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Patch 5.7: Thoughts?

kcStranger··1 votes·976 views

So, I'm just curious how people feel about patch 5.7 (I had a link here but it's not working). I won't bore you with my detailed thoughts on everything (since you don't know who I am and likely don't care), but here's the brief rundown (hey it's my post):

Changes I like: Bard, Darius, Evelynn, Fizz, Garen, Shen, Tristana (so yeah, I'm basically on board with all the buffs), changes to Cinderhulk and Gromp smite buff Changes I think are probably OK: Blitzcrank, Hecarim, Maokai Changes I don't like: Nidalee, Rek'Sai "Meh": Kassadin (he needs something more impactful than this; 4/3/2 cooldown on ult anyone?)

A little extra on the ones I don't like. For Nidalee, her numbers aren't actually that dominating; I think the real problem is just that she's rage-inducing for a lot of people. She really needs a mini-rework on some combination of Javelin Toss and Primal Surge (heal) to give her a healthier playstyle, not a random base stat nerf like this (which actually incentivizes her to be even more disengage/poke-oriented). I feel like she's just getting the Yasuo treatment: they're just making her a little generically worse so that she doesn't induce quite so many rage quits. As far as Rek'Sai goes, by the numbers she's almost perfectly balanced right now, and although I haven't played her I have to think the change is a significant nerf. Her damage ratios aren't all that high across the board (she normally builds tanky), and although it only looks like the ratio has been reduced from 30% to 20%, Queen's Wrath is a three-part move so it's really more like 90% to 60%. I think she's a really cool and fun champion, and I'm afraid this change may make her rather mediocre. Maybe I'm wrong, though.

Enough about my thoughts. I'm curious what y'all think.

16 Comments

Voluug132 votes

Bard buffs? Awesome! Nidalee Nerfs? Good, but misdirected. Doesnt solve the problem at hand AKA Jungledalee Quinn bugfixes? Good! Fizz? Still cancer, the problem is Playful/Trickster. Kass? Good! The others are good too because they are small, but Riot should stop dancing around gutting Zed like it should have been done months ago. They dont really care about other champions but Zed and Lee Sin are special chosen ones that cant be touched? Blahg.

Change to Cinderhulk is not bad. But Gromp feels overnerfed, 7.5% should have been a better number, and if needed, bring it down to 5%. But a 50% reduction damage from one go is extreme.}

Overall I dont like the lack of Zed and Lee Sin changes, the lack of Riven's crazy animation cancel removal, and Fizz changes. Great now Fizz AP is back. Guess AD Fizz was worse.

kcStranger1 votes

Have you seen Lee Sin's win rate recently? It's like 46% (including in Diamond). I understand he's a high-skillcap champion and all, but I don't think we need to be nerfing champions that are already so underpowered by the numbers.

Zed also underperforms statistically and I'm far from convinced that he needs a nerf, but at least I understand the argument there. Nerfing Lee Sin, though, would just be the final "f--- you" to all the people who devoted the hours to learning him.

DisasterSola2 votes

{quoted}

Have you seen Lee Sin's win rate recently? It's like 46% (including in Diamond). I understand he's a high-skillcap champion and all, but I don't think we need to be nerfing champions that are already so underpowered by the numbers.

Zed also underperforms statistically and I'm far from convinced that he needs a nerf, but at least I understand the argument there. Nerfing Lee Sin, though, would just be the final "f--- you" to all the people who devoted the hours to learning him.

... Lee isnt hard to learn or master. I played lee for a week and went into ranked as "lee-fill". I played every position, including support, at least twice with positive KDAs and the most damage taken from champions half the time.

Im not even good; Hyper mobility and insane base damage is just that strong.

Voluug131 votes

This.

Lee Sin has been sold as some kind of godlike with ridiculous skill requerimients. That may have been true 4 years ago when Udyr was a high-skill champion too. Not anymore.

Which is far from the truth, as Lee Sin has every single tool to achieve his objetives. Lee is never defeated, he just loses himself. Which means champions like Zed and Lee Sin have low counterplay and more ''abuse their mistakes''.

kcStranger1 votes

I will never understand you people. His win rate is 46%. In Diamond. (Actually I'm rounding up even to call it 46%.) The only champs with a worse rate are Zilean, Evelynn, Kha'Zix, Elise, Kassadin, and Bard. And if he's not a skill-intensive champion, that just makes the 46% number even more damning. I'm sure his popularity drives the number down a bit, but...in what world is such a champion OP.

TL;DR: Stop whining and get better.

DisasterSola1 votes

{quoted}

This.

Lee Sin has been sold as some kind of godlike with ridiculous skill requerimients. That may have been true 4 years ago when Udyr was a high-skill champion too. Not anymore.

Which is far from the truth, as Lee Sin has every single tool to achieve his objetives. Lee is never defeated, he just loses himself. Which means champions like Zed and Lee Sin have low counterplay and more ''abuse their mistakes''.

Exactly.

Some most people never realize - or even think about - is what mobility DOES to a champion. Mobility, as we know it (flash/dash) isnt some kind of engage tool. It has that capacity, yes, but at its core Flash/dash mobility skills are entirely used to make up for player mistakes or errors. Compare it to older champions who had "mobility" - MS boosts. MS boosts are entirely skill reliant (unless youre blitz with a 60% MS boost) because you either commit to the fight or avoid the fight entirely. You cant enter the fight, lose, and back out.

Its like in MMOs where the healer is used to cover for your mistakes; getting hit by the year long telegraphed attack, walking into the lava, pulling aggro, etc.

usul12021 votes

QUINN BUFFSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!

that is all.

Arcade Andrew1 votes

BARD BUFFS! NOW PEOPLE WONT THINK IM TROLLING WHEN I PLAY HIM

DrathTurtle3141 votes

Until you can't hit people indiscriminately with his ult, people will always think you're trolling...

Arcade Andrew1 votes

the chimes spawn faster MORE POKE

Passionlip1 votes

Bard MORE ROAMING, MORE ROAMING Twitch BARD, HELP ME Bard JUST ANOTHER CHIME Twitch An ally has been slain Caitlyn Bard REPORT TWITCH FOR FEEDING Twitch F*******

shalec1 votes

The Rek'Sai change isn't really significant at all. At level 1, with about 20 AD from Runes and Masteries, it's a loss of 6 damage. With the Warrior Enchantment, a Trinity Force and about 30 AD from Masteries, so 100 AD, she loses 30 damage overall. It's pretty small. This is also my normal build on her (sometimes I'll skip the Trinity Force if I need to be tankier, so that's even less damage lost). As far as the rest of the changes go, they were alright. I don't think much will change in the meta, but it's a step in the right direction and I like that Riot is actually buffing weaker champions to be more viable.

kcStranger2 votes

OK, maybe I'm overreacting.

Davy Crockett1 votes

I love the Bard buffs. However... I'm still waiting for Veigar's compensation. Veigar

kcStranger1 votes

Well, the last rounds of changes to Veigar actually did make a difference. Check out his win rates; they're distinctly out of the terrible zone. Could probably still use a little bit more, though.

Davy Crockett1 votes

The little more is what needs to happen. Veigar's kit isn't really that complete yet. He needs a bit more work before he is at a satisfactory level.

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