Ingenious Hunter is Incredibly Underrated

iPooUnicorns·Mar 11, 2018·62 votes·23,578 views

When it gets fully stacked, you get 40% CDR on active items.

To put this in perspective:

- 24 second cooldown (16 seconds less than normal)
- 72 second cooldown (48 seconds less than normal)
- 6 second cooldown (4 seconds less than normal)
- 12 second cooldown (8 seconds less than normal)
- 54 second cooldown (36 seconds less than normal)
- 27 second cooldown (18 seconds less than normal)
Predator boots go from (150 - 100 seconds) to (90 - 60 seconds)

94 Comments

Sire HippingtonMar 11, 201844 votes

you forgot the most important part of it: item 3340 108-54sec cd instead of 180-90 item 3364 item 3341 54-36 instead of 90-60 item 3363 119-59 instead of 198-99

TotalJerkMar 11, 201820 votes

I'm really wondering why I don't see more Lee Sin players running this rune since Tracker's was removed.

JustMonika13Mar 12, 20184 votes

{quoted}

I'm really wondering why I don't see more Lee Sin players running this rune since Tracker's was removed.

Because muh map pressure (Out of combat MS Hunter) or muh dueling (Omnivamp Hunter)

Besides, people would rather complain that they got hit by an action (Tracker removal) instead of trying to find new ways to adapt.

Automated RivenMar 11, 20189 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sire Hippington,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AW7AJ6Us,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-03-11T20:13:18.484+0000)

you forgot the most important part of it: 108-54sec cd instead of 180-90 54-36 instead of 90-60 119-59 instead of 198-99

But wards don't give me moar damages.

My Waifu VanillaMar 12, 20185 votes

Or you could just be even faster than everyone else and take the movement speed one.

BriarsMar 12, 20181 votes

if you're taking predator it also applies to that. which means on something like skarner with Righteous glory you ALWAYS have a speedboost for your ganking

My Waifu VanillaMar 13, 20181 votes

I'm talking about Relentless Hunter since 40 movement speed is worth an absurd amount of gold for a minor rune even after the diminishing returns on movement speed.

Karn BishopMar 12, 20181 votes

Here's the thing though combat utility though early game damage runes will always be more valuable then a mid to late game rune to reduce item CD, its just basic logic win hard early to secure towers and objectives which increases your odds of winning late game, gives more map and gold sources for you to access once you push them off of their 1 turrets.

In short "Moar damages" is the correct choice 98% of the time so why not choose it?

Automated RivenMar 13, 20181 votes

Proper warding is by and large the most important thing in the game. Why would you sacrifice the ability to set up and execute plays, while avoiding the enemies for a bit of extra damage??

Pierce The VealMar 12, 20182 votes

This part makes me want to work it into my runepages sometime. On every champion. Help me ;_;

I think I can figure out a way to get it in on Kassadin and Akali. Though in the case of Akali that’ll make me miss out on sweet, sweet Ravenous Hunter.

Sire HippingtonMar 12, 20181 votes

i totally get you, the state of vision pretty much ever since S6 is really poor, now even more without trackers, so ingenious hunter seems like a great rune to get, which is sad since ravenous huner is quite great on many champs, especially akali, and kassadin also can make quite some use from it. However, both can get good use from the item cdr beyond trinkets, gunblade is staple on akali and kassadin can use either of the hextech items to supplement his burst. Especially the GLP longranged slow can boost your roams alot as rush item, riftwalk into active can apply the slow from ~1500 range rather reliably.

Pierce The VealMar 12, 20181 votes

The thing with kassadin is that he prefers ROA due to its sheer stats. Kassadin scales harder with stats. That or he gets archangels for the ridiculous benefits it gives him.

Sire HippingtonMar 12, 20181 votes

you can get an early tear nto a later archangel regardless, and Roa is not a must have, though you need to play more carefully without the extra health. It's a more midgame focused built for powerfull roams at the cost of some survivabillity for teamifghts compared to a tear+roa built.

NotYourSideChickMar 13, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sire Hippington,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AW7AJ6Us,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-03-11T20:13:18.484+0000)

you forgot the most important part of it: 108-54sec cd instead of 180-90 54-36 instead of 90-60 119-59 instead of 198-99

wait. 54 seconds? Wards last over a minute so you'll actually run out of available wards on the map.

On the flipside, as long as you gain 1 ward per person with your sweeping lens, they have 0 ward uptime (assuming you sweep right after they place).

SwiftKitten88Mar 11, 20188 votes

that would be great if i could actually run it on my support.. they need to bring it to the inspiration tree. im not running domination on my supports..

Orange CaramelMar 11, 20181 votes

{quoted}

that would be great if i could actually run it on my support.. they need to bring it to the inspiration tree. im not running domination on my supports..

Yeah running domination on someone like Sona is borderline reportable imo

JackMcSnipeyzMar 11, 201812 votes

well, you can get zombie ward and ingenius hunter, as a seconday tree, this gives some very nice vision control , espacially early when wards arent so common with the CD and all, so it;s not that bad

Sire HippingtonMar 11, 201820 votes

domination is a great secundary spec for sups, it grants alot vidion controll with zombi wards or ghostporo, and ingenious hunter is pretty good for many supports as they go for alot active items.

SwiftKitten88Mar 11, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sire Hippington,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AW7AJ6Us,comment-id=00030001,timestamp=2018-03-11T20:14:56.864+0000)

domination is a great secundary spec for sups, it grants alot vidion controll with zombi wards or ghostporo, and ingenious hunter is pretty good for many supports as they go for alot active items.

except i can give up sorcery or inspiration on both Lux and Morgana

or resolve or sorcery on Blitzcrank ..

MuzétMar 11, 20184 votes

You can give up inspiration on Lux and Morg. Morg you want the stopwatch but with the cd reduction you'll have zhonya more often... And with Lux I don't see what's that much mandatory on her... But you aren't building many active on her anyway.

Snowman ArcMar 12, 20182 votes

Thing is, it's all about efficiency and gold generation. You can't really give up free boots or Stopwatch on a support, since you are not getting a lot of gold compared to other roles. There is so much depth in the game, every little detail matters. Inspiration really works wonders.

MuzétMar 12, 20181 votes

Technically you can. You're not getting a lot of gold but should I remind you that your items are cheaper than those other roles? You have a gold generation item. I'm pretty much maining support and I mostly skip inspiration tree because it doesn't really provide me what I want except maybe the magical boots on some supports but I can deal without them While Zombie ward helps me keeping a lot of vision throughout the game for example, or resolve strengthen my healing output..

RiotSparkleMar 12, 201815 votes

I run Ingenious and Zombie Ward pretty frequently on support. Depending on the champion, Cheap Shot is also a very good choice. Honestly, I am really happy to have the option of...well basically every secondary on support characters. These are my favorite runes for supports (I play every class of support), generally:

Sorcery - Manaflow, Ultimate Hat, Scorch Inspo - Approach Velocity, Boots, All in Good Time, Biscuits, Cosmic Insight Dom - Cheap Shot, Zombie Ward, Ingenious Precision - Triumph, Coup De Grace (These are usually my ARAM secondaries) Resolve - Font of Life, Bone Plating, Reviltalize

AhristocatsMar 11, 20187 votes

thing is i don't like scaling runes, ingenious hunter is good to scale but it doesn't give anything in lane

i like runes that help me to win lane

MorganFreemanBotMar 11, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AW7AJ6Us,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-03-11T19:25:34.093+0000)

thing is i don't like scaling runes, ingenious hunter is good to scale but it doesn't give anything in lane

i like runes that help me to win lane

Play a champion who's good at roaming like.. any mid laner, a lot of supports, a jungler.

Shit, I run ingenious hunter on my main jungle page for my favorite tanks. The CDR it gives you on righteous glory, especially when combined with the additional 5% from the Inspiration tree, is insane. It lets you dominate the mid game as soon as you get righteous glory, because you can ALWAYS engage on someone when they're out of position.

AhristocatsMar 12, 20183 votes

i main top bro i like to kill people and win my lane

also i almost never go into the domination tree to begin with lol

SteelflameMar 12, 20183 votes

I mean Domination is the runes primarily dedicated to roaming and exerting pressure across the map, so it sort of makes sense that a top laner who loves the "top is an island" type of deal doesn't care for it.

1437613471347134Oct 8, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AW7AJ6Us,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-03-11T19:25:34.093+0000)

thing is i don't like scaling runes, ingenious hunter is good to scale but it doesn't give anything in lane

i like runes that help me to win lane

lane doesn't do much for the game anymore. most games i lose lane because they pick a stupidly unbalanced champion and then we win the game cuz i ruin the rest of their team

RainbowIceeMar 12, 20187 votes

given the long death timers is likely even without it that the CD will be over by the next fight.

Yordle XayahMar 12, 20185 votes

Dominion was very underrated...

[zombie-nunu-bummed]

Sharp ChedarrMar 11, 20184 votes

whoa thanks for the chart. I didnt realize the differences were that large o.o

PopcornBunniMar 11, 20184 votes

Problem is it only effects trinkets a lot of the time.

Poppy item 3068 item 3065 item 3111 item 3194 item 3025 item 3742

Shen item 3068 item 3065 item 3047 item 3075 item 3748 item 3083 RekSai item 1400 item 3071 item 3026 item 3053 Hey there's a single item for it

It just feels not so hot unless you get multiple benefit from it, compared to the constant movespeed or healing from the other two options.

Ok sure but whyMar 11, 20184 votes

I miss when Ruby Crystal was a thing, so I could shorten it all the more

Furious DelishaMar 11, 201811 votes

item 1028

Ok sure but whyMar 12, 20184 votes

oops

you know what i meant

RainXBladeMar 11, 20184 votes

I usually run it on my Predator Kayn set up. I'm just sad that ppl aren't noticing on how much of an impact this rune has on active items.

SteelflameMar 12, 20182 votes

I don't take it, but just because of how much insane sustain that taking RH gives you. As Kayn you also are prone to only having 2 items that benefit (Ghostblade and the trinket) as EoN isn't a must-buy, and Duskblade doesn't get any benefit. Pred means you are giving up a lot of early game power for a bit of a gank assist, but Kayn doesn't need such a gank assist because he has so many options of where to come from, he doesn't need the added help of being able to run someone down. And if you were taking Pred for the speed boost, you may as well just take the out of combat MS rune instead, which gets you the same exact benefit of faster movement, only its all the time. Its also less damage than electrocute (which has a lower CD) and Dark Harvest can outscale it easily (especially on Kayn, practically the best farming assassin jungler to have ever existed on sheer raw capability to pull in CS, especially with his godlike waveclear in the mid to late game with his W being able to 1 shot not just casters, but also melee minions, while they are still in line formation).

For me, the general Kayn setup is Electro-Sudden-Zombie-Rav-Celerity- and either Scorch, or Gathering Storm, depending on how long I think the game will go based on general comps.

AuroramancerMar 11, 20183 votes

Why'd you have to post about this on the Boards?

Now other players will see it and complain about it being OP, then it will face some blame when people want to analyze problems in the current meta, and then the Balance Team will nerf my favorite support runes.

KoKobotoMar 12, 20183 votes

If you have at least 2 items it works off then always take it if possible. If one of the items is Zhonyas then always take it...

The EcdysiastMar 12, 20183 votes

60% until Sightstone was removed.

SB ArneemanMar 12, 20183 votes

I always run this+Zombie ward on supports.

Ahri Body PillowMar 11, 20182 votes

I used to run Ingenious Hunter on support with ruby sightstone. Shit was fucking ridiculous. But then they removed it :(

Trias000Mar 12, 20181 votes

I doesn't affect sightstone items - they have no cooldown.

KlydeFrogMar 11, 20182 votes

I used to get it a lot when they had Ruby ss. Also FYI . Item cdr has no cap on it, when you had Ruby and combine it with the one where you gain the 5% you were looking at 75%cdr.

Shrek LuigiMar 11, 20182 votes

Somebody knight this guy and give him the Victoria Cross for his outstanding service--you're a true hero, OP.

M00ndanc3Mar 11, 20182 votes

I legit take this about every single game, pair it with glacial augment and you become the most annoying tank/enchanter/mage because not only do you still hurt but the enemy is permentently slowed and theres ice tracks everywhere

Snowman ArcMar 12, 20182 votes

I don't think it's underrated, it's just not used as much because:

Most of these actives are coming on later in the game, making the rune useless for the most part. Only maybe the Tiamat, Gunblade and BorK are the items you get at the early game and out of those, only the Gunblade can be abused for its lower cooldown.
Rune still needs to stack up, which means you need to get kills / assists for it to work well, which isn't always the case.
Most of these actives aren't as useful, or do not really need the extra CDR. For example, a Stoneplate doesn't really need it. You use it, you win a fight, then you push, take Baron etc and you will have it back up regardless of the extra CDR. Sure, you can say that having Protobelt more often means you can go for more often aggressive trades with someone like Ekko or Vladimir, but you need to realize that you probably need to have your ult up to all in effectively, so the Protobelt will have its CD reset by the time you get your ult back.
Most importantly, not a lot of champions make effective use of this tree. Supports who could definitely use a more often Locket / Redemption / Mikael's etc will rarely go into this tree. ADCs generally go for 1st + 3rd, Mages go for 3rd + 5th, top laners go for 4th + 5th mostly etc. You get my point.
The extra movement speed you get, even out of combat, is really important. Early game, where you probably back often, will help you get back in lane and not miss a lot of cs, later it will help you rotate fast, assuming you have stacked it already, and is really good for junglers who spend most of their time roaming around the map. Don't forget, the MS bonus is something you get from the start of the game and can make instant use of.

JJI744Mar 12, 20182 votes

Ehh... a lot of those changes just ensure the items will be up if you fight twice in quick succession. In a single fight, your still unlikely to get a second usage out of anything except tiamat.

Not saying its bad, cause maybe you do get into a situation where you get a second fight not long afterwards and the shorter CDs make a difference, but it can be basically a dead rune in a single engage. Having the potential to be effectively useless in a single fight is a big deal when you consider its up against almost certain healing in a fight or consistant improved map mobility.