly games dont get to the 40min mark today because the snowball is just to heavy.
if u take cleanse top just to be able to play the game late game, you're going to lose early even harder.
without tp you lose out on cs pressure and your entire lane if the enemy jungler has even the slightest clue on what to do.
no tp> free ganks and lane win.
GULAG 4 U1 votesExcept it doesn't just reduce your damage by 40%. It also reduces your as by 40%.
Also comparing league to RPS is pretty inaccurate, as picking something like assassins means you lose lategame teamfight presence for the ability to potentially nuke one person (which a mage with flash can also do). The tradeoff to using Rock in RPS is the other person using paper, the tradeoff in league is losing long ranged poke/ap damage and cc (so you get something that mages can do with the same unpredictable patterns) AND getting cockblocked by high cc comps with 2 tanks (Jung/top/sup). Did I mention losing lategame presence?
Boots are 'broken' but that is fine, because it is an universally used item. It's meant to be used by everyone (Except Cassio ofc and if ur one of the silencee fuqbois who build 
on 
).
Flash has made multiple broken interactions (Flash R- Lee sin. Yasuo EQflash. Gragas Flash E, Annie flash stun, etc.) Flash is broken, riot knows it. Just because it's broken it doesn't mean it needs to be removed. Riot has (tried) to balance the game around flash, so they don't really need to remove/nerf flash.
Also you are wrong about assassins uprising because of damage creep. It's the opposite. Assassins will fall if damage creep rises up. Why pick characters with unsafe laneing phases, no cc and lategame presence to kill people in few moments when literally every other champion can do it? It doesn't make sense. Lethality being pretty fucking busted is the reason (albeit it is nowhere as good as armor penetration). Game aren't shorter because everybody can oneshot, they are shorter because
Mostly because how snowbally the game is because towers are weak as hell.
Lord Desert1 votesAnd how do you get to snowball? Killing enemys. Who accels at killing enemys in the midgame? Assassins. So in a game/meta where you get alot from snowballing, Assassins will rise up in popularity. Reduce the effectivness of snowballing = less assassins.
The AS slow targets Adcs mostly. Assassins hurt you pretty hard but mostly only once. Adcs however hit decently hard, a bit less than Assassins, but they hit you alot more and their hits are not skillshot based. So to be fair in how much you hurt someone with exhaust, adcs also need to lose some AS too.
I can somewhat agree to the 10Pen removal, it was introduced to encourage you to fight the attacker and not just to run away. But the complete removal of the AS slow is way over the top! Also exhaust had a 50% but it was changed to the 10Pen and 40%, so technically only the 10Pen removal should be enough to justify a 50% reduction. As a side note.
Assassins today dont even need ignite anymore to get snowballing reliable, so they have the ability to take cleanse to counter the exhaust! And when you have 3+ threads which all need to be exhausted to not delete your carries you see more people picking exhaust if they can effort it. If it really was that broken, everybody would take it! I agree that it is strong, but it is the only counter in this snowball heavy Assassin/Burst meta ontop of beeing primarely more focused to take AS Champions out of the fight for 2.5sec.
GULAG 4 U1 votesIf assassins actually didn't need ignite anymore, we'd see assassins more often in proplay and we'd see assassins dropping ignite. Except it isn't the case. Only Talon stopped running ignite in favor of ghost.
And we aren't in an assassin meta. We are in a mixed lethality-mage meta. Mages are already taking over Mid, bot, sup. The best picks atm aren't assassins. The best ones are mages and lethality abusers.
You also fail to offer an argument against the other downsides to picking assassins as I've mentioned. And the meta right now isn't midgame. It's a full on early game as even in the shittest of elos the avg game time is 30 mins when LOL is designed to last 30-45.
Lord Desert1 votesThe reason why we dont see that many Assassins in proplay is because they somewhat requiere to get ahead somehow to get snowballing and thus take over the game. Proplayers are good enough to minimize the snowball oppertunitys and also are coordinatated enough to fight of assassins in teamfights. Iginte gets you way easier snowballing, but cleanse helps you to counter exhaust, which counters your snowball. So you can pick easier/faster snowball or safer/reliable snowball when you get snowballing.
We are in a Burst Meta, not an Assassin Meta. Assassins burst, Poke burst, Mages burst(mostly), even tanks/offtanks have a decent burst. And then use the 5v4 that you created with your burst to take objectivs and win the game. If we make it harder to burst people, aka. reducing the overall dmg or strengthen towers so they are not made out of paper anymore... This would make games longer and less snowbally, so you simply cant burst your enemy as easily anymore.
You pick an assassin to kill your enemy in the midgame, which starts around level 7+ or your first complete item. You dont pick them for a good lategame aka. good teamfights. You pick them to snowball and rofl over your enemy. And exhaust tries to counter that, but you can also counter exhaust with cleanse. So its even and doesnt justifiy to nerf exhaust. Even if they only nerf it against adcs. If they wanted to buff adcs, make the games less snowbally/longer. So it doesnt makes sense to me to nerf it!
And Assassins already got the insane EoN, which counters their biggest weakness: CC. It was 100% clear that it was to strong back then and they even buffed it later xD I said that already when EoN was released... So to bring everything together: There is to much burst everywhere, be it assassins or mages or whatever. And there is no real reason for this exhaust nerf. If it was targeted to help adcs, than it definitly was the wrong aprotch.
Akali is SO HOT5 votesYeah not getting to play the game because the enemy team took exhaust is fun
Rock MD1 votes[{quoted}](name=Akali is SO HOT,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IxdTubBb,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-03-07T21:18:02.316+0000)
Yeah not getting to play the game because the enemy team took exhaust is fun
The same could be said for not getting to play the game because the assassin bursts you down too quickly.
The real issue was in most games it was 2/5 summoner spells and in some 3/5 people took it. It was too all purpose and had too many random stat debuffs in it.
Jinzo Torrance2 votesI'm just glad they finally removed the AS slow.
AS slows are just cancer.
Salron2 votesI'm just glad they finally removed the AS slow.
AS slows are just cancer.
"alright I just need one more auto and-" exhaust kicks in and stops my auto mid animation
Good to know this will never happen again
Jinzo Torrance1 votesOn champion with shitty AA animation like Nautilus is the worst.
You stare at the enemy for 5 second before even starting the animation.
BlackFlux1 votesthen whats the point of
? 
a TON almost all supports have SOME slow on them,reduced damage dealt was its thing...
Moetaro1 votesBecause a summoner that debuffs one guy during a whole teamfight is not fair.
Lord Desert1 votesheal debuffs 2 guys, ignite debuffs one guy... And Exhaust debuffs for the shortest amount of time
Moetaro1 votesExhaust debuffs for the whole duration of the fight. That's why exhaust is broken. It wasnt, and now it is. It's a matter of how stupid the game has become. League of Duty.
Lord Desert1 votesExhaust debuffs you for 2.5 seconds.... Ignite 5sec and heal 35sec! And you have to exhaust a thread BEFORE they do dmg, afterwards its just a complete waste. Also you can cleanse exhaust if you are seriously thrown of the 2.5 sec... Tenacity should affect the duration too, but im not 100% certain on that.
Moetaro1 voteswhen teamfights can last 2.5 seconds literally, you have to admit that exhaust is totally OP.
Ignite debufs you for 5 seconds, so? the debuff is a joke when a teamfight lasts 3 seconds. You can kill ANYONE without inginite, you need ignite for nothing this joke of a season.
Look, mate, I love exhaust, is my favourite summoner because in my opinion opens the window for a lot of decision making and, hence, to a lot of fun. It's disgusting the nerfs that they are doing to exhaust. But it's impossible to deny that exhaust in the "3 seconds teamfights meta" is OP. That being said, the solution for me is not nerfing exhaust, is to get rid of this stupid and disgusting league of duty meta.
Lord Desert1 votesIf you face 3-4 guys that 1 shot you, you need 2-3 exhausts to match that! So even if they only last 2.5 sec you can only take 1 guy out of it, if you have the skill to rightclick them at the perfect time. And when assassins dont need their "kill someone" summoner spell(ignite) they can take cleanse and cleanse the exhaust....
This is like a game of rock, paper & scissors! When you have to many rocks(assassins/bursters), you will see more papers( exhaust), but there is also a good counter to paper, namely scissors (cleanse, they need some skill to use exhaust right). So it is a balanced state! Riot only should butt in if there're no good counters available and this simply isnt the case.
So to me it is definitly not op, because you can counter it.
PhDs Nuts1 votesHow does this help assassins burst the ADC? It still reduces damage dealt. If anything it keeps the exhausted ADC more relevant during exhaust since it doesn't reduce their attack speed anymore. Exhaust reduces the assassin burst and the ADC damage by nearly the same amount now. It used to be multiplicative for the ADC, and then also reduced defense enough to make it better than ignite for early game damage.
Revali1 votesthe exhaust as removal makes me sad, id rather it be toned down than outright removed, it was a nice pick against that 
or any other attackspeed oriented character.
Calabok1 votesGood . F assassins
