"We nerfed Rylias because it was core on every mage"

warpenguin555··76 votes·5,281 views

meanwhile every marksmen builds item 3046 or item 3085.

146 Comments

WoonStruck55 votes

No, pretty much every marksman builds item 3085.

item 3046 is mostly a thing on melee ADCs and Vayne.

sir d wreck2 votes

I see item 3087 being bought pretty often too, and specific ADCs also buy item 3634 (Like Jhin)

Edit: Meant item 3094 and not item 3634. I didn't look close enough at the icons, opps.

GhostOfShrimpmas21 votes

[{quoted}](name=sir d wreck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B3sccJ7n,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2016-12-11T23:02:09.561+0000)

I see item 3087 being bought pretty often too, and specific ADCs also buy item 3634 (Like Jhin)

Did you mean item 3094 ? Or have I been missing out on a real fun item?

Sraeg20133 votes

That's the Beam of Ruination (the laser 3-shot thing) from the Nexus Siege FGM.

Spice POWAH23 votes

My adc build is item 3632 item 3348 item 3682 item 3640 item 3901 item 3637 item 3631

sir d wreck3 votes

Ah... yes, my bad haha.

doublelift fg19 votes

item 3085 is broken item 3046 nowhere to be core

meanwhile item 3165 on mages

Swarovsko32 votes

They MUST build item 3165 since they made item 3174 basically useless

doublelift fg6 votes

i didn't say morello is broken

i just see that morello has a 100% pick rate on mages, what i mean by this stat is that not a single mage didn't build morello in my games

Skaiserus13 votes

Maybe because all of the other items on Mages just aren't that good anymore. Morellonomicon is an item I CONSIDER to be 100% cost efficient.

item 3165 Morellonomicon

+100 AP +400 Mana

UNIQUE passive: 20% Cooldown Reduction UNIQUE passive: Dealing magic damage to enemies with 35% HP or lower inflicts Grievous Wounds for 8 seconds. UNIQUE passive: Kills and Assists restore 20% of your maximum mana.

It gives a lot of what you'd want for a mage. Mana, AP, CDR, Grievous wounds, and Mana Restoration. It's a great item. And most other items fail to it.

Z468 votes

Statistically, Morellonomicon is 112.7% gold efficient before either of its non-CDR passives are added into the equation. Morellonomicon is disgustingly gold efficient, much more than 100%.

Baron of Bread9 votes

The thing with item 3165 is that it is one of two items of its stat profile. The other one is Lich Bane which has 20 less AP, 10% less CDR, and 150 less mana, as well as a passive that is not well utilized on many mages.

Meanwhile, Zeal builds into 4 items with near identical stats that are chosen between for their situationally optimal passives.

Kartac Magewrigh2 votes

You ignore most important stat of morellinomicon - the 8 second greivous wound. That should be main reason to get it. It is in mages build, as it team fight item, and allows them to counter insane life- and spellstealing.

500000000000000011 votes

That should be a major reason to pick up Morello's, but the thing is, Morello is good even without that passive.

Kartac Magewrigh1 votes

No, it would not be. Without that passive it would be totally useless to take as there would be better items with same stat combo but different additional stuff. The grievous wound part is the important part of morellinomicon as it counters life steal and spell vampire. If you really think, ignite usefulness is not true damage it deal but grievous wounding it does. But, as usual, that part is hard to get by most players as they look at cool stats, not real effectiveness.

500000000000000011 votes

What would you get if you want early damage (either AP or CDR, or both), but you also need mana? Not tear, because that needs stacking. Not Ardent Censer or Athene's, since they don't give a lot of AP. Mejai's is a risky buy. Lich Bane is possible, but not always useful depending on who you're playing as. So you're left with either RoA or Hextech GLP-800. Both of them give AP and Mana, but neither of them give CDR.

I'm not saying Grievous Wound is a weak/useless passive. It's strong, albeit situationally. What I am saying is that Morello's is a solid buy even if it didn't have the grievous wound passive, just from the AP, mana, and CDR.

Mirkhail5 votes

The grievous wound was never intended to be the main reason to buy morellinomicon and it shouldn't. Morellinomicon is and is intended to be bought for a early combo of mana/ap/cdr to get mage going on.

Limrick1 votes

The Grievous Wounds only applies if they are below 35% HP. It's just tacked on to the end of the item. The best part is the mana restore on kill and assist, as it allows mages to stay out in the field for a lot longer.

Dinero2 votes

But sometimes a Mage needs it for the Grievous Wounds passive, like against a yasuo or Darius.

Kartac Magewrigh2 votes

Not sometimes. Almost always. And the grievous wound of Morellinomicon lasts 8 seconds. It does help your team after you die and changes tide. I started to use Morellinocmion season before it became really famous, and I got on forums and games constant flame for taking such inefficient item as people did not value grievous wounds.

The grievous wounds are essential to kill adcs too, as they relies on life stealing for surviving at mid or end game. It is more essential against Nasus and Mastery Yi, which you cannot killl without grievous wound or chain of lots of stuns.

Agent Corgi5 votes

[{quoted}](name=doublelift fg,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B3sccJ7n,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-12-11T17:12:41.566+0000)

item 3085 is broken item 3046 nowhere to be core

meanwhile item 3165 on mages

I miss the Good Ole Days when you could build the old version of Athene's item 3174 as a Midlaner. I always thought of it like a Defensive Version of Morello's.

NineTailedMystic2 votes

Please don't bring Athene's back Mid. If one laner bought it, the other one had to as well to keep up with the push on top of the 25 MR deterring all ins.

Sahn Uzal18 votes

They nerfed Rylais because it was an optimal stat stick that also happened to have a super powerful Passive. And Riot wanted mages to build it for the passive, not the stats.

I fucking hate ADC's, but please don't run around telling bullshit :l

WoonStruck9 votes

And you don't think Runaan's is an optimal stat-stick (versus every other AS item, which is near-mandatory on ADCs) that also happens to have a super powerful passive that also hyperscales many ADC's lifesteal (warlord's) and various passives/on-hits (fervor)?

Sahn Uzal9 votes

Runaan's stats aren't bad by any means, and the item as a whole is probably too strong, but it's not as extreme as rylais was.

WoonStruck5 votes

Except it basically is.

Zeal item is basically a forced item slot on ADCs now, and Runaan's is the near-mandatory pick-up in it due to its overloaded stats relative to other options (sound familiar?) and obscene passive interactions with universally present factors on ADCs.

Sahn Uzal6 votes

item 3046 Gives more stats though It's near mandatory on ADC's who can apply their inbuild on hits to multiple targets Ashe Caitlyn Jinx KogMaw Twitch etc It's not core on champions who don't synergise with it that well Draven Vayne Lucian Ezreal MissFortune etc Rylais, before the nerf, was being build by champions who shouldn't synergise with it at all.Syndra is the first one that comes to mind.

Runaans is overpowered and it's interaction with Lifesteal and crit is stupid as fuck. But it's a different issue than Rylais was.

doublelift fg1 votes

Ezreal has more broken items on him that's why he doesn't build it

same for MF

Draven going full AD is better, i don't build any attack speed item on him Lucian doesn't need waveclear

TLDR: unless you have a better synergy with an other item, Runan is broken

And vayne does build runan

Sahn Uzal3 votes

What Vayne build Runaans? She can't even proc her W with it

Draven, Ezreal MF and Lucian build other items because they synergise better with other items, you just proved my point..

WoonStruck4 votes

Go in a custom and try it right now. Runaan's doesn't apply silver bolts with its projectiles.

Only Vayne's primary target is affected by silver bolts.

SirHeavyScrotum1 votes

There are other options though. Rylais was literally built on every mage (even fucking Annie who had practically no use for it)

WoonStruck2 votes

Annie built it before it was over-buffed and even considered a good AP option on the large majority of mages.

RoA+Rylai's was core due to her E and low CD on Q.

Lusoka2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tidal Tyrant,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B3sccJ7n,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-12-11T16:58:40.190+0000)

They nerfed Rylais because it was an optimal stat stick that also happened to have a super powerful Passive. And Riot wanted mages to build it for the passive, not the stats.

I fucking hate ADC's, but please don't run around telling bullshit :l

If that is the case, isn't the passive part of it the thing that is being nerfed and not the stats, meaning they're full of shit if that is what they said?

Marshbouy6 votes

Oh so you like being permaslowed?

Big Lincoln19 votes

I don't like when the enemy ADC starts critting 3 people simultaneously thanks to Runaan's

Marshbouy5 votes

yeah that 75% AA damage sure is terrifying.

Big Lincoln19 votes

75% that crits

with IE it's 187% damage to secondary targets

WingsofGulgazor1 votes

the runaans other bolts don't crit...Unless they made a change I don't know about. But last time I checked they have never crit and only do 75% AA dmg. It's good on twitch and cait and trist because it's good for waveclear plus they have enough range to make use of it and some of them get other benefits from it like cait can proc headshot more and twitch ult goes through people so getting the other 2 bolts from runaan's is pretty good and then jinx rockets has aoe.

and out of all of them only jinx is super strong because of it and makes her scale super hard but she has a lot of weaknesses that should be exploited by your team that it's more then enough to be fair.

Leetri8 votes

The secondary bolts can crit since 5.22, but they deal 25% AD physical damage.

AirKingNeo10 votes

No? It's 25% to each target, crits would be 50% or 62.%% if you had IE. So 62.5% of my AD to each secondary target.

Neither of you are correct.

Marshbouy1 votes

Yep. I was off in my earlier math, but Big Lincoln is wayyyy off

SociopathFriend4 votes

No worries, he's got the upvotes, he can't be wrong.

Rivuo2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B3sccJ7n,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-12-11T16:56:10.473+0000)

I don't like when the enemy ADC starts critting 3 people simultaneously thanks to Runaan's

If an adc is in range for 3 people then that is a dead adc.

Rule#1 of every adc guide is never be in range of more than 1 person.

Literally learn that in bronze

Avios117 votes

Tristana Jinx Caitlyn and Twitch would like a word.

Rivuo4 votes

{quoted}

Tristana Jinx Caitlyn and Twitch would like a word.

Maybe you misunderstood what i ment by a adc should never be in range of 3 people

http://i.imgur.com/ebHQYSd.png[/img]

If the situation YOU think im talking about is occuring, then that team deserves to die whether it be by adc ''critting 3 people simultaneously'' or malphite ulting or Amumu ulting or yasuo ult. It does not matter, That teams positioning is horrible and is asking for collateral damage.

The situation im talking about should never occur without the adc dying. Of course if you have bloodthirster and the enemy team blew all their cooldowns then of course that can easily happen and the adc lives.

But in simple terms No. Thats bronze play.

resumed4 votes

600?? sorry you seem to be mistaken

twitch's ult makes his aa range 850 jinx has 700 aa range using fishbones at rank 5 caitlyn has 650 normally tristana's aa range at level 14 is 641

adcs are more than capable of staying safe with you in their effective range especially when they have teammates with them

Rivuo3 votes

{quoted}

600?? sorry you seem to be mistaken

twitch's ult makes his aa range 850 jinx has 700 aa range using fishbones at rank 5 caitlyn has 650 normally tristana's aa range at level 14 is 641

adcs are more than capable of staying safe with you in their effective range especially when they have teammates with them

I was giving you a picture of how an adcs positioning should be.

I didnt say ''this 600 represents twitch''

AngelFrost003 votes

Jhin Corki Lucian sometimesQuinn sometimesVayne sometimes do not go item 3085 oritem 3046 .

doublelift fg3 votes

item 3087 item 3085 removes the waveclear problem of vayne

and PD is built on lucian/vayne/jhin

especially on lucian since the armor pene nerf, a lot of lucian returned to the crit build while still building black cleaver

JackMcSnipeyz3 votes

If you suggest building hurricane on vayne, you're an idiot.

Also i dont know why would you even buy PD on jhin since he doesnt make use of the extra attack speed, and rapid firecannon's extra poke is perfect for his slow AA

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