The Ryze nerfs are the perfect example of Riot's inability to balance champions

Acolyte of Steel··2 votes·440 views

Instead of rebalancing him to make him meaningful and something other than brokenly OP, you just nerf his damage instead. Just like everyone else you've "fixed."

Ryze item 3070 Keep this shit up and I'm gonna have to put you in Rune Prison.

Actually FIX your mascot instead of just taking his damage.

16 Comments

BeatzBoyFTW3 votes

So you prefer getting poked whole day by multiple Ryze's Qs from a distance?

Acolyte of Steel2 votes

That's my exact point.* Instead* of making it an issue of

  • You let him farm for 13 levels -> You're gonna feel it

It's now just,

  • Ryze exists on a map and does less damage -> Ryze is still just Ryze, only weaker

I'm sure you can tell this is not an actual solution. It's just Riot wanting to deal with a problem, without actually dealing with it.

Sailor Mint1 votes

One of the highest sustained damage in the game minus (max 20DPS) is still one of the highest damage in the game.

Some of the better fixes (i.e.: rebalancing it to %bonus mana) would hurt is early game even more.

Acolyte of Steel1 votes

I don't mean for Ryze to be the most powerful champion on the Rift. I think his cooldowns and base stats really aught to be taken into account here instead of thinking raw damage output.

The ideal for someone like Ryze I think, should be an effect similar to mage Nasus. Give him long enough, and he'll obliterate you. More on a scale of: [lol this guy]----[eh]----[Uhhh... I NEED a gank]----[oh boy]----[ff please]

I'd really appreciate more of a brusier playstyle for Ryze as well. He's a duelist - there should be SOME exchange going on here, ESPECIALLY against melee champions! That's what dueling is best for!

Sightless661 votes

What's wrong with that? If Ryze doesn't have a major design problem, but he just has a problem of too much strength, what's the problem with just lowering his strength? He still scales ungodly well into the late game, so he's still scary if you let him farm freely for 13 levels. He's just not so strong. There are times when things just need nerfing.

What exactly are you proposing as an alternate solution, or an alternate general balance direction? It's hard to see what exactly you think is wrong when, to me, most alternate directions look like they'd be bad ideas.

Acolyte of Steel1 votes

I'm suggesting he get rebalanced so he's actually legitimately beatable early and mid game against melees - perhaps a longer cooldown on his W (the root,) and his point-and-click spells be changed to require SOME amount of skill. Maybe even a mechanic as simple as timing and chaining your spells appropriately; or better yet, mixing and matching spells for different effects.

Ryze's kit really does synergize a great deal with his character and lore, but if you're not going to actually balance a champion's overall scaling and stats and just nerf damage instead, you might as well change the whole kit. I'd miss his "old" kit since I don't think a new one could fit him better, but if he's broken to fuck and going to get nerfed into oblivion, I'd rather just take a new kit.

EndlessSorcerer2 votes

Eh, most of the complaints I've seen regarding Ryze were about how punishing he early in the game for melee opponents. This way, he takes longer to scale and melee champions can survive lane against him more easily but he's still strong later in the game.

I don't really know. I usually played Irelia, Maokai, and Mundo, so I didn't really have issues surviving in lane against Ryze. Especially since I usually started Doran's Shield and Health Regen quints.

BeatzBoyFTW1 votes

You chose the 3 champs who has good lane sustainability with health gains, unlike Sion Gnar Riven

EndlessSorcerer2 votes

Yeah, that's kinda the point. I chose champions who were capable of surviving in lane and farming against ranged champions while also being able to fight most bruisers relatively well. It stopped me from being countered by a Ryze in lane. Considering the last couple months was pretty much a ranged top lane meta, I'm happy with my choices.

Even if I chose someone else, having Health Regen quints and a Doran's Shield on most champions would be enough to run Ryze oom before you died. At least, as long as you made sure to space out the damage you received and leave yourself time to sit back and heal.

Also, forgot to mention it but Cho'gath is hilarious to take against Ryze. Just max W to poke him down and waveclear. You'll just outsustain anything he tries to do to you and you can kill him at most points of the game..

EffectFX1 votes

They do have an idea of what they're doing. They're aiming to tone down his strong early game since he's designed to scale well into late game. He simply lacked meaningful weakness because he could basically completely zone melee champions in the early game due to ridiculous base damage on a low cooldown targeted poke skill.

Acolyte of Steel1 votes

Even still, this is a worrying pattern we see for most all champions.

Though they weaken his poke, I really think they'll just end up weakening him all together instead of fixing him.

EffectFX1 votes

All they've done currently is not make him quite so overbearing in lane, because frankly it was ridiculous how powerful his early game was for how well he scaled into late game.

Acolyte of Steel1 votes

That's basically my biggest concern. Yes they nerfed him, but that's not to say he's not going to just be completely nerfed to shit and not rebalanced. Ryze could end up our next Irelia or Nautillus; and I really don't want to see that for a character who's lore and personality I love.

EffectFX1 votes

You're concerned that one of the strongest late game champions isn't going to be as ridiculous to lane against anymore for the average character? They may nerf ryze more, and honestly I wouldn't be sad if they did.

Irelia is very strong right now., has been for awhile. Nautilus has never really been directly nerfed, any nerfs are purely because of changes to jungle items.

Acolyte of Steel1 votes

You're concerned that one of the strongest late game champions isn't going to be as ridiculous to lane against anymore for the average character?

No. Good gracious.

I'm concerned that simply nerfing damage and not rebalancing his kit and stats will do nothing helpful, as he's still broken-as-hell Ryze with slightly less damage.

If you ONLY nerf his damage, then his effectiveness as a burst-mage duelist could easily cross the line between viable and non-viable. I'm asking for a genuine rework so Ryze can stop being so OP while still viable. His current kit and stats just don't do that.

EffectFX1 votes

Ok, that's reasonable.

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