What do you consider Counterplay to be?

Votable Jester·Feb 22, 2017·1 votes·907 views

Earlier today, I saw a comment saying that everyone seems to have their own definition of counterplay, which, now that I think about it, seems to be true.

To me, counterplay is the potential for any champion to avoid or work around the opponent, meaning that you don't need a dash, spellshield, windwall, etc. to deal with them. It's also preferable if you don't need to buy a specific item.

This is not a post about current balance, just trying to get a firmer idea on what people consider counterplay to be. Go ahead and post your own definition below, and please upvote any definition you agree with. To keep track of the opinion on my definition as well (without tying it to the post's votes), here's a poll.

5 Comments

dominusxFeb 22, 20172 votes

can i dodge your shit? counterplay. I cant dodge your shit? No counterplay. simple as that.

Dark NephthysFeb 22, 20171 votes

To me it's "Is there a way you can fight/outplay or just avoid" or something like that, which I'm personally counting Items/Summoner spells to that as well like how Sustain champions counterplay is item 3123 item 3033 item 3165 summoner 14 which is something that can be used to fight them, though in some champions cases it might be to much of one but that is generally a champion issue at that point.

Personally, I'm tired of when people say X champion is fair because you can CC them, and that being their only counterplay, because that is counterplay to basically every champion who is not a tank. Hell even some tanks CC is a good counterplay into them as well, the only people that I don't mind people saying CC is their counterplay is Katarina because her ultimate is a large portion of her damage and hitting her with CC during it will cut her damage so in her case I can agree.

Votable JesterFeb 22, 20171 votes

I agree with you for the most part. My only issue is when items become the source of counterplay, champions are too strong when you don't have the item, too weak when you do have the item, or both. This is an even bigger issue when you consider that you need to dump some money in to get that item, so if you're behind, you may not be able to get access to that counterplay for a while.

JezebelleFeb 22, 20171 votes

I feel like most infinite mobility champions do not have counterplay. With champions like Katarina I think it's perfectly acceptable to have high mobility and a high damage channel ultimate that is shut down by silences/hard CC. Her infinite mobility is also situational, as it doesn't refund if used offensively, unlike Yasuo, Camilla, or Fizz. There's also an issue with mages who are supposed to be battle mages dealing assassin level damage having 'counterplay' such as Syndra's ult, Annie's ult, or Veigar's ult. However, unlike assassins, they are usually kitable (iffy on Veigar, personally think his stun lands too soon, and needs a +.5s warning). True counterplay is hard to find in League, I'd like to think of champions such as Sona as having clear counterplay, gameplay patterns that are unique and at times strong, but certainly playable against.

AdeBugFeb 22, 20171 votes

First, imo you can counter not just a champ, you could also counter one or a set of abilities, or a champ in a specific lane, or a combination of champ + specific item, or combination of abilities merged from 2 diff champs, and not just supp+adc synergies, but also yas+malphite double knockups, or as someone complained in a thread a few months back, even a combination of spells, like 3 teleports. A play, again imo, is a sequence of actions that one or more players can accomplish at the right time, with an advantageous outcome, that can be repeated once the opportunity resurfaces, eventually becoming a minigame strategy. I say sequence because a single action, e.g. flashing out of something is just that, flashing out of it. It can be done in a moment of desperation, too, and flash alone should not be the only counter to, well, anything. counter+play=counterplay

I don't think it means just avoiding or working around, that sounds pretty passive or defensive, when you can actually be the aggressor before the fact, or simply have an effective counter, during or after the fact. An example for a simple counter I can think of right now is ziggs' bouncing bomb, most people instinctively run away form it in the same direction it was thrown, occasionally trying to dodge it at the same time, but failing cus of its aoe. Running towards it is counter intuitive but works better. Closing the gap is an aggressive move, I'd say.