44 Comments

D357R0Y3R9 votes

pyke and ryze nerf

Good

Düff McWhalen2 votes

{quoted}

pyke and ryze nerf

Good

When did Ryze use AS?

D357R0Y3R8 votes

Since preseason where you could take ap and go resolve?

Chembaron Yamada1 votes

Basically the entire time in pro play (which is actually the only place he is still relevant). Thanks to his point&click hard CC, it increased his safety through bonus resistances and made trades get in his favor by him taking decreased damage in this time.

Rabadong1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Düff McWhalen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GWz9j79m,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-04-18T22:42:20.055+0000)

When did Ryze use AS?

some will take it versus assassins to proc it off his w, combined with the shield he gets off q and those same players generally building mercs/tabis it makes them very unkillable

BLIGHTBRINGER13 votes

###"Ryze nerf"

Poor guy...

https://i.imgur.com/VbEs0Jz.gif[]

Sir Saltarin2 votes

What...no, he needs more nerfs actually, he's still almost pick/ban on pro play.

Nerfing Ryze it's like nerfing Azir, it's never enough and it's always good for the game health.

Jennifer4204 votes

who cares, he gets another rework soon.

Ragnaveil2 votes

You forgot one Lissandra

Neekð1 votes

no i just started playing pyke and galio support :( hehexd

Bob the Toastr2 votes

I'll agree with you on Pyke but Ryze has like a 44% win rate so he didn't really need a nerf lol.

Lissandra, however, did.

D357R0Y3R8 votes

it doesn't matter, please stop using website stats for ryze

his win rate is extremely biased because nobody can play him or KNOWS how to play him outside of high elo

but when it comes to high elo, aftershock ryze is gamebreaking and can 1v9

Sir Saltarin2 votes

Oh, Ryze still needs more nerfs

IP Masquerena1 votes

General players: Ryze is weak, why nerf him more?

Actual high elo: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2214100948851639&id=1857161127878958

Bob the Toastr1 votes

All I got is page not found

IP Masquerena2 votes

Probably an error on facebook.

It's a nice little vid with Ryze being execute range for Urgot R, gets hit by it, dragged in, then gets a 1v5 Pentakill.

EDIT: Ok, I tried to copy the link a bit different, hopefully this helps

https://www.facebook.com/1857161127878958/posts/2214100948851639/

Chembaron Yamada5 votes

So glad about this change.

It was supposed to be the tank keystone and there was nothing wrong with it, they created other keystones for specific target audiences as well, like conqueror. But somehow they came up with the idea that they have to open up this keystone to everyone by giving it AD and AP ratios....

They have to nerf Rammus accordingly, tho, he can abuse these bonus resistances quite well and has not really room for buffs right now.

Bob the Toastr2 votes

Shhh, don't remind them about Rammus XD

Anu3isII1 votes

It is funny how this change indirectly buffs his in-kit + item 3075 Damage because of his huge Armor Scalings.

Critmaster Garen5 votes

holy shit, this is a massive buff for tanks.

just to put this into perspective. a midgame Ornn around lvl 13 with just item 3111 item 3373 item 3379 and conditioning gains about a 130 armor and 145 mr on aftershock instead of about 100.

full build at lvl 18, it would be around 200 armor and 180 mr instead of 120 on both. can vary up or down, depending if he buys item 3193 and how many enemies are nearby in that case.

either way, its a pretty clear buff for tanks like him.

D357R0Y3R2 votes

taking aftershock on ornn instead of grasp

nice

Critmaster Garen2 votes

{quoted}

taking aftershock on ornn instead of grasp

nice

maybe when they buff the shit out of it for champions like him, then yes?

compared to the current aftershock, grasp wins, but does it still when it provides almost 100 armor and mr more during the proc later on, and 4% max health damage instead of 3?

time will tell.

Salron2 votes

taking aftershock instead of grasp means you're severely hampering your ability to lane and trade

Iota Theta1 votes

{quoted}

taking aftershock instead of grasp means you're severely hampering your ability to lane and trade

I wouldn’t say severely.

It’s a tradeoff. Grasp is for lane and sustaining, but isn’t really as good once you get out of lane phase, aftershock is more for the resistances and for in teamfights. However, on Ornn, Aftershock in trades can’t be discounted too much, as it’s easy for him to proc and the resistances can help make up for the loss of his shield.

wolvius1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Iota Theta,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GWz9j79m,comment-id=00030000000000000000,timestamp=2019-04-19T12:49:33.629+0000)

I wouldn’t say severely.

It’s a tradeoff. Grasp is for lane and sustaining, but isn’t really as good once you get out of lane phase, aftershock is more for the resistances and for in teamfights. However, on Ornn, Aftershock in trades can’t be discounted too much, as it’s easy for him to proc and the resistances can help make up for the loss of his shield.

A thing I've found from playing him on ARAM is it's nearly too easy to proc, someone gets displaced by your pillar and you have no keystone for 40 seconds. Does seem like a better option with the new scaling and the increased stats from his masterworks.

Iota Theta1 votes

{quoted}

A thing I've found from playing him on ARAM is it's nearly too easy to proc, someone gets displaced by your pillar and you have no keystone for 40 seconds. Does seem like a better option with the new scaling and the increased stats from his masterworks.

Yeah. That’s a catch. I’ll sometimes take advantage of it to dive in when in lane, especially with E’s scaling, so I get some use. Teamfight phase I’m generally more conservative with Qs until we engage or counter-engage. My bigger complaint stays the same as when it was Courage of the Colossus: they should implement a radius to how far it can proc. If you happen to hit a max range Ornn ult, it’s gonna proc with likely no one nearby.

Yeah, I’m looking forward to the scaling bonus, since it was designed originally for tanks and taken from an old tank keystone, and now it fits us really well again to get a resist spike.

Iota Theta1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GWz9j79m,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-04-18T23:23:52.435+0000)

holy shit, this is a massive buff for tanks.

just to put this into perspective. a midgame Ornn around lvl 13 with just item 3111 item 3373 item 3379 and conditioning gains about a 130 armor and 145 mr on aftershock instead of about 100.

full build at lvl 18, it would be around 200 armor and 180 mr instead of 120 on both. can vary up or down, depending if he buys item 3193 and how many enemies are nearby in that case.

either way, its a pretty clear buff for tanks like him.

As an Ornn fan....I love this. It’s not too much extra, all things considered, but it’s nice, especially since I already like to run it on him.

This is probably for the best. Dive heavy champs can still make use of it and get a nice defense spike, and tanks can get a but more value of it than they do with the flat. It’s not a super huge increase for tanks until later in the game with multiple resist items.

Düff McWhalen3 votes

Nice. That takes it off the people abusing it like Liss and leaves tanks alone!

Daddy Ants1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Düff McWhalen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GWz9j79m,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-04-18T22:23:33.624+0000)

Nice. That takes it off the people abusing it like Liss and leaves tanks alone!

It's not gonna stop Lissandra and Fiddlesticks from using it.

70 Armor and MR when you CC someone is still huge... especially for squishy ranged mages like Liss and Fidd.

Only way they stop them abusing it is if Aftershock grants reduced resistances for Ranged champions.

FCJAAAAGOOOO1 votes

Now they need to do something with Conqueror.

iiGazeii1 votes

The tank keystone that grants armor scaling off of tank stats? It's almost like we've been asking for exactly this since Runes Reforged. Better late than never.

DorkunedAuras1 votes

You do realize that it did this at first, and it was busted on tanks (Rammus) who could gain huge bonus stats (Rammus) to stack multiplicatively with it (Rammus)

Iota Theta1 votes

{quoted}

You do realize that it did this at first, and it was busted on tanks (Rammus) who could gain huge bonus stats (Rammus) to stack multiplicatively with it (Rammus)

Funnily enough, when I looked back on why it got changed, Rammus was never mentioned, but rather Alistar and another support for their resists and damage, but that was the damage part. The bonus resists was to make it more appealing to divers. Rammus and other scaling champs were never mentioned, at least in the patch notes..which is where I would expect that.

KFCeytron1 votes

Draven looking for a new keystone yet again. Maybe the pros will switch to Fleet.

BLIGHTBRINGER1 votes

Trying to think if you're being sarcastic here or not...

Since I never once saw Aftershock being used on Draven.

KFCeytron1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Darkin Hybrid,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GWz9j79m,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2019-04-19T07:31:28.048+0000)

Trying to think if you're being sarcastic here or not...

Since I never once saw Aftershock being used on Draven.

Sadly, no, not sarcasm. After the Conqueror change, most of the Challenger Draven players I spectated through the client were using Aftershock.

SgtAwesomeness1 votes

We should be vocal here. A step in the right direction

Hawthorn Tree1 votes

I don't see what changed...? Champions like Lissandra will still get 70 resists the moment she lands any hard CC on anyone, and this starts right when people are walking into lane with 500G worth of items. Did I perhaps miss the part where Lissandra and Sylas chained the 15% AD + 10% AP damage into some oneshot combo?

taleofsonata1 votes

It's already too late, Lissandra is already non existant.

The23rdGamer1 votes

Good thing this is getting nerfed to be useful on tanky champions instead of making squishy champions tanky for free.

4nswer1 votes

considering it's oppressive in early lane phase for cc supports Alistar Thresh Pyke Nautilus Blitzcrank, this nerf really doesn't do much there...

Bisaknosp1 votes

this shit doesnt do anything early

BigFBear1 votes

Actually its a nerf for a part of Aftershock target group.

The change was made to kick champs like Liss out of Aftershock but it also nerfed it for bulky bruisers and Juggernauts who build a lot of health but maybe not so much armor. My Voli for example: Often i build something like item 1401 -> item 3111 -> item 3800 -> item 3053 on him. Thats only 30 Bonus Armor. So instead of 111 Armor from Aftershock at lvl 15 i only get 85 (70+15) Armor from Aftershock. Same goes for AP Resi. In that build above i only have 25 AP Resi (=12,5 on Aftershock). That means 111 on old aftershock at lvl 15. 82,5 on new Aftershock. And Aftershock is the only Resolve rune Voli can take in jungle....

Some "tanky" Items that suck with new Aftershock: item 3083 item 3022 item 3053 item 3800

I would like to see something like: ** [50% of your bonus resist OR 1,5% of your max health]**

So if you have built massive armor in lategame (lets say item 3047 item 3742 item 3109 ) you have 120 bonus armor = 130 (70+60) Armor on Aftershock. But if you didnt build heavy armor but therefore you have 3000 max HP (1,5%=45) you get still 115 (70+45) bonus resists on Aftershock.

I mean... i would LOVE to take another Resolve keystone but sadly there is not much to chose...

Saezio1 votes

OK, I love this change. Should have been a thing since the inception of AS. But why did they add the cap? It's like... they don't want even for a second tanks to be slightly stronger than they intend. They are always adding stupid conditions and whatnot to tanky stuff and they only do it for damage shit after they are already broken.

Love the change though Riot. Gotta say the good things too.

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