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Can we please change Duskblade's passive?

Josh Sand··58 votes·13,821 views

Maintaining vision control in some of these games is outright ridiculous. I can't effectively keep wards up vs. 2 or 3 Duskblade users.

Two Duskblade users on autopilot can literally blackout an entire quarter of the map by accident, without carrying the strategic intention to clear vision.

Countering vision was something people actually had to strategically think about in this game. At least with the sweeper you have to make the conscious effort to click the button. Now you just stroll around and Ez mode ward clear. I mean, wasn't this the same passive that ruled out us having Oracle's Elixir?

It's insanely frustrating to see the most common assassin item have two passives that fuel each other to that degree. At least with Locket or Warmogs, you have to meet the condition to make it a worthwhile purchase. Assassins can buy Duskblades and make the vision game completely trivial.

Like I get it... assassins are supposed to feel like fucking Dante when you play them... jumping over walls, teleporting around, going invisible, whatever... but at least give me a chance to establish some warning notice that my carry is about to get one-shot right in front of my eyes. Thanks.

24 Comments

Its All Skillzz20 votes

Item should be deleted, caused nothing but problems since its inception.

YumaS2Astral3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Its All Skillzz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FmqUJoPT,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-06-26T03:31:07.959+0000)

Item should be deleted, caused nothing but problems since its inception.

This item was actually healthy before its last rework.

Before then, it used to be like nowadays. Except that it did true damage. Sounds broken, right? Not when you consider that it had 75 base damage, although it had a 200% lethality scaling. This made this item only efficient on dedicated lethality builds. It also had no cooldown reduction.

Even before that it used to have no vision control passive, and its damage passive was completely different. It was like a mini Zed ult that did damage based on your missing health. It could secure the kill but had a lot of counterplay because the damage was delayed.

I wish Riot reverted Duskblade to one of those versions. This item was actually not problematic at all. It was its latest rework that made Duskblade a balancing nightmare.

Śhunpo16 votes

Remove it. This is coming from an assassin main. The item is disgusting and it is by far THE worst crutch item to ever exist in League.

Emo Twink5 votes

i agree with you but also i dont want even more compensation buffs to assassins, like when it got a slight nerf. mages never got one with mana changes, supports didnt get any with forbidden idol nerfs (esp karma), so assassins shouldnt of gotten one..

Śhunpo3 votes

{quoted}

i agree with you but also i dont want even more compensation buffs to assassins, like when it got a slight nerf. mages never got one with mana changes, supports didnt get any with forbidden idol nerfs (esp karma), so assassins shouldnt of gotten one..

Honestly I'd say remove the item for a patch and don't do anything. If AD assassins are underperforming adjust their base stats. and ratios accordingly.

Leti Antrax6 votes

I agree with you, as a main support I find extremely difficult to control the vision with that horrible item, plus the part that melee champions can remove the ward with one basic attack and it just feels incredibly unfair at least for me, because you can't put another one, because the passive remains active for 8 seconds so they can give another basic attack and remove it again or simply jump on you and kill you, because you can see nothing.

Troll for Trump5 votes

Ok a mistake (in my opinion) riot made a long time (even before this) was creating ward limits and preventing you from getting unlimited wards. A lot of people hated that change and I still do.

I don't know if others agree with me at this point, but vision really helped encourage strategic gameplay.

Dreadlocks2 votes

Pretty much.. Removing wards makes players take less risks.. So if a player thinks he is safe due to wards, he's going to take more chances, and sometimes, he reads the map wrong.

ChaddyFantome2 votes

too much vision i actually broken. It make sit so there aren't enough room for mistakes to be capitalised on.

Troll for Trump1 votes

Yes it does. You could better know the position of jglers/laners and take objectives/play aggro/play defensive based on that. You could all in when the enemy laner makes a mistake with less risk rather than the current state where all-in is 50-50 win or lose based on jgl

YumaS2Astral5 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ðownright Darius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FmqUJoPT,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-06-26T01:22:53.172+0000)

Ok a mistake (in my opinion) riot made a long time (even before this) was creating ward limits and preventing you from getting unlimited wards. A lot of people hated that change and I still do.

I don't know if others agree with me at this point, but vision really helped encourage strategic gameplay.

They created ward limits so that supports wouldn't be treated as ward bots.

Before this change, as a support, you would buy one gold generation item, at best two. The rest of your inventary would be wards.

This was ridiculous. Limiting wards allowed them to actually have a build.

Troll for Trump1 votes

Yeah but why couldn't they just let you buy wards in the trinket slot..

Zeromatsu4 votes

I wouldn't even mind the passive if Riot didn't go full retard mode and made them one hit wards. Before the amount of wards someone could clear with it was limited due to the duration and the time that AAs take. Now they can clear like 3 or 4 wards at once.

It's so funny if someone with duskblade walks up to a pink ward and needs only 1 AA even tho the ward isn't invisible and shouldn't trigger the damn passive.

TangoMango334 votes

I find as an assassin main that it's stupid that I can walk around the enemy jungle, deny all of their vision, take their buffs, then get a kill off of the duskblade damage passive.

Ifneth1 votes

Drafting two AD assassins forces the team to establish substantial gold leads in two roles, a large gold in one role, or risk being severely outscaled by armor. Getting two Blackout passives if they both rush Duskblade prevents the enemy team from hard-countering that strategy with vision alone.

The bigger problem with the item is its effect in solo-queue, where its self-synergy creates the opportunity for even one user to severely punish even small lapses of communication or map awareness. Furthermore, if the Duskblade user already has the small lead needed to kill quickly and reliably, then enemy carries cannot safely rotate through their own jungle without seeing the Duskblade user on the map. Establishing that lead in lane or through a jungle skirmish can create the feeling that the passive is either terrifying or just a way to deny the enemy team vision of your jungle for a while.

If you’re the Support trying to react to this, then you have no influence on which case happens or way to interact with a snowballing Duskblade user. That’s the biggest problem I see.

YumaS2Astral2 votes

{quoted}

Drafting two AD assassins forces the team to establish substantial gold leads in two roles, a large gold in one role, or risk being severely outscaled by armor. Getting two Blackout passives if they both rush Duskblade prevents the enemy team from hard-countering that strategy with vision alone.

The bigger problem with the item is its effect in solo-queue, where its self-synergy creates the opportunity for even one user to severely punish even small lapses of communication or map awareness. Furthermore, if the Duskblade user already has the small lead needed to kill quickly and reliably, then enemy carries cannot safely rotate through their own jungle without seeing the Duskblade user on the map. Establishing that lead in lane or through a jungle skirmish can create the feeling that the passive is either terrifying or just a way to deny the enemy team vision of your jungle for a while.

If you’re the Support trying to react to this, then you have no influence on which case happens or way to interact with a snowballing Duskblade user. That’s the biggest problem I see.

You know it is not just AD assassins that use Duskblade, right?

Jayce JarvanIV Jhin Quinn Jhin

Kynami1 votes

MissFortune Definitely has a following for it now and then...

Onerios2 votes

J4 kind of does act as an assassin when he goes for his lethality build, so should probably not be on the list, but otherwise your right, there are ranged champions who sometimes opt into it instead of ghostblade.

Rathar Dashing1 votes

Draven

Paroe1 votes

@thread Havent you realized riots been on a war against vision for a LONG time?

If it were up to them, there would only ever be six wards on the map at any given time; Scuttle and five red wards.

Morticianjohn2 votes

It is up to them

Altiverse1 votes

While I totally like the idea of roles that aren't supports being able to itemize towards vision-control, I completely agree that the way it's executed in Duskblade's passive is utterly toxic... where assassins absentmindedly clear out vision solely for selfish reasons, namely feeding the other Duskblade passive with it and being able to oneshot someone out of fog of war while using it.

It would be far better if it was some sort of active instead.

RekSai CoffeeCo1 votes

Play Aram then you wont have to worry about it on Scuttle Crab Rift (can't actually believe people still play after these last 3 patches that gutted the map.)

GodlyBane1 votes

no

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