@Riot: So you're thinking about putting Aegis/Locket down...

chipndip1·Oct 2, 2016·5 votes·924 views

I have a few questions, and as much as I know I'm not entitled to answers, I would WEALLY APPWECIATE ONE!

So assuming we're RiP'in these two items a new hole...in the dirt

Where does this leave Banner of Command? Will it be the same thing made with a new component? Will its active be moved to a new item? Will banner minions just be a thing of the past forever?
What types of options are we looking at to replace Aegis/Locket? Personally think it'd be good to have some sort of shielding option we can buy outside of the Relic line.

That's basically it.

18 Comments

LephogamOct 2, 20163 votes

Since Riot is removing (might be??) Aegis/locket, I wouldn't be surprised if they removed Banner of command and Frozen Heart as well since they all contain hidden powers that Riot is looking to supress in items.

ZT XperimentorOct 2, 20161 votes

Unfortunately riot refuses to do that with most champions that have been problimatic because of such mechanics . . .

KirbyCakeOct 2, 20161 votes

frozen heart is not a team buff, why would it get nerfed?

honestly these highly gold efficient items should have been removed from the game a long time ago, its literally a win harder item for whichever team has it the other team doesn't just because its a huge stat stick with no drawbacks.

chipndip1Oct 2, 20161 votes

Smart point. I'll just edit it out.

As for the other part of your response, I mean...there's no drawback to buying Crucible either, right? My issue is that Locket's shield alone has the value of up to 11.5 Ruby Crystals, which adds up to about 4.6k gold in effective health via the shield at max level. Even though it rarely gets that strong, the point is that this is A LOT of power on one active.

AptestOct 2, 20162 votes

The shield is worth 2-3 ruby crystals at a best case scenario.

unless your team is complete shit and then the shield is worth the full 11.5 but also your entire team is dead which would make the shield worth 0.

Overall the shield is actually the healthy part. It's the Aegis aura that's an issue.

chipndip1Oct 2, 20161 votes

It's effective health. At about 345 health at level 18 per person, it adds up to about 2.33 Ruby Crystals per teammate. This is multiplied by up to 5 times. The gold value of this if it gets all 5 teammates is over 4k per activation...on like a 1 minute cd. This item scales insanely hard into the late-game and it only costs 2.5k to buy.

AptestOct 2, 20163 votes

that is incorrect math because all your "value" variable are at their maximum theoretical value as opposed to their actual expected value.

we expect that the item will be used mostly at levels 10-14. you say, level 18. we expect damage to be taken by 1-2 team members, and for the rest the shield will either time out (shielded member took no damage, shield has no value) or be out of activation range. you also assume maximum shielding efficiency. whereas it's quite probable you'll not manage to shield the "money skills" for the other team and only shield residual damage which will be shielded completely - making the shield worth even less.

overall your usage of theoretical best case multiplies the expected gained value by several times what will actually be gained.

chipndip1Oct 2, 20161 votes

If you're someone that can't tag more than 2 people including yourself using a Locket, why are you using a Locket?

That aside, I should have said and meant to say that the value of the active can scale up to over 4k in value by level 18, not that it blatantly is from the jump. Regardless, thing's still strong. Even if you assume you're level 10, tagging all five of your teammates is still a gold value of over 1k in effective health. That's 3 kills worth of gold in health spread around your team assuming everyone gets the shield, all on a 1 minute cd, just for buying this item, and it only gets stronger.

RisenDarkKnightOct 2, 20161 votes

Every support buys locket, you get flamed if you don't. You might only tag two people because you might be sitting back with your adc peeling for him while your top/mid/jungle dive squad is on their backline therefore out of locket range.

And even if you tag all 5 of your teammates with locket shield, they usually aren't all taking damage during those 2 seconds.

Yes if you use it pre-emptively right before a 5 man kennen/annie ult it's ridiculously efficient, but if your team spreads out or the enemy doesn't have huge AOE spells, it's not as strong as you're implying.

IMO Riot should keep locket in some form, remove aegis. Passive Aura MR is more powerful than a 2 second shield IMO. The 2 second shield can be baited out, or be built specifically to counter a wombo combo team, while Aegis is just good everygame, unless the enemy team is all AD.

chipndip1Oct 2, 20161 votes

My issue is that as long as it's a big ass team-wide shield, this item is ALWAYS going to be mandatory. It should probably only heal you and one person, or be a shield charged by the amount of damage you take before activating it. Something that keeps it from just tossing out a potentially straight busted amount of shielding for free over 5 people.

Although, if you ask me, I think it'd be better as a shield for you and one other guy.

RisenDarkKnightOct 2, 20161 votes

Yeah that makes sense, I think it will become less mandatory in solo queue if they remove the aegis part, but support or junglers will always have to build it in competitive if they keep the 5 man shield.

They would have to make sufficiently different from Face of the Mountain if they keep it though.

chipndip1Oct 2, 20161 votes

I agree, but how's the hard part.

BloodyTomponOct 2, 20161 votes

I would appweciate if people didn't laugh at my fwend in Wome. Or his wife, Incontinentia.

Athenes LuluOct 2, 20161 votes

That is a very good question and therefore this thread should be bumped [slayer-jinx-wink]
Most likely they're getting rid of the "aura so team can have more MR and hp regen" half, though the multi-man shield may as well stay with more shielding power, but selfish-stat focused.

Riot values timings, and have been well aware that "permanent auras" are unhealthy in a PvP environment. We all remember what happened to old Sona and why a lot of aura items were removed, and why Lulu's point and click abilities are still a thing.

AptestOct 2, 20161 votes

Auras are a problem because of 2 issues:

From a power level the power is both hidden (you can't see it when you see the opponent's items) and inconsistent (the aura giver must be within range), as well as having very low level of gameplay attached to them (be in range of ally).
From a satisfaction point of view, auras give a lot of power but most of it is usable by people who did not buy the aura themselves. MR aura is really strong on the person who has a ton of HP or the person who can lifesteal and just needs to not insta-die but the guy who bought the aura does not have a big bunch of HP so he's still squishie. Lifesteal aura is strong if you have big AA damage, not if you have no AA items at all. MR shred aura is really fun for a person with a ton of ability damage. So you buy the item, and the ADC is having more fun. When the effective win the game option is less fun than other options, it is a problem.