will players incorporate the new black cleaver into their builds?

Son Olivia Hye·Apr 29, 2015·1 votes·684 views

Any thoughts on this? I think the new Black Cleaver is more for like tanks now.

13 Comments

StephenizgodApr 29, 20152 votes

It was core on Garen, i think it still will be with that movespeed bonus while spinning plus his Q.

Nidalee SO NYAAAApr 29, 20152 votes

On Riven hell yes I will

EndlessSorcererApr 29, 20151 votes

I'm definitely going to be incorporating it into a few champion builds now.

Nasus might enjoy item 3025 item 3065 item 3071 since it actually lets him get armor penetration without sacrificing much and should be worth trying.

Gnar should love it for the armor pen and CDR. I'd typically get Frozen Mallet as my 'offensive' item before to let me kite and chase, but this has a much better build path and CDR.

It should let Darius have an easier time sticking to targets and make him more durable early.

ZarxisApr 29, 20151 votes

I already used it on Garen and Darius, and I plan on continuing to do so. Will it be good on ADCs? Maybe. It could be a situational survivability+penetration item. Will it be good on AD assassins? Only if they're building as fighters instead of glass cannon, I think.

YuumidiocreApr 29, 20151 votes

aka talon lol

YuumidiocreApr 29, 20151 votes

Havent gotten a chance to use it yet. but i think it'll be a great thing on pantheon. more than it already was

pE4CbxDPQOApr 29, 20151 votes

Volibear

ModWulf HelhammerApr 29, 20151 votes

I know I will be building it for at least 1 game when the new Ashe comes up. Her flurry Q applies 5 stacks in one attack

TheGrandAllianceApr 29, 20151 votes

If you're Fiora ....

Well maybe we have more of a chance now...

LoLKiruApr 29, 20151 votes

Talon can probably still do crazy things with it, since his bleed is physical damage.

Ashe will be a really interesting case if her mini-rework goes through as it is now, since her Q can apply 5 stacks per auto.

Lost RApr 29, 20151 votes

Going down the list?

Aatrox Braum Corki Darius Fiora Garen JarvanIV Jax Hecarim Gnar Graves Kalista Jinx Jayce LeeSin Lucian MasterYi MissFortune Olaf Pantheon Quinn RekSai Renekton Rengar Riven Sion Sivir Talon Taric Tristana Trundle Tryndamere Twitch Udyr Varus Vayne Volibear MonkeyKing XinZhao Yasuo Zed

Granted, I omitted a few champions that might benefit from it more than I am crediting them. I'm also inclined to build it on someone like Lulu because I'm poking the enemy repeatedly with my basic attacks, I might as well shred their armor while I'm at it (which I already do with Magic Resist item 3091 ) Anyone who's dealing physical damage for most of their damage will benefit from it, or just anyone who's going to stick to the enemy like glue; that's why Braum's on my list.

"But Last Whisper ignores 35% armor!" ~ Random scrub

The game's not just about you. Besides, the Cleaver also gives 20% cooldown, 400 HP and a speed buff, and it shreds the enemy's armor rather than ignoring it. Only one person needs to build a Black Cleaver for everyone to benefit from it (actually being there to shred the enemy's armor is a different story), no matter how slight, while everyone would have to build the Last Whisper to have roughly the same benefit for the armor pen ALONE, which is titanic gold inefficiency (3000 for a BC, and 2300 x 5 = 11200 for five Last Whispers). It was titanic gold inefficiency even before the item was buffed.

Son Olivia HyeApr 30, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lost R,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=G3JrUtQ6,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2015-04-29T19:00:31.113+0000)

Going down the list?

Granted, I omitted a few champions that might benefit from it more than I am crediting them. I'm also inclined to build it on someone like Lulu because I'm poking the enemy repeatedly with my basic attacks, I might as well shred their armor while I'm at it (which I already do with Magic Resist ) Anyone who's dealing physical damage for most of their damage will benefit from it, or just anyone who's going to stick to the enemy like glue; that's why Braum's on my list.

The game's not just about you. Besides, the Cleaver also gives 20% cooldown, 400 HP and a speed buff, and it shreds the enemy's armor rather than ignoring it. Only one person needs to build a Black Cleaver for everyone to benefit from it (actually being there to shred the enemy's armor is a different story), no matter how slight, while everyone would have to build the Last Whisper to have roughly the same benefit for the armor pen ALONE, which is titanic gold inefficiency (3000 for a BC, and 2300 x 5 = 11200 for five Last Whispers). It was titanic gold inefficiency even before the item was buffed.

so you would recommend a black cleaver over a last whisper?

Lost RMay 1, 20151 votes

Depending on the champion, but yes. Nuking power champions like Talon or Zed might as well just focus on a Last Whisper, as they aren't going to be around long enough (ideally) to gain the full benefit of the Cleaver. Champions that require they stick around and focus on the enemy (particularly due to skills like Vayne and Vi's W) or who deal physical damage to a crowd or damage over an extended period of time (Darius, Garen, Wukong, Corki) should get a Cleaver. Again, depending on how much they're actually around the fights, the Cleaver is much more gold efficient when you're talking about bypassing the enemy's armor.

Olaf, more than anyone else, benefits from the new Black Cleaver. He's always had sticking problems because of a lack of any real crowd control and being a close-ranged champion; anyone with a modicum of mobility made it extremely difficult for him to stick. With the speed in his favor, he can more easily chase down escapees and finish the job.