An item that grants AD AS critical and movement speed and has a very very VERY convenient build path. Does anyone else feel this item is a huge factor in the damage creep especially early? If anything the 100% crit on first auto should have some drawbacks, like Slow the user or delay the next attack or lock spells for like 2 sec? Sincerely hoping for normal responses :)
Paroe3 votesStorm razor is fine as an item, especially if riot wants to shift marksmen from "burst per second" into "upfront burst into dps".
Personally id be A-OK with riot making storm razors crit disable regular crit, but remove the crit damage cap on it.
Saezio1 votesStorm razor is fine as an item, especially if riot wants to shift marksmen from "burst per second" into "upfront burst into dps".
Personally id be A-OK with riot making storm razors crit disable regular crit, but remove the crit damage cap on it.
I feel like you can't go wrong with the item. It's good early and then it also has ratios to transition into a late game item. But why is there also an MS steroid on it? And you never waste it's stats like you would by going triple shiv items. I think it needs to be less versatile. Atm it's good on early and late game carries, lethality users, even some assassins buy it for the burst. Maybe make it into a shiv item without the AD?
Paroe1 votesI feel like you can't go wrong with the item. It's good early and then it also has ratios to transition into a late game item. But why is there also an MS steroid on it? And you never waste it's stats like you would by going triple shiv items. I think it needs to be less versatile. Atm it's good on early and late game carries, lethality users, even some assassins buy it for the burst. Maybe make it into a shiv item without the AD?
People (including riot) claim that its an item for early game marksmen but... If you actually look at it, storm razor is very clearly a general crit item intended for melee champions who basic attack infreaquently. Like assassins.
When you think about it as if it were an intended assassin item, storm razor suddenly makes a LOT more sense as to why it does what it does and synergizes so well with just shiv.
Dracocrash1 votesStorm razor is fine as an item, especially if riot wants to shift marksmen from "burst per second" into "upfront burst into dps".
Personally id be A-OK with riot making storm razors crit disable regular crit, but remove the crit damage cap on it.
that opens it up to abuse by AD assasins.
Paroe1 votes[{quoted}](name=Mr OwO,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2018-09-19T16:30:52.335+0000)
that opens it up to abuse by AD assasins.
"abuse" I dont think you quite understand what that word means in context, as marksmen abuse it a thousand times more than assassins do. An assassins job, after all, is up-front burst damage. The problem with them comes from their extreme safety and forgiveness of mistakes.
If anything, marksmen abuse the item because theyre ranged and get much more out of it.
Dracocrash2 votes"abuse" I dont think you quite understand what that word means in context, as marksmen abuse it a thousand times more than assassins do. An assassins job, after all, is up-front burst damage. The problem with them comes from their extreme safety and forgiveness of mistakes.
If anything, marksmen abuse the item because theyre ranged and get much more out of it.
What I mean is, assasins aren't intended to have a guaranteed crit on their first attack, in ADDITION to the upfront burst they already have. Stormrazor was never intended for assasins, just like steraks was never intended for adc's.
No, adc's aren't abusing it. They had their base stats nerfed, their items nerfed and stormrazor was a compensation given to them to keep them up in power level.
What I DO think, is the item itself forces toxic patterns of play, and eliminates a lot of adc picks just by existing, so it needs to go. And adc's can be appropriately compensated for its removal/nerfs.
Paroe1 votes[{quoted}](name=Mr OwO,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=0000000100000000,timestamp=2018-09-19T16:41:06.774+0000)
What I mean is, assasins aren't intended to have a guaranteed crit on their first attack, in ADDITION to the upfront burst they already have. Stormrazor was never intended for assasins, just like steraks was never intended for adc's.
No, adc's aren't abusing it. They had their base stats nerfed, their items nerfed and stormrazor was a compensation given to them to keep them up in power level.
What I DO think, is the item itself forces toxic patterns of play, and eliminates a lot of adc picks just by existing, so it needs to go. And adc's can be appropriately compensated for its removal/nerfs.
They... you DO realize that marksmen have had their base stats buffed up over time, right? And storm razor as "compensation" doesnt make sense, considering the item can be used on ANY AD caster?
Any nerfs marksmen reveived have been undone by this point. they STILL get 1.8asp with 300AD at full build, they STILL get lifesteal, and they STILL draintank very well. The only argument you can make for storm razor is that its a pro-snowball item that enhances and confirms an existing lead, which is something that marksmen WANT since bot lane is just an arms race.
Critmaster Garen1 votesStorm razor is fine as an item, especially if riot wants to shift marksmen from "burst per second" into "upfront burst into dps".
so, ranged dps assassins. yea, that makes sense.
Paroe1 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=00000002,timestamp=2018-09-19T16:38:40.355+0000)
so, ranged dps assassins. yea, that makes sense.
Yeah, it does. I mean... Would you prefer 1000 alpha damage on the first hit, and 300 every hit after that or 700 damage on every hit?
ShadWooo2 votesdefinitely overpowered item by far
TrikzterzArma2 votesThe balanceteam cums in their pants when adding burstitems
Pika Fox2 votesNo. Its fine. Seriously, crit got nerfed severely, the item is meant to be a hold over til ADCs get enough items to come online proper.
Paroe1 votes[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-09-19T16:18:46.063+0000)
No. Its fine. Seriously, crit got nerfed severely, the item is meant to be a hold over til ADCs get enough items to come online proper.
Yeah, nerfed then buffed. Crits at the same place it was before, and in a slightly better place even.
The difference between 250% crit and 200%+15% true damage is very small, around 15 per 100AD after 200AD. The true damage arguably makes up for it, too, since its MUCH more effective against armor and the same damage against squishies.
Dracocrash1 votesYeah, nerfed then buffed. Crits at the same place it was before, and in a slightly better place even.
The difference between 250% crit and 200%+15% true damage is very small, around 15 per 100AD after 200AD. The true damage arguably makes up for it, too, since its MUCH more effective against armor and the same damage against squishies.
its not 200% + 15% true damage. Its 185% + 15% true damage.
Paroe1 votes[{quoted}](name=Mr OwO,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2018-09-19T16:31:59.859+0000)
its not 200% + 15% true damage. Its 175% + 15% true damage.
Considering what i know of riot, i highly doubt thats true.
Dracocrash1 votesConsidering what i know of riot, i highly doubt thats true.
I looked it up and its actually 190%+ 10% true damage. Still not over 200%.
Pika Fox2 votesUnless the target has 200+ AR, and you have 3+ crit dedicated items, its a straight nerf. Not even a small one.
Saezio1 votes[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=000400000001,timestamp=2018-09-19T17:18:24.378+0000)
Unless the target has 200+ AR, and you have 3+ crit dedicated items, its a straight nerf. Not even a small one.
Well you are vacuming IE thought for this. Armor pen has been buffed severely and you are not taking that into account. Especially base armor pen
OtterlyLost1 votesSo what I'm hearing is that ADCs have to spend 13k gold just to do damage to target at sub 200 armor levels. Because that isnt a nerf.
Saezio1 votesSo what I'm hearing is that ADCs have to spend 13k gold just to do damage to target at sub 200 armor levels. Because that isnt a nerf.
You know stormrazor is 106% efficient WITHOUT THE PASSIVE? Name an item that has such a high gold efficiency and then compare passives between the 2 items. and you might understand how the item is out of balance.
OtterlyLost1 votesSo I'm gonna still have Stormrazor in this build? So my full build is going to be two Zeals, IE, SR, LD, and Greaves? Once you have your Zeal Items and IE, Stormrazor's gold efficiency plummets because you have 100% crit. .-.
And I can name one; pre-reworked Morellos anyone? And it was in the game in that state for a season and a half. In fact, I think pre-rework morellos was 130% efficient.
Saezio1 votesSo I'm gonna still have Stormrazor in this build? So my full build is going to be two Zeals, IE, SR, LD, and Greaves? Once you have your Zeal Items and IE, Stormrazor's gold efficiency plummets because you have 100% crit. .-.
And I can name one; pre-reworked Morellos anyone? And it was in the game in that state for a season and a half. In fact, I think pre-rework morellos was 130% efficient.
Gold efficiency plummets? I am telling you it is 106% WITHOUT THE PASSIVE (so just with the AD and AS). So even with full build you still get 106% efficiency + the MS boost passive
Dracocrash1 votes[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-09-19T16:18:46.063+0000)
No. Its fine. Seriously, crit got nerfed severely, the item is meant to be a hold over til ADCs get enough items to come online proper.
What about adc's who DONT build it. What about adc's who cannot fit it into their build path?
Pika Fox2 votesKai sa, lucian, jinx? Theyre meta.
Elite4Runner1 votesIt doesn't actually give critical strike chance.
It would be more accurate to say that it provides bonus damage that is gated by attack speed, scales with critical strike chance, and is applied in the form of a critical strike.
In fact, there are several drawbacks to this item. You can have too much attack speed and critical strike chance, which will cause this item, or your other items to lose efficiency.
Saezio1 votesIt doesn't actually give critical strike chance.
It would be more accurate to say that it provides bonus damage that is gated by attack speed, scales with critical strike chance, and is applied in the form of a critical strike.
In fact, there are several drawbacks to this item. You can have too much attack speed and critical strike chance, which will cause this item, or your other items to lose efficiency.
I said it gives critical not critical chance. In what build does the att speed of this item go wasted? Also crit chance is not given by this item as you said but even if you get 100% crit chance it still gives you the MS buff every auto when you are kiting.
Elite4Runner1 votesIncreasing attack speed decrease the amount of time needed between attacks. Purchasing bonus attack speed will increase your overall attack speed at a greater rate than it decreases this gap-time. This means attacking at your maximum attack speed will not cause your auto attacks to critically strike because of this passive. In order to do so you must pause between attacks, which decrease the value of the bonus attack speed you have invested in.
Similarly, the more critical strike chance you have, the less valuable you gain from passive that grants an automatic critical strike.
I'm not saying that it loses all value, that would be a major problem, but it does lose value, which is an interesting thing to happen to an item in this game.
Stormrazor seems to be an early game power spike that borrows its strength from items the player is likely to purchase later due to their synergy.
Sharpest glasses1 votesThis classes dosn't need more ms.
Saezio1 votes[{quoted}](name=Sharpest glasses,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EWune3aG,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-09-19T17:31:11.494+0000)
This classes dosn't need more ms.
That is my point. Take SOMETHING away from the item. the ms preferably since there is already a rune to do that (FF) champions without mobility have zero chance of not getting kited. Or maybe add defensive items with SLOWS to the attacker.
saltran1 votesStormR is a really strong item, and it has to be strong to compensate all the other nerfs that adcs and specially crit build received.
As long as they dont have major adc changes in mind it cant be changed and it will not change, because it's the only thing that keeps crit adcs in the game.
Thorn30001 votesthe item is too strong, because it is too versatile, usable in almost any scenario, its definitely not ideal in some, but it never is truly wrong
it was intended to be compensated by not being a good late game item, but as games last far shorter than they used to years ago and you barely ever reach full build....and rito is still pushing champs, abilities and items so that the games are quicker, they know people dont want long rift games, because the online gaming scene in general is moving to quicker games, and rito is moving to quicker game modes and trying to quicken rift somehow
Saezio1 votesthe item is too strong, because it is too versatile, usable in almost any scenario, its definitely not ideal in some, but it never is truly wrong
it was intended to be compensated by not being a good late game item, but as games last far shorter than they used to years ago and you barely ever reach full build....and rito is still pushing champs, abilities and items so that the games are quicker, they know people dont want long rift games, because the online gaming scene in general is moving to quicker games, and rito is moving to quicker game modes and trying to quicken rift somehow
That's acceptable I guess but if it is so give tanks too an item that is on par in early game tankiness with this item or make all tanks into damage characters too.
ShadWooo1 votesIdk what it even needs to exists now. Lucian can basically 100-0 squishy support with E-aa-Q-aa combo alone. Miss fortune deals over 60% hp of squishy with serrated dirk and second proc of Q. Draven also deals quite a lot of damage and Jhin is the fastest man alive. But adcs need stormrazor because they are weak?
saltran1 votesBut adcs need stormrazor because they are weak?
Exactly
Doge20201 votesHonestly I don’t care that much about stormrazor, I actually barely notice the MS that is gained when I proc harrier with Quinn. I remember both before stormrazor hit live servers and slightly after it I was running a more ADC based build top with Quinn, I has stuff like fleet footwork and was maxing w first for the MS and AS steroid. That build was so fun because not only would I do a lot of damage, I was also auto attacking a bunch and getting a bunch of crits in.
Inkling Commando1 votesthe hardest part of building 
is the 
which is really hard to get early game unless you have great farm.