To the Lulu players who are wondering why she's being hit with so many nerfs to her solo lane

MrNuclearPumpkin··29 votes·6,702 views
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/1a/1a/ee/1a1aeea7c6c1003aab0b4642043f83ff.jpg

Edit: The picture won't come up. :( http://i.imgur.com/r0UrHIO.jpg There.

If you are wondering this, it's very possible some of you might be wondering: "If they want to make Lulu so much of a support and less of a mid laner, why not make other midlaners less of a support? Why single Lulu out?"

As a Lulu main since Season 2, allow me to explain my own input on this. And why the changes are warranted and deserved. TL;DR is at the bottom.

Disclaimer: What I am about to say is going to be put through my own perspective. If I am incorrect with certain things, feel free to tell me where.

When I joined League of Legends, it was after the League of Black Cleaver was brought to it's end. (Thank god)

http://i.imgur.com/RUZpYGG.jpg?1 This was a dark time.

When I joined, there was only one top laner. Renekton. His early game was unmatched. His damage was absolutely incredible and all most top laners could do were try and not die super early and to avoid feeding him. If Renekton was played top, your team was expecting you to die.

This was when I saw Lulu making her way towards being a solo-laner. She was able to reliably survive his early game and potentially even beat him, due to her kit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1Gs1D2rUIM

In this video Phreak used her as a "jungler" (and she was amazing at it), so if you're wondering where the idea for Lulu jungle came from, it came from Phreak.


As the seasons went on, Lulu was changed quite a lot. She's not nearly as overwhelmingly strong as she was then.

Whimsy also gave AP to her allies (and yourself), slowed and removed all movement abilities that were on the enemy champion at the time of your casting the ability.

She could also have a combo where she would Glitterlance > Help Pix > AA AA AA AA > Then right before Help pix ended, she could glitterlance you again, but this time because Help pix was still on you her Glitterlance would gain an AoE increase. Oh and don't forget, she could wave clear and harass you at the same time. This was on top of being able to slow you on her engage and removing any movement speed you were given, then slowing you again (Not to mention her knock up).

Fast forward to the last season in 2015 when Faker was using her. Lulu was a dominant force in solo lane. Let me list the things she could do: She could speed herself up, nuke you with her glitterlance, keep herself alive with her ultimate, shield herself, polymorph you, slow you, speed another champion up, give them a shield, use your ult on them, give true sight and harass with auto attacks. Oh and don't forget, Thunderlords was disturbingly strong on her, because it made her already obnoxiously strong early game even stronger.

She made assassins almost completely unplayable. She never ever ever had a weak point where she fell off. Early, mid and late game, she could always ether kill you, or cause you to die. And her ultimate and shields made getting picks that much more difficult. Basically, her utility was absolutely and utterly broken unmatched by any champion in this game. She gave picks, peel, damage, vision, AND she could build tanky if she wanted to... and still have 45% CDR. She needed to be nerfed badly and they needed to ether nerf her utility and make her more of a nuke-mage, or nerf her early game damage and make her more of a support. ONE of those things had to happen. We're lucky it's just her damage.


TL;DR: Her utility was utterly broken and needed to take some kind of hit for her not to completely dominate the meta.

I hope this helps shed some light on the people wondering why Lulu is getting hit with the nerf hammer... and will probably continue to keep getting hit as the seasons go on.

Lulu

29 Comments

ZephyrDrake21 votes

and now lulu is a piece of garbage that is not worth taking in either mid nor support

Zero Skill Tank1 votes

Which is a good thing.

YumaS2Astral9 votes

I really like playing Lulu and I don't like playing support, I wouldn't want Lulu to be completely unviable at solo laning.

MrNuclearPumpkin1 votes

{quoted}

I really like playing Lulu and I don't like playing support, I wouldn't want Lulu to be completely unviable at solo laning.

I don't ether. But she was really way too strong. Champions that normally would have an okay or strong early game, would be beaten off by Lulu's insane early game damage.

She had 0 bad matchups. Every matchup was ether a skill based matchup or in her favor. And this was in the top lane, mid lane or support. She was always the dominant champion. Think of her like, The Zac of mages. She didn't give the absolute best in one ability, but she always gave the next best option in EVERY ability.

You want to play Zyra for damage? But, you're afraid of a ton of ganks and you want to keep your ADC safe in a way Zyra can't? Play Lulu and build full AP.

You want to play Janna for her shields and displacement, but want to actually help your ADC in dealing damage? Play Lulu and go take Windseeker's Blessing and rush item 3504 and max your Help Pix. You'll give a ton of shields, giving your ADC a bunch of attack speed with your Whimsy and Ardent passive. And because you still have AP, you can still harass with your auto attacks, Help Pix and Glitterlance.

If you want to focus on healing and shielding and keeping your carries alive but you don't wanna play Soraka? Play Lulu, take Windseeker's Blessing, and build item 3504 item 3174 item 3190 item 3222

And each of these builds are viable for Lulu.

Even with these nerfs, Lulu still brings so much utility that no other champion can match.... other than Ekko xD

YumaS2Astral1 votes

Well, speaking of bad matchups, I partially agree with what you said. At mid lane, whenever I wanted to play Lulu, I could be countered by champions that could outrange her, like Azir, Brand, Jayce, or Xerath. Also, most of those scale really well into late game in terms of damage, while Lulu, even though she still does damage if she builds AP, definitively cannot compare with the damage they can bring. I would feel worthless if my team couldn't take advantage of her utility. Lulu mid was a problem mostly against assassins and short ranged mages.

At top lane she indeed had no counters, but I don't think that this is a problem with Lulu herself, but with the ranged x melee problem (that everyone is complaining about currently). Outside of Irelia, no melee bruiser would be a problem and even Irelia was an even matchup. If melee champions had better ways to survive the laning phase against ranged matchups in general, I am sure that Lulu would be a healthy top laner.

Athenes Lulu4 votes

Though you have to remember that she was nearly 100% pick/ban in competitive because she was so generalist in terms of both damage and utility.

There isn't a problem with the fact that Lulu can go outside botlane and function as a solo laner. However, it becomes a problem when solo Lulu has all of support Lulu's strengths as well as covering up all of her weaknesses nearly completely, and that she eventually became a "must pick" almost every game due to having too much and too good of everything in a solo laner: safety, bully potential, waveclear, loaded with utility, has DPS, and does not have the risks of "becoming useless" when camped. Yeah, that has to go.

THE RlVER KlNG5 votes

It's the Lulu effect. When a support champion gets too good at dealing damage or solo tanking, then they get played top or mid. Has happened with Tahm, Raka, and Ali in the past, and Riot have hated it, so they nerf it to the ground. As opposed to mages with such ridiculous bases (looking at you Brand and Vel) that they can say screw it and be played as a support, which Riot apparently is fine with.

AttackOnTeemos6 votes

^This is a prime example of someone who did their homework. Now if everyone else would do this....there wouldn't be as nearly that much complaining.

EvilUnicornLord5 votes

Does this have to do with my post about the adjustments to her Glitterlance? Because I don't mind her being solo lane as long as she has some counterplay and is more viable as a support.

Serika Zero5 votes

Ekko still has more utility than Lulu. And somehow this important aspect keeps "eluding" rito

Athenes Lulu4 votes

When someone finally realized that there are no "real bad matchups" and "bad metas" for Lulu, even botlane. That's what happens when a champion is loaded with both supporting-dedicated utility plus a kick of DPS, like Karma/Morgana/Zilean/etc.

Was expecting some "pls dont nurf looloo" thread, but actually turned out to be something more reasonable... take my +1.

Duke of Sloths3 votes

Lulu solo lane was probably the most fun I've had with Lulu. It really kicks her character up a whole notch, every ability felt impactful. Even if it was overbearing in competitive, it really wasn't anything different than Orianna or Karma in regular play. You'd have to rely on your allies to carry as well, buffing them to keep them alive while they did their roles. It's not awful tbh, she just doesn't compete with the waveclear of the current mid laners and she has poor synergy with Rylais. Lulu top probably works better these days though.

Lulu needs a VU too. With how expressive Poppy and Tristana are in there animations and voiceovers, it's really sad watching Lulu just stand there with this dead stare with a VERY bad model.

Teémò2 votes

Thing is though, utility mages are designed to be incredibly annoying. Karma Ekko Orianna Zilean She was nerfed not because of her lane dominance, but like nidalee how well she worked with the support items available.
Example: Kogmaw goes jungle and the duo Lulu goes top lane. Kogmaw goes into the top lane and lulu gives him a 25% attack speed buff level 1 and her pix. From there they switch to other lanes and take the towers. Basically split push win people did it to diamond a lot. Because lulu would be in lane she could buy item 3504 pretty quickly for him and her pix because of cdr she could cast on him before it would ever wear off. Nidalee Turned out the same way. Her heal was small, but the attack speed was large. These were the first two champions to recieve nerfs due to healing items

Paroe2 votes

{quoted}

Thing is though, utility mages are designed to be incredibly annoying. Karma Ekko Orianna Zilean She was nerfed not because of her lane dominance, but like nidalee how well she worked with the support items available.
Example: Kogmaw goes jungle and the duo Lulu goes top lane. Kogmaw goes into the top lane and lulu gives him a 25% attack speed buff level 1 and her pix. From there they switch to other lanes and take the towers. Basically split push win people did it to diamond a lot. Because lulu would be in lane she could buy item 3504 pretty quickly for him and her pix because of cdr she could cast on him before it would ever wear off. Nidalee Turned out the same way. Her heal was small, but the attack speed was large. These were the first two champions to recieve nerfs due to healing items

The difference between them is that lulu is a "support only" champion - riot doesnt WANT lulu to be anything but a support so they nerf her to the point where she cant be anything BUT a dog on a leash. They did it to sona, they did it to soraka, and they built braum for it. Karma and zilean have their iconic playstyle not as support, but as "a mid lane mage" - which is why they get to keep their incredible utility AND midlaner damage when champions like sona and lulu get nerfed heavily for it. They might get nerfed slightly in favor of "making them more a support" but those changes are random and out of the blue; its likely a rioter was playing them and got frustrated at something, then changed it because they can cough Karma not being able to tether large jungle mobs or shield minions cough

Champions like lulu and braum who have a single entirely offensive ability NEED that one ability to be very good, or the champion feels terrible to play. Lulu needs to have her Q compare with other waveclear spells; a single Q should clear the backline with a minimum of AP (say 200) in the lategame. Braum needs his shield changed so that it stops on the first champion hit, so he has a waveclear tool.

Something riot really needs to realize is that EVERY champion should have two viable roles, and innate waveclear is what helps that happen. the champions who dont have innate waveclear are terrible to play... and some that do have waveclear, are just terrible to play. Ziggs is a huge example of "terrible to play" despite having so much aoe... it costs him 200 mana to clear the caster minions. Lux can clear it with 100 mana. LB can clear it for 80. Zed can do it for free.

RageLessPlayMore2 votes

[deleted]

CasterGilgamesh6 votes

yet everyone screams that riot has a bias every time a good skin comes out for an "op" or popular champion

TurquoiseYoshi2 votes

WAOW MORE JINX SKIN FU RITO U BISED

ShaolinToilet1 votes

I'd like to point out they gave jinx a huge buff before releasing her skin

Joseraph1 votes

Because she wasn't seeing a whole ton of play?

ShaolinToilet1 votes

Yes a buff that would make everyone play her because she would be too strong. when everyone plays her they buy her legendary skin more often.

LadyRenly2 votes

tbh, I don't have any sympathy for assassin players. Assassins are greedy picks, and utility laners help the team and not just themselves.

Oh well, I can just play solo Zilean

Joseraph1 votes

>Implying killing the main enemy damage source doesn't help the team

MrNuclearPumpkin1 votes

Thanks for your positive responses guys. Note, I don't want to give the impression that solo-lane Lulu is horrible. In fact I frankly believe that AD lulu is probably the best build for her in the top lane. (And is probably even more oppressive than Renekton). It falls off a bit, but it still works.

I still think solo lane Lulu works very well, but you guys have to admit. Being able to slam your Q completely into the wave, dealing full damage to them and the champion you hit was absolutely busted.

Frankly? I just think Riot needs to rework her. Her kit is a bit outdated along with her VU and her model. I agree with how Tristana and Poppy are incredibly expressive yet Lulu has the same exact model she had on her release. (Seriously even Cho'gath had his model redone)

I feel like Lulu needs a serious change, ether making her a complete support or making her into a full mage. As long as her kit scales fully off of AP, then people are going to throw her mid-lane or top. The more AP you have, the more your shield increases. The more AP you have, the more movement speed your whimsy gives.

"Lulu enlarges her ally, knocking nearby enemies into the air. For 7 seconds, her ally gains 300/450/600 (+50% Ability Power) bonus health and slows nearby enemies by 30/45/60%"

Even now after her nerfs, those numbers are still crazy.

Seenan1 votes

I didn't play back then, but I've always known how strong Lulu was before the nerfs. It's pretty warranted she get the nerfs.

Xela Syab1 votes

I think Lulu is in a better state than Sona.

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

lulu was in every damn game. top mid top mid top mid top mid top mid

Refer A Friend 11 votes

Good thing my hybrid lulu is still going strong

OyddAWqJ5r1 votes

They should just remove self-cast from her ultimate and revert a ton of her other nerfs in compensation. That way she plays like most other ranged top laners that fall off after 6 as a lane bully

ChaddyFantome1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sleeper Cell,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Arx4PN7p,comment-id=000f,timestamp=2016-11-03T13:28:38.730+0000)

They should just remove self-cast from her ultimate and revert a ton of her other nerfs in compensation. That way she plays like most other ranged top laners that fall off after 6 as a lane bully

-hur dur Morg shouldn't be able to self cast her E http://s1.dmcdn.net/K_ZUo/1280x720-4pr.jpg

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