When Are We Going to Have Legitimate Fizz and Zed Reworks?

Incarceration·Jan 6, 2017·31 votes·1,628 views

Zed just basically got nerfed this patch while all Fizz has is a bullshit ultimate.

Please just try to make them as viable as Leblanc or Katarina as picks.

67 Comments

Nami in BushJan 6, 20179 votes

Zed's life

OP nerfed OK buffed OP as fuck gutted to shit only 1-tricks can play him 'reworked' dog shit

Papa AndreiJan 6, 20171 votes

Like our friend the fat crabman

IncarcerationJan 7, 20171 votes

I was a legit one trick on Zed, but he's so bad now since you can barely harass them.

Papa AndreiJan 7, 20171 votes

He is actually fine if you know what to do with him. You actually have to make decisions not "W E Q 1ST BLOOD" and be utter faceroll in lane like old Kata.

IncarcerationJan 7, 20171 votes

lmao the harass combo w e q e was already hard enough to land. Now you can't even land the last e.

He wasn't faceroll. You just got punished if he landed the both shurikens on you and the auto attack.

Papa SlothyJan 8, 20171 votes

same, I moved to gangplank after deciding pirates rule and ninjas drool and it's so much easier to win games as GP

dakota saturnJan 6, 20176 votes

LB and Kat are perm-banned in high elo - they should not be cornerstones of a successful rework.

IncarcerationJan 6, 20174 votes

Well what should?

AnidanJan 6, 20172 votes

Poppy, when she's not overtuned (like the boards would seem to put it), seems to be considered an example of a good rework. Or Sion, he seems to hold up as a good example, as well. Those are two that spring to mind the fastest for me when I think "good rework."

Jeddy017Jan 6, 20171 votes

But those reworks were the large scale "scrap most the kit & start again" reworks. I think the OP is referring to smaller scale reworks.

AnidanJan 6, 20171 votes

Oh. Fair point, my bad.

IncarcerationJan 6, 20171 votes

I don't know. It can be something like the Malzahar rework (small change) or something like Leblanc (big change).

The only reason why I said Katarina and Leblanc is because Katarina is actually really viable now and Leblanc brought up some interesting things an assassin can have.

NochebrJan 6, 20171 votes

Poppy was a good rework in concept, but she is going to be nerfed this patch finally after being a top tier pick in LCS play all last year.

AnidanJan 7, 20171 votes

Yeah, for some reason they overtuned her, and, well, they kept it that way for some reason. She has a strong tank kit, she doesn't need as much damage as she has. She'd be perfectly fine with less damage or less tankiness, either/or. She has a good kit, I feel, just overtuned. Very versatile (which League players on the boards both want and detest, depending on which player you happen to find), but that's a good thing in League given how generalist this game is.

RexSaurJan 6, 20174 votes

{quoted}

Poppy, when she's not overtuned (like the boards would seem to put it), seems to be considered an example of a good rework. Or Sion, he seems to hold up as a good example, as well. Those are two that spring to mind the fastest for me when I think "good rework."

Poppy is the definition of a ball of stats champion, she has % armor, mr and health all on the same kit + % health damage and a lot of cc.

Shes pretty much every tank in the game combined in one, its not wonder shes been broken since the rework, and no thats not a "healthy" rework.

PermabannedGarenJan 6, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Well what should?

Darius Fiora Gangplank (kind of, his biggest problem remains that they kept his gold generation, which was fine when the rest of his kit was garbage, but is ridiculously stupid with his current kit. if Riot just removed that GP could be balanced) Graves Yorick

Of these, Yorick's rework is probably my favorite.

IncarcerationJan 8, 20171 votes

I don't know man. Most of Gangplank's items are extremely expensive. I think they should just reduce the armor penetration on his e, but he's already weak enough.

PROJECT KatarìnaJan 6, 20174 votes

High skillcap will prevail over all

Papa AndreiJan 6, 20171 votes

I used to laugh seeing kata mains in my games. Now i run for my life and just live toplane

PROJECT KatarìnaJan 6, 20171 votes

I play her top also :D

Papa AndreiJan 7, 20171 votes

Well I will just merc any kata i see with Nautilus then xD

PROJECT KatarìnaJan 7, 20171 votes

the most dreadful words you will ever hear "tank katarina"

Divine WindsJan 7, 20171 votes

The most dreadful words you will ever hear are actually "15/0 Illaoi building her 6th item at 20 minutes"

AstôlfoJan 7, 20171 votes

But then it doesn't matter anyways past mid game. Because she gets kited, CC'd, GW'd, and murdered instantly.

Papa AndreiJan 7, 20171 votes

Riot "we feel like cc is to high in this game, and have added a keystone making you immune to cc for 5 seconds"

GayFluffyUnicornJan 7, 20171 votes

You clearly haven't seen a good illaoi. I recommend you watching quas.

AstôlfoJan 7, 20171 votes

It doesn't matter how good an Illaoi is. It's not hard for any intelligent or decent player/team to CC, kite, or just buy Lord Dominik's Regards (since she builds a lot of health too) or Mortal Reminder. She has no mobility, no meaningful CC that she can provide quickly, and no way to stop Grievous from ruining her.

AhristocatsJan 6, 20171 votes

Kat is broken, LB is kind of balanced right now in high elo

source: me

PROJECT KatarìnaJan 6, 20172 votes

Kat is broken in "high elo" I hope she doesnt get azired or kalistaed

NochebrJan 6, 20172 votes

I look at that as a successful rework. She has only been out like a month and it is clear she is overpowered, but she has been made into a viable high elo pick, which she wasn't before. So now I would expect small nerfs on consecutive patches until she is roughly balanced.

PROJECT KatarìnaJan 7, 20171 votes

TBH its kinda fair considering she is melee range champion with no cc

AirKingNeoJan 6, 20172 votes

LB is kind of balanced right now in high elo

oh yeah because her chain that can't be broken and her all in at level 3 is really "fair and interactive".

AhristocatsJan 6, 20171 votes

it's not fair, or interactive

but the champ is still balanced, i don't win more than i lose when i have an lb with me, and it's true for the opposite kat however, i almost never lost when she's with me, and never won when she was in the enemy team (nearly)

that's why i said LB is kind of balanced

Titanium70Jan 7, 20171 votes

Those have Number problems. But their Kits are actually quite good.

Kata offers alot of interaction for both laners. Jut her ability to rush item 3102 / item 3068 and still 100-0 is stupid. LBs Problem is the Chain, if you ask me. Give it a reasonable break-range as well as a reasonable hitbox and she's fine. Reward her for sticking to her target, but weaken her fast-poke-combo. Poke + Assassin is always an unhealthy combo - see Zed.

IncarcerationJan 8, 20171 votes

Just reduce the damage on the passive ability. All Lb has now is her waveclear, the w + q combo, and the e to do anything. Orianna has q + w, e + r, r + flash, q + r, and other stuff like most mages.

MysticDreams12Jan 6, 20174 votes

No thanks. I'd rather leave Zed in the dirt then let him be viable again. Don't need him being season 6 OP again.

IncarcerationJan 6, 20173 votes

You probably are ok with Syndra almost one shotting someone even though she missed everything.

MysticDreams12Jan 6, 20173 votes

Yeah totally fine. At least you can fucking catch her and she has counterplay, unlike Zed.

IncarcerationJan 7, 20174 votes

She has no counterplay and most Syndras take ghost so good luck.

MysticDreams12Jan 7, 20173 votes

She has more than fucking Zed does and I barely see any of them take Ghost bro. Most Cass people do but not Syndra.

IncarcerationJan 7, 20173 votes

Zed Counterplay- summoner 21 summoner 3 summoner 4 summoner 7

item 3157 item 3107 item 3109 item 3190 item 3048 + every armor item in the game.

Syndra Counterplay- a joke

MysticDreams12Jan 7, 20172 votes

Yeahhhh nope. As ADC, I've flashed away, healed, dodged, fucking everything and even if I get away, even if I'm over half health, his fucking ult still kills me. There's no counterplay there especially since Riot removed his ult from being cleansed from QSS.

As a Sona support recently I went up against a Zed jungler and we were in their base pushing. I had a lot of armor and some health in my items, he ulted me- I healed myself over half heath, his ult pop still killed me even after I had exhausted him.

Zhonyas is a joke especially late game- use it once to save yourself, he comes and ults you more than twice after because the active CD is so much longer than his ult CD.

Redemption, Vow, Locket- not all supports take them, and most mages I play don't use Seraphs.

Syndra- build MR, stay out of her line of range, bait out stun and bam go in. She has no escape tools unlike Zed who has his get out of jail free card. I'd rather play against her any day than stupid ass Zed.

SeaGodUrronuosJan 7, 20171 votes

Jesus Christ the crybaby got triggered

MysticDreams12Jan 7, 20171 votes

Reported.

SeaGodUrronuosJan 8, 20171 votes

LOL, the thing is that you think because you report me you think you can be better honestly its funny, you think ur going to be better by whining about someone killing you ROFL.

MysticDreams12Jan 8, 20171 votes

I am better than you because I'm not calling people crybabies and attacking them for their opinions. It's not funny either. Grow up.

SeaGodUrronuosJan 8, 20171 votes

Im not attacking you for your opinion im saying your telling it like a crybaby, he.. he killed me and I think its mean he needs to be nerfed so I can kill him instead!!!!! And its hilarious rofl

DryditchJan 8, 20172 votes

If Zed can deal over 900 damage on his ultimate without landing anything else (which he's supposed to do), then yeah, he needs a nerf.

(Most ADCs at lv 18 have health pools of roughly 1800-2000, hence the 900 damage example)

SeaGodUrronuosJan 8, 20171 votes

Show me one example of zed dealing 900+ damage on his ult and only his ult also if 900 damage is enough to make an adc cry make them peel for you or buy zhonyas or something like really you expect to buy no defensive items but you expect an ASSASSIN to not one shot you, like say rengar kha zed fizz and other assassin in the game that is ahead, even talon

DryditchJan 8, 20171 votes

I personally don't believe that any assassin should do that much damage with one ability, and all I'm saying is, (based on Mystic Dreams' account of a Zed ultimate one-shotting an ADC from over half health) that level of damage is unhealthy for the game, especially when there's apparently no real counterplay except getting more shields.

I've never had an issue with any assassin, mostly because I don't play squishy champs that often, so I don't always understand what people are complaining about.

I guess damage creep is just a real threat, since Viktor can get fed and q an ADC for half health, or Vayne can 3 shot a 3000 HP tank.