Lee sin isn't broken but what's his counterplay?

KONO RUBICK DA·May 2, 2017·7 votes·1,497 views

Hear me out, i don't think lee is broken because his win rate in plat+ is trash

but what's his counterplay except "dodge his Q" that is impossible in melee range/if he kicks you lee is a stat-checking champion without stats, BECAUSE HIS SPELLS ARE STRONG EVERYWHERE

People tell you that yasuo has no counterplay but his E is trash without minion, his W is trash without projectiles or if you go inside the wall, his damage are low to a tank without ult, his base stats compensate his shield

but lee? his W is a shield+ free lifesteal/spell vamp his E is a non-dodgeable area nuke+slow his ult a point and click nuke+knock back his passive is an almost permanent 40% attack speed

playing against lee in high elo is one of the worst experience in this game, you just hope that what he does isn't enough, his shield isn't enough, his damage isn't enough

16 Comments

hollow minusMay 2, 20173 votes

just wait him out eventually he becomes nothing.

EinarUlfarMay 2, 20171 votes

10 Bans will remove him for life lel

MíelláMay 2, 20172 votes

Ahh someone that doesnt play Lee: Facts about Lee: All the mechanics he has are unbelieveable hard to master. His Ult Q Combo can be fucked up and then he's going to save you while trying to kill you. His Passive could be used wrong. His shield is weak at late lvls and wont be even useable cuz you mostly use your W for ward hopping. His Livesteal is strong but depends on the AD you have and the Armor the enemy has + doesnt last long. And his E has a 0,7 sec Cast Time, you can dodge it.

Counterplay: Dodge his Q. Try to predict his moves. Buy Quicksilver and cleanse out of his ult or take cleanse right away. Stay out of his Melee range so that he cant Auto you, even if he does his W Heal is pretty weak.

You'll only have problems against him in early lvl's simply cuz of his dmg potential. In late game he is just there to kick someone of your team into your whole team or into the enemy team. If the Lee has the skill of Insec, he might be a problem even in late.

MíelláMay 2, 20171 votes

Also he is pretty squishy with out any tank items.

6SfoolMay 2, 20171 votes

Him being hard to play doesn't justify being oppressive. Sure, you should be rewarded for mastering any champ, but in most cases counterplay still applies. Problem is- all his more advanced mechanics like insec eliminate his weaknesses, and you end up with a champ that has incredibly limited counterplay. I don't think he should be gutted, but I think his mechanics should stop covering his ass for bad decisionmaking. If he engages from the wrong side, he should have a hard time ulting people in the right direction. If he makes a bad engage and starts losing a duel, he should have a good chance of dying.

DukuesMay 2, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Him being hard to play doesn't justify being oppressive. Sure, you should be rewarded for mastering any champ, but in most cases counterplay still applies. Problem is- all his more advanced mechanics like insec eliminate his weaknesses, and you end up with a champ that has incredibly limited counterplay. I don't think he should be gutted, but I think his mechanics should stop covering his ass for bad decisionmaking. If he engages from the wrong side, he should have a hard time ulting people in the right direction. If he makes a bad engage and starts losing a duel, he should have a good chance of dying.

Maybe... and hear me out... just play him? Play him a few games and then you will know. It's not easy to just walk in and get a perfect kick the right way and if it is its probably because your team is really damn bad at positioning themselves. But hey! If you play him and know what he does and how far he can jump or kick etc. then you know where to avoid and probably what the player is thinking. Then you no longer will care about LeeSin because you will avoid his q or ward hop and then blow him up with some CC.

He is mobile and strong early but falls of later. If you know this.. you know to look for early invades, gank, if you playing jungle or a lane. So when people feed the shit out of a lee because they literally let him walk down river and continuously gank them or don't go to their jungler when the jungler pings lee in jungle on their red buff its hard to feel bad for those players.

DukuesMay 2, 20171 votes

All I am saying is... I hear people bitch about him all the time and I am shit elo. I have always been shit elo and will always be shit elo. I don't complain about LeeSin because I have tried to play him many times and fail. Plus... I almost never struggle against him because for rounding purposes 10- 15% (probably actually less) can play him properly. That means that 9/10 times when your getting stomped by a LeeSin and your not in say top 15% of players it's because you, your team, or all the above are bad.

I know I am bad, I know the probability of the LeeSin I am playing is that their bad. I know lee is strong early and can snowball so I am more cautious early game. I also know he can get blown up if cc'd and goes in at the wrong time and/or that once he has used his combo his burst is down for a bit so you can turn and do damage to him without taking much. Its like low elo players forget that once he uses his ult combo or Qs and E and w/e that he has cds where he won't be doing much damage. And if you manage to avoid the burst of his first attack well then fighting him until is q comes back up provides very little threat.

PePsiLemoNNMay 2, 20171 votes

his E is a non-dodgeable area nuke+slow

Ye man , hate getting nuked by those damn Lee E's

KONO RUBICK DAMay 2, 20171 votes

doesn't it deal like 200+100% bonus ad?

that's 300 damage with black cleaver+warrior yes it's a nuke

PePsiLemoNNMay 2, 20171 votes

That's 300 dmg at rank 5 (level 18 , he maxes it last) and with 0 MR. ;)

Asayake 5150glowMay 2, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Negan fanboy124,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FtEnes18,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2017-05-02T17:37:22.400+0000)

doesn't it deal like 200+100% bonus ad?

that's 300 damage with black cleaver+warrior yes it's a nuke

Q's are a way scarier nuke, they're 380 + 180% bonus AD :/

DukuesMay 2, 20171 votes

Unless the LeeSin is in plat I don't worry about them. He just takes so many games and mechanics to master. Not that elo means everything but usually until players get to around Plat I never worry about him. Yea sometimes you find an ok lower elo LeeSin but he not usually the only reason your team lost.

DreadlocksMay 2, 20171 votes

One of lee sin's biggest counters his Health.. Which is why he wasn't popular for a really long time when rek'sai and gragas were running the jungle.

SB ArneemanMay 2, 20171 votes

The thing about Lee is that he falls of a lot lategame. His q is pretty easy to dodge, even though I play immobile mages I dodge a lot of them. You can also flash mid ult animation to get knocked to a place of your choice. I do agree that he's too strong though, in the hands of a good player. It's also possible to cancel his q mid-flight with pretty much any hard-cc if you time it properly. Even when playing mages it's possible to cancel it with Syndra e, Ziggs w, and even Anivia wall.

Asayake 5150glowMay 2, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=SB Arneeman,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FtEnes18,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-05-02T19:15:32.969+0000)

The thing about Lee is that he falls of a lot lategame. His q is pretty easy to dodge, even though I play immobile mages I dodge a lot of them. You can also flash mid ult animation to get knocked to a place of your choice. I do agree that he's too strong though, in the hands of a good player. It's also possible to cancel his q mid-flight with pretty much any hard-cc if you time it properly. Even when playing mages it's possible to cancel it with Syndra e, Ziggs w, and even Anivia wall.

You can't flash during his R animation, it roots you. You can, however, flash before it.

Meep ManMay 2, 20171 votes

I think Lee Sin would be less frustrating if his Q had a higher cool down, lower damage on the projectile, but more damage on the actual kick. Or something like that. It's frustrating to dodge it and have it be back only about 5 seconds later with only a few items.