Just because someone is in a low rank doesn't mean they're automatically wrong or inqualified.

JamesTheMage17·Aug 17, 2016·132 votes·7,045 views

Don't judge people based off rank, it's just sad. Every time I make a post that uses some kind of opinion, I get down voted to hell and get multiple hate-comments because I'm in bronze II. Who has more experience: A player for two years in bronze I Or a player for one year in gold I

Go ahead and argue all you want but it's obviously the bronze guy.

So when someone of a low rank disagrees with you and that's all you can say to them, ("you're bronze so you're wrong", etc) that's truly sad on your part.

434 Comments

venomous frostAug 17, 201626 votes

Bronze opinions on balance do not matter, they aren't even playing the game correctly

I don't even consider my opinion on balance one of much value

JamesTheMage17Aug 17, 201625 votes

[{quoted}](name=venomous frost,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EfJIEgVB,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-08-17T14:16:18.002+0000)

Bronze opinions on balance do not matter, they aren't even playing the game correctly

I don't even consider my opinion on balance one of much value

Completely wrong. Bronze players like me could play for years and never even touch the ranked button, doesn't make them inexperienced or the dumbasses you just made them out to be.

RalanrAug 17, 201638 votes

Actually they need to touch the ranked button at least 10 times to be bronze.

Right on everything else though.

manbearswineAug 17, 201612 votes

{quoted}

Right on everything else though.

Like what? I seriously respect unranked more than bronze, bronze is basically a certificate of incompetence, at least the unranked is unranked.

SquishieAug 18, 20162 votes

Unranked with more than 400 normal games is a pussy.

manbearswineAug 18, 20165 votes

Why?

Maybe they just don't want to play in an environment where people are more stressed out(and then toxic/etc) and avoid the pressure(both on them, their teammates, and their enemies) to pick op shit.

Sure if I actually enjoyed playing garbage like janna and soraka I'd play ranked more, but why would anyone do that? I'd rather not pick these op trashes myself and play in an environment where my opponents don't feel pressured to pick them either.

SquishieAug 18, 20161 votes

Let me correct it for you: They don't want to play in an environment where MOST of people try their best to improve and know the game better. They want to keep try harding in blind pick so they convince themselves they are good.

And let's be honest for a moment, people in normals are toxic too no matter what type of Q you are playing you will always get those flamers.

One more thing, calling Janna garbage and op tell us how unexperienced you are and why low ranks opinions doesn't matter that much in the game play section.

PS: I made it to diamond last season as a main support and all i played was Thresh/Alistar. PSS: git gud

manbearswineAug 18, 20166 votes

{quoted}

Let me correct it for you: They don't want to play in an environment where MOST of people try their best to improve and know the game better. They want to keep try harding in blind pick so they convince themselves they are good.

Not really, no.

And let's be honest for a moment, people in normals are toxic too no matter what type of Q you are playing you will always get those flamers.

Much less so.

One more thing, calling Janna garbage and op tell us how unexperienced you are and why low ranks opinions doesn't matter that much in the game play section.

You realize I have a higher rank than you do, right?

PS: I made it to diamond last season as a main support and all i played was Thresh/Alistar. PSS: git gud

And I did that on lulu, so git gud, d5 trasher.

SquishieAug 18, 20161 votes

Funny how you call janna garbage while it's your highest played champion. Also D4 ain't far away from d5 you know, We're still on same skill level.

manbearswineAug 18, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Funny how you call janna garbage while it's your highest played champion.

Did you even read what I wrote? I call her op garbage(which is awful to play as and against), just that ranked puts a lot of emphasis on winning, so naturally I play op shit in ranked, I don't enjoy it, hence I don't play it much.

What is so hard to understand?

Also D4 ain't far away from d5 you know, We're still on same skill level.

Not really, there's like x4 more people in d5 than in d4, so there's quite a noticeable difference, especially since a plat can just get stuck in d5 due to the system preventing him from dropping.

SquishieAug 18, 20161 votes

What's hard to understand is how janna is awful to play as and against? Dude what's wrong with you.

And you get demoted from d5 due to inactivity mate.

manbearswineAug 18, 20165 votes

{quoted}

What's hard to understand is how janna is awful to play as and against? Dude what's wrong with you.

Because she's so fucking braindead it feels more like you are playing as/against an item(and a fucking strong one at that), so when you lose to it you feel like you were overwhelmed by numbers/things you can't play around, and when you play as it it's boring and lame as hell.

And you get demoted from d5 due to inactivity mate.

Only if you are inactive while at low lp, which almost nobody is, so what are you getting at?

venomous frostAug 17, 20165 votes

it does, in low elo you literally get no people that play the game correctly.

But you literally do not know what is so wrong with low elo games because you aren't used to facing better people, the things you do in low elo work for that elo.

Tobias BracknerAug 17, 20164 votes

literally

You say this word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

Also I'm glad you live in a world where knowing about a game/system means you can flawlessly execute on it. However you need to realize the rest of humanity has a different experience.

venomous frostAug 17, 20164 votes

You cannot know something you never experienced, you never get decent laners in bronze. You never get people that know when to take objectives in bronze.

Also if you want to be a smartass, atleast dont generalize "humanity" into having a different experience without proof.

MohawkBirdAug 17, 20162 votes

[deleted]

Tobias BracknerAug 18, 20161 votes

Consistency is also a big thing in that a single player can be on point for one game and then be shit in another.

KetiAug 17, 201620 votes

{quoted}

Completely wrong. Bronze players like me could play for years and never even touch the ranked button, doesn't make them inexperienced or the dumbasses you just made them out to be.

If they've played for years and still manage to be bronze, I'd question then even more...

Tobias BracknerAug 17, 201612 votes

Skill =/= Game Knowledge

Count the number of people who make combo videos in fighting games that win EVO.

MonkeyMadnessAug 17, 201610 votes

LOL THIS POST.

Playing this game at a high level (even gold) requires more strategy than anything else. Ergo, in League of Legends, game knowledge IS the skill. If you have game knowledge, you will win, and you will climb. If you can't climb, it's almost certainly because your game knowledge is lacking in some way. Stop spewing this bullshit, it's really starting to frustrate those of us who study pro play and really work on our map awareness and other strategic skills.

PhDs NutsAug 17, 201610 votes

{quoted}

Completely wrong. Bronze players like me could play for years and never even touch the ranked button, doesn't make them inexperienced or the dumbasses you just made them out to be.

Your Normals MMR is still bronze.

MonkeyMadnessAug 17, 20161 votes

if you played for years without touching the ranked button then you wouldn't be bronze. Please don't be this ignorant, the guy makes a valid point here...

Unstoppable MonkAug 17, 20162 votes

{quoted}

if you played for years without touching the ranked button then you wouldn't be bronze. Please don't be this ignorant, the guy makes a valid point here...

That's not necessarily true, it depends how much time they put into it. Someone with only around 1000 normal games does run the chance of being a ranked league potato. Also the metagame is different from different rank divisions; content creators with high elo might actually be very wrong about things in low elo even if they say things will work.

Very few fresh ranked players come anywhere close to being impressive or knowledgeable. Most "knowledge" is misapplied and trying to play pro 1/0/0 in low elo is a road to staying bronze as going ham is more the meta.

MonkeyMadnessAug 17, 20163 votes

Most "knowledge" is misapplied and trying to play pro 1/0/0 in low elo is a road to staying bronze as going ham is more the meta.

This statement confused me. What are you trying to say?

Also, I must disagree with your statement about higher level players being "wrong" about metagame issues at lower elos. Let me give you an example. In low elo, amumu has always been a very solid champ. He has great engage, and pretty high base damage, allowing him to be effective with a wide variety of builds. His win rate in silver and bronze has been borderline oppressive in past seasons, but if one player in that elo tried to say that he was op, they would be categorically wrong. This is because while the metagame may be different at every level, the game itself is constant. Amumu doesn't actually function differently in bronze than he does in diamond, the only difference is the skill levels of the players. In low elo, with the inherent lack of communication and teamfighting skills, amumu is very hard to deal with because he has a very easy and powerful engage tool that requires very little setup with his team. In high elo, however, people communicate better and have better game sense, and will counterplay his easy engage by spreading out a bit more and making sure that he can't slap the adc with a bandaid for a free 5-man ult. The difference between being op in bronze and being balanced or even underwhelming in high elos is simply the skill and knowledge barrier between the two groups, and you can't create content in a game like this to cater to players who are lacking in this area.

Unstoppable MonkAug 18, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Let me give you an example. In low elo, amumu

Amumu is actually a bad example. His skillshot based initiation and the fact he can be counterjungled makes him less of a pick than some other junglers for the novice. I actually see amumu being used poorly in low elo and your "basic champion" example is just proving my point that there's a subtlety that is extremely missed by higher divisions when staring at lower divisions, because of assumptions. So yes, your example of amumu is misapplied.

But sure there is probably one amumu bronze main out there winning 55 games and everyone else losing 45 of them. People forget that these people are playing like they are having a bad game, all the time. Low elo is awful for relying on teammates to do damage.

Vi, Yi, and Xin are better choices.

RalanrAug 17, 201613 votes

Idk, sometimes I think that higher level players don't understand what a tank is.

It's not hard to see actually since the carry mentality causes people to shy away from actual tanks most of the time.

I'm not high ranked. I'd probably be bronze if I played ranked, but I at least know the basics on what makes a tank and what makes a tanky champion.

venomous frostAug 17, 20169 votes

that is your problem right there. You focus so much on team composition that you forget to actually play the game to your strengths.

What if you picked the perfect champion for your team comp, but you dont really play him. Now you lost the laning phase and tamfights are irrelevant because you cannot even defend your tower and you cannot join fights because the enemy just takes all your towers

Now what if you picked a teamfight comp, but the enemy team keeps splitting and nobody can deal with them 1v1.

There's no point in having a good team comp if you aren't comfortable with it. A tank does nothing when he is behind.

Off Meta EvanAug 17, 20161 votes

a tanks entire point is that he's a safe pick. no matter how much a tank feeds he'll pretty much always be useful as long as you land your abilities. like that Malphite can be 0/6 but if he presses r on your team and knocks them all up at least ONE of your teammates is going to die. they're literally just balls of stats and cc. #gbay spammed them cause if he fed he could still win. its also the reason why Rammus is being reworked cause the idea of a tank that can snowball or become so behind that they're useless, goes against the entire class concept.

venomous frostAug 17, 20164 votes

A tank will be relevant vs another tank.

But once you lose vs splitpushers like Tryndamere Jax Gnar Fiora they either just dive you all game long when you build a bit damage, or just ignore you and take the tower if you go full defense.

There will be no teamfighting when 2 people have to help you out just to defend the turret.

Critmaster GarenAug 17, 201625 votes

no op, it does mean they are inqualified.

people at bronze and silver are playing an entirely different game than people at plat and diamond. they never experienced a proper game, yet almost always make arguments based on anecdotal evidence.

in the lower ratings, people make so many mechanical mistakes, and terrible strategic decisions in a row in a single game, that you cant judge game balance off these games.

they are sitting down there, because almost all of them have not yet understood a couple of important base aspects of the game.

GayFluffyUnicornAug 17, 20166 votes

Yup. There's a reason riot (usually) balanced the game around plat. This is the region where rank is split into trash tier and real high elo. Those are two totally different worlds. Some games here in high plat feel like playing in the lcs. Some others are pure clownfiestas.

MohawkBirdAug 17, 20161 votes

[deleted]

Critmaster GarenAug 17, 20163 votes

{quoted}

But the thing is that having knowledge about the game vs. being able to properly execute it consistently are completely different. I've watched tons of videos on league, including the good ol' climbing whens, when to split-push, when to group, how to play laning phase and minion mechanics, and the list goes on, but the fact is that it is hard to execute in an actually game.

Just because I am Silver does not mean I don't know when to do those things, because I do, but executing those things in an actual game is a different story. Quiz me on some of those things, I'll know the answer, but ask me to perform rotations etc. properly in an actual game then it gets tougher.

yea, ok. you might have the really really really rare .1% guy down in bronze or silver who might have a good understanding and general game knowledge, and doesnt climb because... i dont know. actual bad luck? just being really bad at executing mechanics?

but how many people in comparison are down there, who only think that they understood the game, but dont actually know shit? it shouldnt surprise you that comments about game balance are seen as less credible from someone sitting in bronze/silver when the overwhelming majority is legitemately bad and doesnt udnerstand the game or doesnt even understand that they dont understand the game?

Over lmmortalAug 17, 201620 votes

Looking at your posts, you're not getting down-voted because you're bronze. You're getting down-voted because you are stating opinions which are very misguided by your lack of game knowledge. You have no clue what you're talking about, you get offended by words said on the internet, and you make excuses to try and cover your lack of knowledge. This is when your rank gets brought up, as an attempt to make you realize that you do not know what you are talking about. Then, you're offended again because someone called you out for bullshit, so you post on the boards about how your feelings are hurt.

Honestly, you're cosplaying Keemstar at this point, so let me see if I can dumb it down to where even a gnome such as yourself could understand it.

You make a post giving an opinion which is guided by a lack of game-knowledge
Someone shows you that you have no clue what you're saying
You get offended
You make an excuse, further proving that you are not knowledgeable about the game
Someone says you're bronze, which you are, and you get even more offended
You make another post saying that words hurt and that people are mean entirely because of your ranking
Your gnome army down-votes my reply because they too think words hurt

Buff Jax pleaseAug 17, 201619 votes

If you had a basic knowledge of the game you wouldn't be Bronze. It is impossible to be Bronze if you understand the game atleast a little bit.

So yeah when I see you are Bronze I will not take your opinion regarding Balance of this game serious.

LAKIGRAug 17, 201615 votes

Oh and at what rank do u take a advice from. Just because some one is low elo doesn't make their game knowledge wrong. It just means that in games they can not use their knowledge correctly or they are bad at the mechanics of the game

JamesTheMage17Aug 17, 20167 votes

{quoted}

Oh and at what rank do u take a advice from. Just because some one is low elo doesn't make their game knowledge wrong. It just means that in games they can not use their knowledge correctly or they are bad at the mechanics of the game

No, no, no. Does not make them bad at the game. It's like you guys didn't even bother to read my thread.

LAKIGRAug 17, 20164 votes

I read your post what I am saying is that you can have the most knowledge in the game but be bad at executing it or bad at the mechanics of the game this leading u to being in bronze, but it doesn't change the fact that u still do know what u r talking about

GayFluffyUnicornAug 17, 20166 votes

Oh come on. There is bronze for a reason and most people ARE in bronze for a reason. When i spectate some bronze friends of mine it is just cringeworthy what kind of items they build in certain situations or on certain champs so i ask you: players who don't know how to build know exactly what they are talking about when they discuss item balance? Nope.

Battlecast SonaAug 17, 20164 votes

There is a difference between "this person is clearly a bad player with 0 game knowledge" and "this person makes the right items/plays generally okay but their execution/csing is poor". The second player could easily be in bronze but still have something meaningful to add to a balance discussion.

Nobody is saying that a Bronze player is as good as a Gold player objectively - there's a ranking system for a reason. But you can be a low ranked player and still have played a ton of games and experienced a lot of matchups, which is really what balancing is all about anyway.

archerno1Aug 17, 201610 votes

Well when u have some bronze 3 opening thread saying " OMG KATARINA IS SO OP SHE LITERALLY HAS NO COUNTERS SHE CAN PENTA KILL EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING" you can call him up on his rank. As his inexperience and low skill makes him believe such things.

There are instances where players who lack basic knowledge ,or possess very low game knowledge, of the game shouldnt interfere. Like balancing champions etc.

ModWulf HelhammerAug 17, 20167 votes

That's the important part. But in that case, you're not solely juding by his rank, but seeing his wrong assumptions, and finding that his rank is a good explanation for it.

ModCaptainMårvelousAug 17, 20169 votes

You know what, I hate this argument. I really do. It -always- assumes the situation where a Diamond player is wrong but the bronze player is right. It never accounts for the inverse where the Diamond is right and the Bronze is wrong. Being honest, the latter is WAY more common than the former.

More importantly, we need a distinct separation when it comes to balance vs. design. Anyone can have an opinion on design. Hell, some of Riot's designers aren't that good at the game and that's ok. Design is about the mechanics, not the quality of your talent. Comparatively, balance is raw numbers and stats. Only higher-level players/pros can really tell you earnestly about stats because at that level, the numbers matter most of all.

Finally, this sense of "You're bronze so you're wrong' comes from repeated, obvious and CONSTANT backtalk to players of higher levels. Back in the early days of League, great players would go out of their way to explain these things. They still do sometimes. Yet these players were given massive paragraphs of misinformation, bias or just self-serving examples where the gold and below player hides behind the shield of "Well in -my- ELO" or "Well in -my- games". It boils down to high-ranking players being sick of trying to argue with someone who obviously doesn't know what they're talking about and will throw poor example after biased information to justify their inaccurate position. You can't be a brick wall and expect someone to be reasonable with you.

I'm absolutely guilty of this too. I don't want to be but I'm welfare gold. My knowledge on the game from a mechanical standpoint is "ok" at best and my views on design and balance are mediocre at best. However, I absolutely recognize when I'm wrong and don't push the issue. I can talk about balance and design as much as I want but I certainly don't have the experience a diamond+ friend has.

Rank -does- mean something, whether you like it or not. Eat humble pie once in a while and accept that you won't know as much as the Diamond 1 Zed main when it comes to how "broken" Zed is.

Retard SlayerAug 17, 20161 votes

[deleted]

Buff Jax pleaseAug 17, 20162 votes

[deleted]

JamesTheMage17Aug 17, 20165 votes

[{quoted}](name=Buff Jax please,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EfJIEgVB,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2016-08-17T14:15:21.842+0000)

If I don't play ranked matches I do have an idea what's going on, and yes, you guys do sound retarded.

AstôlfoAug 17, 201617 votes

"you autistic monkey" Well, that was certainly a kind way for you to start your response, eh? And saying you'd kill yourself over a game rank? Isn't that a bit extreme?

adidasAug 17, 20165 votes

{quoted}

"you autistic monkey" Well, that was certainly a kind way for you to start your response, eh? And saying you'd kill yourself over a game rank? Isn't that a bit extreme?

In your last recent posts consist of

''Keep crying kid''

''stay salty kid''

''Cry more''

But you're the one to criticize him? Get fuckin real

JamesTheMage17Aug 17, 201611 votes