"I can't keep my mana up without the Meditation mastery, and now you have to spend at least 12 points in Utility to get it. All because Riot doesn't care that my Lucent Singularity is too costly! Now how am I supposed to compete with Xerath or Ziggs?!"
LoLKiru30 votesDid the additional 3 MP5 really help all that much? (legitimately asking because I've almost never ran 21/0/9, usually always run 21/9/0 on any mage, usually the extra hp is far too good to pass up)
Every 15 seconds she got back around 9 extra mana.
They really do need to adjust her mana costs though, they're obscenely high for someone who doesn't have a way to restore their mana (unlike Xerath who can survive with his high costs due to his passive)
Sona Ping39 votesConsidering that works out to bringing a lot of mages early mana regen up to 150%, yeah 3 MP5 is quite a nice little buff.
"They really do need to adjust her mana costs though" Truth. Considering how much Riot has written about encouraging aggression and that mana shouldn't be the gate for play, they haven't gotten their act together on these things (look at those chalice changes a while back).
cshakes9 votesHonestly they could add a small flat mana gain whenever she procs her passive. Have it be larger for hitting champions. Yup, kinda same-y, but it "increases risk" or whatever Riot's all about with long-range mages.
kunkudunk4 votesThe only issue I have with this is it doesn't really make much thematic sense, at least to me. I'd much rather just have her e cost 100 mana at max level. I mean it costs more than her ult, and her ult is obviously much more impacting than her e.
Zone of Endless4 votesDid the additional 3 MP5 really help all that much? (legitimately asking because I've almost never ran 21/0/9, usually always run 21/9/0 on any mage, usually the extra hp is far too good to pass up)
Every 15 seconds she got back around 9 extra mana.
They really do need to adjust her mana costs though, they're obscenely high for someone who doesn't have a way to restore their mana (unlike Xerath who can survive with his high costs due to his passive)
It's a free faerie charm. Maybe my play style is different, but a free faerie charm in the beginning combined with doran's ring is just too good.
ChaoticPinecone3 votesim in the opposite boat - i find the movespeed too good to pass up, and the biscuit helps with the health you dont have.
NuSix310 votesIt was never just the 3 mana regen. That alone wasn't much. But if I have to first back and all I can afford is a forbidden idol or a couple of faerie charms, in combination with the 3 points in utility becomes extra helpful to the early laning phase.
Point is this game has been slowly telling mages to f-off in place of resource-less champs with better burst and continues to make life even harder without explaining why.
Sooko20 votesLiterally every mage suffered with this, not just Lux. 
Blitzidious24 votesLiterally every mage suffered with this, not just Lux.
Baby, Swain don't need that shit. Just last hit and you're K. (Early game, not that much of a problem for him, but late and mid, where he'll most likely be team fighting, yeah, it him hard. Fuck mate.)
hgjkdlsaf jeldvb1 votesSwain is actually really bad at last hitting, though it is possible, I suppose.
Blitzidious2 votes[{quoted}](name=hgjkdlsaf jeldvb,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B19zTPLQ,comment-id=000400000002,timestamp=2015-05-28T21:21:13.635+0000)
Swain is actually really bad at last hitting, though it is possible, I suppose.
Practice makes almost perfect, mate.
darkdill20 votesLux has it worse off because her mana costs were never modernized. Riot seems content to just give people SG Lux and then silently say "Shut up, we don't care about Lux's balance issues!"
Sooko3 votesMy 125 mana costing ultimate Veigar begs to differ
darkdill15 votesVeigar has Equilibrium to improve his mana regeneration. What does Lux have? Nothing.
Sooko5 votesThat Equilibrium that is neglectible until you have mana regen items? That Equilibrium that is only relevant when your mana is nearly zero, and you are getting all-in'd by assassins? Not to mention Equilibrium even got WORSE with these changes, as now Veigar has 0 help from masteries to synergize with his passive, making it even worse early game.
Be Equilibrium relevant or not, this isn't even about their kits, all you said was about modernized mana costs, and about that, Veigar's were only halfly modernized after he got a winrate dropping to 38%. If you'd trade mana problems for not landing a single binding with Lux during a whole patch that is up to you.
Some abilities can cost more than 100 mana, no rules were made about that, but all ults were supposed to cost 100 mana and that is it. Same for Amumu, Pantheon and many others I could list if I weren't lazy.
darkdill7 votesOkay, who said you could derail the topic and turn it into a Veigar one?
ElJanitorFrank4 votesViktor's laser is 110 mana. I have no problems with this.
CreationFlaw4 votesVeigar has Equilibrium to improve his mana regeneration. What does Lux have? Nothing.
Veigar also has to farm. Consistently. His costs are also higher then yours. So no, you have twice his range and the same if not higher damage early game.
Aeolian Melodies23 votesThis just in.
Mid Lux does not need to farm.
Kosm1K2 votesCorrection, Mid Lux does not need to use her Q on each and every minion to farm, just one E and she clears wave
LeeDark20 votesNo, she doesn't. Go try it. It takes two items and max E just to clear the ranged minions, and you better hope you haven't fallen behind or you'll have to auto them, too. Up until that point, you aren't waveclearing jack shit.
DanofDemacia5 votes[{quoted}](name=Aeolian Melodies,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B19zTPLQ,comment-id=000400020000000000010000,timestamp=2015-05-28T02:23:08.277+0000)
This just in.
Mid Lux does not need to farm.
Lol have my children
YOU BEEN WARNED20 votesWoooah, look at me. 25 more mana cost than the average person on an ultimate.
cough
I'm so short on mana, because I will obviously cast it more than Lucent Singularity in lane & teamfights.
cough
Mecha MaIphite12 votesshort joke detected
Sooko2 votesIts not like there are actually rules for ult costs or something!
You circlejerk and act like Lux is the ONLY champion in the game that has an ability that costs more than 100 mana, and act like she suffers more than other champions. But alright, I know I won't win against an upvote brigade in boards of LoL.
YOU BEEN WARNED1 votesYou're not wrong about Veigar needing buffs, in my opinion anyway. But poke mages definitely need mana more than burst mages.
needs the ability to land his combo on a target, he doesn't need the mana.
Sooko2 votesI didn't write this to prove a point about Veigar needing buffs (this time). All I did was saying that acting like Lux is the only obsolete champion mana-wise, as well as the one who suffers the most from it was wrong. I didn't even disagree with the fact that her E needed buffs. Veigar was merely the first champion that came to my mind when explaining such.
ElJanitorFrank2 votesI disagree. Veigar cannot lane without using his abilities, which drains his mana and ultimately leaves him with no ability to use his combo. He needs his mana to lane, yet doing so renders him unable to do his combo, which is his only purpose in the game.
Nyaboron4 votesI run 21/9/0 most of the time, since lux is so frail early. Farm as best as you can and stop using E to clear waves, you dolt. It's hard but once you get your early chalice and/or maybe another dorans ring it's not as bad. Clearing waves with your spells alone is something you do defensively mid-late game. If you're doing it early and complaining about mana, it's probably because she's not designed to be able to Alamo towers forever and give the enemy some counterplay and pushing ability.
darkdill4 votesI must ask you to stop opposing the crowd. Everybody agrees that even if she's being conservative, Lux's E is too costly at 130 mana per shot.
Nyaboron6 votes"I must ask you to stop opposing the crowd" -free will detected-
Apparently not EVERYONE agrees. Personally, I think it's fine that it's expensive. It makes her not as oppressive early to make up for her mid-late game damage. If her E was cheap, it would be free and easy poke as well as wave-clear completely negating her vulnerability early game. Use it sparingly. If you truly love the champion, love her for her weakness and learn to play around it. She has more than 1 ability you know.
OJ19110 votes"I must ask you to stop opposing the crowd" -free will detected-
Apparently not EVERYONE agrees. Personally, I think it's fine that it's expensive. It makes her not as oppressive early to make up for her mid-late game damage. If her E was cheap, it would be free and easy poke as well as wave-clear completely negating her vulnerability early game. Use it sparingly. If you truly love the champion, love her for her weakness and learn to play around it. She has more than 1 ability you know.
you can already barely farm pre-grail or blue+chalice, let alone harassing enough to go for a kill on anyone who isn't terrible.
Meanwhile those champions that are manaless or have kits that are effectively manaless.
Nyaboron3 votesThat's just flat out untrue. I've seen plenty of lux players play up in their lane, farm fine, and manage to poke. She's difficult to play correctly, yeah. She is good in some matchups and needs some items to get going, but she's super powerful late game. Because of her later power, she needs to be weak early so that she isn't oppressive. If she's had this weakness for a long time, chances are it's there for a reason. Lux is designed to have high costs and medium spell damage to force you to walk up and AA to proc your passive for the spell to be worth it poke-wise. I see too many people sit back and spam E until they're out of mana and never even use their passive (which costs 0 mana). You have to risk yourself a bit to be cost effective.
Instead of reducing spell cost, they should probably give a slight buff to her passive damage. This would help her farm and poke without allowing her to sit back and spam.
darkdill5 votesGo in to autoattack a Zed, Yasuo or Kat as Lux? Nice knowing you...
OJ1917 votesThat's just flat out untrue. I've seen plenty of lux players play up in their lane, farm fine, and manage to poke. She's difficult to play correctly, yeah. She is good in some matchups and needs some items to get going, but she's super powerful late game. Because of her later power, she needs to be weak early so that she isn't oppressive. If she's had this weakness for a long time, chances are it's there for a reason. Lux is designed to have high costs and medium spell damage to force you to walk up and AA to proc your passive for the spell to be worth it poke-wise. I see too many people sit back and spam E until they're out of mana and never even use their passive (which costs 0 mana). You have to risk yourself a bit to be cost effective.
Instead of reducing spell cost, they should probably give a slight buff to her passive damage. This would help her farm and poke without allowing her to sit back and spam.
meanwhile zed
meanwhile xerath who has to autoattack 1 time not 6
meanwhile yasuo
I didn't know you had to use spells to farm.
I guess you don't like living either
PS: when assassins can outpoke a mage whose laning phase is all about poking, something is wrong.
skill-shot dependency isn't a weakness, it's difficulty. If you factor difficulty directly into a champ's power, they're going to be balanced at low tier play but be retarded broken for good players. Get good with her skillshots, it's a key to playing the champion. Same goes for mobility to a lesser extent. If you get caught out as an ezreal or nid, they're mobile so they don't get punished as hard as a lux might. High mana is a completely separate problem.
You're joking right, if anything she's weaker than many easy/safe champions. Mediocre damage if you can't proc passive from every spell and aren't fed, high mana costs, low mana regen, slow, relatively squishy only slightly mitigated by having a shield - which ironically some assassins can kill you right through without giving a single fuck if you aren't also stacking resists.
Nyaboron1 votesDon't blindly pick lux into poor matchups. Zed/Yasuo are poor matchups and Kat becomes one if you let her roam and get kills. Kassadin for example has no real way of farming pre-6 short of sitting under tower.
OJ1919 votesDon't blindly pick lux into poor matchups. Zed/Yasuo are poor matchups and Kat becomes one if you let her roam and get kills. Kassadin for example has no real way of farming pre-6 short of sitting under tower.
I'm sorry I wasn't aware that you can automagically always pick mid second, let alone if you aren't playing draft for whatever reasons.
PS: Kat and kass are both poor matchups for lux unless they are bad, even if they doesn't roam and get kills.
Nyaboron2 votesIf you have first pick mid, pick a champion that's safe into most matchups, or a champion whose counter is crap or will be crap into their teamcomp. Champ select is a game in itself. If you have the opportunity to pick mid second, then you may choose your full pool of mids, some of whom you wouldn't pick blindly. Don't think every champ needs to be viable in every matchup and every situation. It's not going to happen. Lux is a niche pick, if you like her get good enough with her to play her.
OJ1917 votesIf you have first pick mid, pick a champion that's safe into most matchups, or a champion whose counter is crap or will be crap into their teamcomp. Champ select is a game in itself. If you have the opportunity to pick mid second, then you may choose your full pool of mids, some of whom you wouldn't pick blindly. Don't think every champ needs to be viable in every matchup and every situation. It's not going to happen. Lux is a niche pick, if you like her get good enough with her to play her.
Except riot has stated on multiple occasions that games should not be decided from champ select, which multiple picks will do so vs lux if the player is competent at that champion.
You shouldn't be able to win every matchup no, but you should definitely be able to "not lose" which lux has a VERY VERY hard time (if not impossible) doing vs some champions if the player is at all competent.
LeeDark2 votesYou're kidding, right? Kass' passive, combined with Lux's high costs and low damage, mean all he needs is vial + 3 pots and he'll be fine. Probably even out-trade her.
darkdill12 votesLux has enough weaknesses and counterplay when it comes to mobility and skill-shot dependency. High mana cost is just obnoxious.
Nyaboron2 votesskill-shot dependency isn't a weakness, it's difficulty. If you factor difficulty directly into a champ's power, they're going to be balanced at low tier play but be retarded broken for good players. Get good with her skillshots, it's a key to playing the champion. Same goes for mobility to a lesser extent. If you get caught out as an ezreal or nid, they're mobile so they don't get punished as hard as a lux might. High mana is a completely separate problem.
darkdill5 votesIt seems further debating with you on the matter will just result in circlejerking.
LeeDark8 votesGo compare Lux's overall base damage and ratios to other REAL late game mages, then come back. Literally her ONLY advantage is the low cooldown on her ult. She isn't exactly a lane bully, because of her low damage.
You're right, she does have more than one ability. A Q that pales in comparison to other CC, a shield that, despite being harder to aim, isn't as strong if the first shield doesn't get used up before the second is applied, and an ult that is... well, in the end, it's nothing more than REALLY good waveclear.
OJ1914 votesGo compare Lux's overall base damage and ratios to other REAL late game mages, then come back. Literally her ONLY advantage is the low cooldown on her ult. She isn't exactly a lane bully, because of her low damage.
You're right, she does have more than one ability. A Q that pales in comparison to other CC, a shield that, despite being harder to aim, isn't as strong if the first shield doesn't get used up before the second is applied, and an ult that is... well, in the end, it's nothing more than REALLY good waveclear.
yeah you only need decent movespeed to get out of ult before it goes off if you aren't CCed, let alone if you have movespeed enhancing abilities and/or items.
Penguin Eclipse3 votesWhile I agree the change sucks the actual results are not game breaking. Need more mana? Mana regen runes. It won't take many to equal the effects of what you got out of meditation when you combine them with Expanded Mind. You're giving up a lot more going 18/0/12 than giving up a few runes.
Sona Ping9 votesOf course it's not "game breaking", but that's not a valid point.
The problem is that Mana Regen runes suck. Yes, you give up more going 18/0/12 than giving up a few runes, but what you give up to get those runes is worse than if you didn't in the first place. The best strategy is to just suffer through it and that is what's awful.
darkdill7 votesThis, and Lux has enough trouble against manaless mids. Now she simply can't fight them because she'll never have enough to fire a single spell off until she gets Chalice, and even then it'll be dicey.
Zed, in particular, is a nightmare match. He can match your harassment, rush a Bilgewater Cutlass to make your harass useless, and if you don't go Seeker's Armguard first he can rape you whenever he wants to.
Sammystorm2 votesthis is a particular over exaggeration. Lux only has mana problems if you spam spells. there are several champions out there who are in a similar boat but they make up for it with how powerful each individual spell is and their insane mid game. They also have range which is more of a defining feature then spells in the first few level.