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Can we give Jax some changes?

MunchCrunchLunch·Nov 16, 2016·16 votes·1,416 views

The armor and MR on his ult just feels out of place. Jax is no tank hes a fighter, but hes one of the less tanky ones because he doesn't have any form of sustain to drain or even try to facetank anything. he has a shitty early game mostly because hes an auto attacker that scales well with attack speed. but most of his scalings are ap. which means he has to depend on levels than items to scale well. he doesn't scale well with ad. and only hybrid items are useful on him. rageblade is awful. which leaves gunblade. that item is very efficient on him but hes squishy as fuck early on and late game not even a full tank can facetank.

Can we take away the MR armor increase from his ult and buff his base stats anyhow?. just something to make him feel less awful in lane. he can't even beat champions he counters early game its pathetic. yasuo shouldn't beat jax but he does because a janna with her shield on hurts more than jax.

make him scale better with ad while removing some of the ap scalings or at least. making his ap or hybrid builds off meta that are viable .

28 Comments

AirKingNeoNov 16, 20165 votes

You're not Hashinshin but he would agree, Jax is pretty awful right now. Sure he's bias because his main is Jax, but seriously Jax is terrible.

Raise his base AS a bit, increase his base HP by 15, increase base armor by 5, reduce the clunkiness of his Q, change his ult into pure % damage reduction so he isn't blown up by ADCs who build LDR, fix his damn counterstrike and W bugs, and then fix his items.

Gunblade? Give it back 20% spellvamp. Rageblade? Revert the whole "Onhit IE" shit that no one uses and then nerf it into a balance state. BoRK? 8% for melees, 6% for ranged (Stop ADCs from abusing Bruiser items), cost reduced by 200. Maw? Let it stack with Gage again. Sterak's Gage? Revert the nerfs and make it MELEE ONLY. Mallet? Actually gut that item to like 10-15% slow.

AL000Nov 16, 20161 votes

Based Jax is probably most weak as mid champions because he is very item dependent champion.

I disagreed about AS. he could get more than 1.5 with AS item ( item 3078 + item 3153 OR + item 3115 )

But he is better with item 3078 + item 3146 then full tank item... and yes 15% is little low but still burst any squishy champion.

I believe his stats need to be matching against top or jungle champions then nerf some of his kits to be more fun and balance. (I would like to have Jax's passive Grandmaster's Might as true damage so he doesn't need to buy any anti-tank item).

BoilTheOilNov 17, 20161 votes

should be fine next patch cuz rageblade and blade of the ruined king getting buffs next patch

AirKingNeoNov 17, 20161 votes

rageblade change won't effecft jax since it doesn't fix the item

BoilTheOilNov 17, 20161 votes

how wont it help

AirKingNeoNov 17, 20161 votes

Because with 25% extra AS he gets maybe 1 more phantom hit proc per teamfight. That makes 2 procs of it FROM 1. He's still melee and gets no extra bonus for being melee so ranged is still better with it.

BoilTheOilNov 18, 20161 votes

you really dont know how good of a buff this is

MunchCrunchLunchNov 17, 20161 votes

he doesnt synergize with any hp items. because he doesn't scale well with ad. all he scales well with is attack speed and triforce. thats literally it. and ap but thats irrelevant since it just doesn't work on a sustained damage fighter.

AirKingNeoNov 17, 20161 votes

Well Ap doesn't work because he lacks AP items and ratios to use it well. Otherwise item 3152 item 3078 item 3146 item 3115 item 3053

BesthunterjkNov 16, 20164 votes

Revert this:

V4.11

Stats
    Health reduced to 450 from 463
    Health growth reduced to 85 from 98
    Armor growth reduced to 3 from 3.5

AirKingNeoNov 16, 20161 votes

And those rageblade nerfs

Wolfram OxfordNov 16, 20162 votes

He is supposed to be weakest early and strongest late, just keep on playing him and you will get used to it. Plus I would suggest going Trinity Force into some tankier options and then later going back into some damage options. An example build could be; item 3078 item 3068 item 3146 item 3742 item 3065 item 3111 item 2140

MunchCrunchLunchNov 16, 20163 votes

i have quarter a million points on jax. I play every other similar champion few times and they just feel a lot less fraustrating

how much do I gotta invest in him for him to feel rewarding.

GULAG 4 UNov 16, 20162 votes

I mean Aatrox is a lot less satisfying than jax...

oh wait... runnan's hurricane is a champion now??

Erractic EickNov 16, 20162 votes

Well, to be fair, he's a simple champion with an ungodly high skill ceiling. You need nearly impeccable timing, map awareness, and risk-versus-reward-mentality to reach the pinnacle. I mean, look at Worlds! He was nearly picked several times, but teams were afraid to play with him. Even the professionals have a hard time with our favorite Grandmaster, both against him and as him.

Sona x RubickNov 16, 20162 votes

i would rework his entire E first

right now it's just a "don't fight me for 2 seconds and then i stun you" spell rather than something defensive.

DoktorKaiserNov 16, 20162 votes

As RIOT would say, thats who he is, thats his one and only identity, dodge mechanic, its like a monument left from a long lost time in history, it might not be his most healthy skill but neither is Fizz E or Rengar ulti+necklace... Honestly he just needs base stats buff like a base health buff and a huge armor/mr scalling buff because late game he is squishy af even with just triforce while somebody like irelia is tanking for ages.

ZelorxonNov 16, 20161 votes

No.

Erractic EickNov 16, 20161 votes

Okay, before I start, I always like seeing new Jax posts. Furthermore, I fully acknowledge I have a lot less points on the Grandmaster than you, but I'm also a main, so let's talk this out. Finally, I happen to disagree with you, but please don't ignore me just because of that.

I understand why you feel that his ultimate is out of place. I agree, at least, thematically. However, gameplay wise, the ability makes sense.

Jax's gameplay identity revolves around several facets. Let's go through them.

Hybrid Damage Output: Jax is specifically designed to be a melee hypercarry regardless of whether he builds AD or AP. This is reflected in his kit: while he doesn't have great AD scaling (restricted to his Q, E, and ultimate), he can hit the AS ceiling with only two items, some runes, and his passive; meanwhile, you aren't punished for building AP on an attack speed champion thanks to his Leap Strike, Empower, and Ultimate passive and active. Buffing either of these fields is a very dangerous affair, and why buff him anyway when he's in a good spot?

Dueling Strength: The price Jax must pay for his unholy damage output is the fact that he will still have to pentakill the enemy team one person at a time. Jax has only one AOE ability, so his main contribution in team fights is his ability to survive long enough to duel the enemy ADC or Mage to death. He accomplishes this with the combo of his ultimate's active and the E dodge/stun, then using his Q to jump to safety.

Counterplay is a requirement for every good champion design, though, so Jax needs a window of time where he isn't invincible, and that window is when his ultimate is on cooldown.

Glass Cannon viability: Jax is the Grandmaster at Arms. You know that. You have to love him for it. As such, he shouldn't be building tank items. Jax uses weapons, and then (in order to cater to his gameplay as someone who gets into a fight and STAYS) he gets defensive bonuses for them. That was one of the core identities for his theme when he was just released- this champion is meant to run into a fight, go HAM, deal over nine trillion damage, and get the f*ck out before he dies.

Thematically, it doesn't make sense for him to have sustain. His battle output is more like an upside-down parabola, high burst, sucky mid fight, and a destroyer of worlds when you end the battle. Sustain would warp his power windows to make him virtually unkillable by allowing him to survive long enough to kill everything in the late portions of the fight, which would be over powered, which would mean our purple friend gets nerfed, or worse, reworked, and then he'd be banned every game.

I don't think the problem is his kit. I think that ANY problem Jax might have is with the mediocre item choices he is faced with.

FalconPawwwwnchNov 16, 20161 votes

Yea he's trash

been playing him for almost 6 years now and he's never felt so useless aside from after his base stat nerfs

I've come up with tons of suggestions but Riot never answers:

Give Empower or ult proc a .3-.4 bonus AD ratio Fix Leap Strike's clunkiness Actually make him dodge Yasuo's Q (it never dodges right now) make his passive give more AS at lower levels or make it give more AS per stack Give him actual base stats since he has lower base HP and armor than Jayce...

xxxDogmanxxxNov 17, 20161 votes

Problem with Jax is his Counter Strike. He blocks/discourages disgustingly high amounts of damage on his person from ADCs and fellow bruisers using his Counter Strike, AND deals a damaging AoE stun with the same skill. So why does he get to benefit from better base stats when he has a frankly ridiculous skill that other similar champions can never hope to match? His Counter is better than a lot of other champion's ultimates.

For similar reasons, Tryndamere has pretty mediocre base stats due to his ridiculous Ultimate. But unlike Tryndamere, Jax's Counter Strike isn't even on a 90 second cooldown, its on an 8 second cooldown.

MunchCrunchLunchNov 17, 20161 votes

tryndamere gets FREE ad from his Q. tryndamere has a long fucking slow. and also tryndamere has the second highest base hp in the game

2DGirlsOnlyPlzNov 19, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Problem with Jax is his Counter Strike. He blocks/discourages disgustingly high amounts of damage on his person from ADCs and fellow bruisers using his Counter Strike, AND deals a damaging AoE stun with the same skill. So why does he get to benefit from better base stats when he has a frankly ridiculous skill that other similar champions can never hope to match? His Counter is better than a lot of other champion's ultimates.

For similar reasons, Tryndamere has pretty mediocre base stats due to his ridiculous Ultimate. But unlike Tryndamere, Jax's Counter Strike isn't even on a 90 second cooldown, its on an 8 second cooldown.

you'e level 12 why are you pretending to know what you're talking about lol, every single adc with a dash can just dash away as he leaps on to you and dodge the stun.

xxxDogmanxxxNov 19, 20161 votes

Because obviously this isn't a smurf but is my actual only account, amirite? sarcasm/

2DGirlsOnlyPlzNov 25, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Because obviously this isn't a smurf but is my actual only account, amirite? sarcasm/

Well I don't what you're smurfing from but everyone diamond+ realizes how bad he is. There is absolutely 0 reason to pick Jax over Irelia right now

ElegantDogeNov 17, 20161 votes

Jax with item 3078 item 3146 item 3124 +tank items is one of the biggest pressure to deal with in late game though. He destroys turret,he can easily dive you with this build(you can one shot a squischy if you stacked your gunsoo first)

But yeah,he's pretty...weird in the early.His powerspike are not really effective either when he gets trinity compared to Irelia.

But i think he'll be changed in the bruiser update during mid season or something.

TrestaniNov 17, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Jax with +tank items is one of the biggest pressure to deal with in late game though. He destroys turret,he can easily dive you with this build(you can one shot a squischy if you stacked your gunsoo first)

But yeah,he's pretty...weird in the early.His powerspike are not really effective either when he gets trinity compared to Irelia.

But i think he'll be changed in the bruiser update during mid season or something.

Idk why you would ever build guinsoos on jax, it's just not worth it

ElegantDogeNov 17, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Alpha Jax,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HP4k2P1P,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2016-11-17T14:39:30.841+0000)

Idk why you would ever build guinsoos on jax, it's just not worth it

It its if you're splitpushing.It sucks for teamfighting because you can't have your stacks before the fight begin. But when your biggest role to win will be splitpushing it's entirely worth.

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