Give riot a hand on the cho goth change 4.21

At first glance i thought it was a really cool buff because it actually allows you to get stacks without tanking the whole cool down of the ability, however after reading some feedback from some of the "cho mains" I revised that opinion. I don't play chogath often i must say, however i think that in a game where people take advantage of cool downs and time-frames where you can trade it baits cho into losing pressure. Of course, as it goes to life we will see more of how it effects cho, but i think it hurts cho in the lane.

In the jungle might be a different story though, because you can now stack your ults twice as fast and still have time to gank with kill potential. It's really a push and pull change.

Our primary goal with these changes was to give Cho'gaths that fall too far behind (lose all/most of their stacks and can't afford to build them much because they need the CD available) some better options for getting them back, without trivializing stack building. Secondary goals/effects of that change should be a bit of a jungling buff and hopefully a few extra interesting trade offs around who to ult and when. Power wise we were aiming for a slight buff overall, so if we were wrong on that and this is a nerf overall we'll likely follow up with a buff somewhere.

It's amazing that you guys can be so downright competent at thinking out minor changes to never used champions but have 0 understanding of what the effects of your item/summoner changes will be. It's like "Hey top lane is a shithole were ranged champions faceroll every melee for 6+ levels and the mandatory teleport makes aggression impossible to the extent that poppy is more viable than any 'lane bully' fighter in the game because we don't understand how doran's shield or teleport is important. But here are some subtle cho'gath changes that are actually intelligent."

I'm being sincere btw I'm not just taking the chance to insult the balance team. I'm seriously sort of in awe at you guys.

I feel like Cho has more issues than just that. There was so much mobility introduced, he can't keep up with all the dashes anymore.

I thought of an interesting way to help him: Upon landing Rupture Cho gains 6% of movemet speed for each stack of Feast he has (2s).

This way landing Rupture feels more rewarding and stacks actually add some utility to his kit, other than "just health".

if it is a nerf, I had an idea where as you gain more ult stacks, the AOE of you spells increases slightly, just like your aa range. This could be a big help in the mobility meta where 80% of champions that you would want to knock up can dash or run out of your knock up, and it also feels like it would make sense that as the giant beast grows all of his spells grow a little bit too.

Our primary goal with these changes was to give Cho'gaths that fall too far behind (lose all/most of their stacks and can't afford to build them much because they need the CD available) some better options for getting them back, without trivializing stack building. Secondary goals/effects of that change should be a bit of a jungling buff and hopefully a few extra interesting trade offs around who to ult and when. Power wise we were aiming for a slight buff overall, so if we were wrong on that and this is a nerf overall we'll likely follow up with a buff somewhere.

Will you be addressing other champions like Evelynn soon? Pretty please with a cherry on top?

Our primary goal with these changes was to give Cho'gaths that fall too far behind (lose all/most of their stacks and can't afford to build them much because they need the CD available) some better options for getting them back, without trivializing stack building. Secondary goals/effects of that change should be a bit of a jungling buff and hopefully a few extra interesting trade offs around who to ult and when. Power wise we were aiming for a slight buff overall, so if we were wrong on that and this is a nerf overall we'll likely follow up with a buff somewhere.

I had not considered that it would also be a jungle buff. Well thought.

Meddler, if you don't mind me asking, what do you think Cho'Gath's intended role/fantasy is?

Personally, I think of him like a raidboss/protector. He does enough damage and CC threat in melee range so you don't really want to close in on him if you aren't sure you can take him head-on, but he also has some tools to deal with people attacking him from range if you use them skillfully (hitting someone in front of you to hit somebody further back with E spikes, the whole game of hitting/dodging Rupture). And yet, his enemies can capitalize on his relative immobility and relative weakness in laning phase to deal with him. The only case in which he becomes overwhelming in lane is when you're so far behind/he's so far ahead that he can just sustain through your damage - but that's somewhat true for every champion in the game.

And I can't really see you buffing him somewhere easily - his base stats are mostly above average already, with him leading the field (together with Skarner) in base AD. His abilities have good base damages and high scaling, but accessing that damage faces a fair set of restrictions (aiming or short range, his mana costs). His passive is tuned the way it is to avoid oppressiveness in lane.

Only thing you could do there is increase his base AS a little, but lower scaling - so he stays mostly the same if not building AS, but making the stat a little bit more rewarding. But that is just a personal pet peeve of mine.

Reduce the ultimate cool down to 70 seconds and make his Q easier to hit. Increased mobility in the game has really left him feeling meh.

It follows the same logic as Blitzcrank, or Thresh. Once either of those champions uses their hooks in lane, then that gives a window of opportunity for the opposing laners to engage on them. A Blitzcrank with his hook up is scary. A Blitzcrank without his hook is not scary. If Cho'gath uses his ult in lane for a stack, then that gives the opponent opportunity to safely engage on him. In this case, if he ults a minion for the 90hp bonus, it gives the opposing laner 40s of safety, where Cho'Gath has no kill potential, and forces Cho'Gath to play incredibly passively until his ult is up again.

Please. Play the champion before you become an expert on him.