Meddler does jinx really need a buff?

adidas··41 votes·3,422 views

IMO once she gets 4 items, its practically like you need 2 people to kill her.

The reason bloodthirster is more substantial on jinx rather than other adcs is because her minigun ramp up attack speed gives her around 2.0+ attack speed with the build she normally goes for.

An ADC is hitting over 2 times a second is going to lifesteal so much that any form of sustain damage is practically neutralized and unnoticed. The only way to kill jinx late game is by burst damage...

Jinx then eventually outranges caitlyn at around lvl 10 by having 700 range on her Q rockets with AOE splash damage that do not share damage. In other words her rockets aoe damage do the same to everyone hit, not 20% like hurricane.

Of course this isnt in the first 15 minutes of the game but thats the thing, Champions like MissFortune Lucian DO somewhat fall off, Great laning phase but outside of lane they kinda fall.

For example MFs Q bounce does insane damage, but outside of lane its not like theres random 1 hp minions to Q off. And bouncing off a champion is an extremely rare occurrence but it does happen.

Lucians laning phase is great but outside of lane he just falls off in terms of actually putting his damage without risking himself.

So i dont see a reason for jinx to have a great level 6 and beyond. Especially when shes already sporting a high 52-53% win rate with a high popularity rate.

I just dont see why she needs to be buffed at all.

36 Comments

Matezoide10 votes

Jinx has an amazing win-rate for her play-rate already. Out of every non-Ashe/Jihn/Sivir ADC (ie, the top tiers and the ult bot that is always popular), Jinx is probably the strongest right now (Maybe second behind Caitlyn).

DeathBot6662 votes

So she barely makes top 5.

Just saying.

Matezoide2 votes

Top 5 out of 18 (17 if you ignore Urgot), with the ones above her getting nerfs soon, while the other is literally never going to be unviable because of ult.

A lot of ADCs, at this moment, need more help than her, even if just a marginally so.

MEMEME6701 votes

And this means riot shouldn't buff jinx why exactly?

In my ranked games, Jinx is basically as unviable as it gets. And sure, so are many other champions, but that doesn't mean she shouldn't get appropriate buffs.

Matezoide2 votes

Because, for solo que, Jinx is already strong. If they arent careful with her buff, we might go back to the days Jinx was the single most picked champion in the game with a ~55% win. Out of every adc that isnt in the meta right now, Jinx is one of the strongest, thus buffing someone else may make more sense.

Of course, i am talking about ranked/normals. Jinx sure could use help for LCS, but the problems this could bring for regular players is still real, especially if she is the only ADC to get a buff.

Your personal experiences do not reflect the actual evidence, even though i do not question Jinx may have been mediocre for you.

Requiemsfire7 votes

The only reason Jinx isn't picked for the LCS is that she provides no utility for the team unlike other ADCs. In non-competitive compositions Jinx is in no way that much weaker than other ADCs. Buffing JInx to become a competitive pick would not lead to variety but rather Jinx would become a pick or ban.

JavelinJoe6 votes

IMO once she gets 4 items

This is exactly why. She has no laning kill threat in a normal 2v2 before she has 2 items at least, or gets a good gank. While other main adc's have kill potential at level 2 with just item 1055 item 2009. She ends up getting put so far behind by most match-ups that it is hard to get back into the game. Since she is a very easy target (no escapes and quite slow without her passive), landing poke/cc on her is not too difficult, usually ending up forcing a back pre-6.

adidas6 votes

{quoted}

This is exactly why. She has no laning kill threat in a normal 2v2 before she has 2 items at least, or gets a good gank. While other main adc's have kill potential at level 2 with just item 1055 item 2009. She ends up getting put so far behind by most match-ups that it is hard to get back into the game. Since she is a very easy target (no escapes and quite slow without her passive), landing poke/cc on her is not too difficult, usually ending up forcing a back pre-6.

No kill threat? Did you not hear what i said about the more than double attack speed bonus from minigun + her % missing health Ult? She has kill threat. SHes a fuckin hyper carry shes not suppsoed to kill you in lane anyway

Warlord Zudane4 votes

No LANING kill threat, did you not read what was written? Seriously, the whole discussion is that Jinx is underpowered in early phases and takes time to build up to being overpowered. If you let Jinx get that far then you deserve to be demolished. She is strong in late game, that's where she builds up, so you need to stop her in the early game when it's easier to.

adidas6 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Zudane,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9j6wc5if,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2016-08-22T04:53:03.173+0000)

No LANING kill threat, did you not read what was written? Seriously, the whole discussion is that Jinx is underpowered in early phases and takes time to build up to being overpowered. If you let Jinx get that far then you deserve to be demolished. She is strong in late game, that's where she builds up, so you need to stop her in the early game when it's easier to.

thats the fucking point. so if we buff her ult then thatll give her more kill threat which we dont need.

No

its a no

DeathBot6661 votes

One second I speak internet troll.

Translation:

{quoted}

This is exactly why. She has no laning kill threat in a normal 2v2 before she has 2 items at least, or gets a good gank. While other main adc's have kill potential at level 2 with just item 1055 item 2009. She ends up getting put so far behind by most match-ups that it is hard to get back into the game. Since she is a very easy target (no escapes and quite slow without her passive), landing poke/cc on her is not too difficult, usually ending up forcing a back pre-6.

Now becomes

{quoted}

If an champion requires you to need 4 items for you to consider them strong, then they need a buff to their early game to deal with the popular strong ADC's with a good early game that only need 2 items to become OP. For example, why would you take Jinx when Ashe also has a global ultimate, one with a stun and similar damage, has long range without draining mana, doesn't have to sacrifice range for a faster attack spped, a slow with every auto rather than just on a zap. Also, ashe becomes strong with just 2-3 items, while as you said jinx needs 4.

Or something to that point, It's a hard to learn language.

Matezoide8 votes

Interestingly, her win-rate actually peaks at 0-20 minute long games (56%), eventually dropping to 50.

But regardless, whats wrong with champions qith strong scaling being weak laners? Jinx was complete cancer when she was a lane bully that would also destroy your turret if you dared to back once, and even then, she is hardly that weak early, compared to the likes of Twitch and Vayne.

What kills her early kill pressure is lack of mobility, but she is more than capable of defending herself early game.

JavelinJoe1 votes

The current meta says otherwise. Her Q is unreliable n ts rocket form until item 3085 and her only form of cc in fights is her E, which has to be walked over after an annoyingly long delay. Since her W s first target hit, it is unreliable for being a good form of poke unlike say Ashe's W which has a wide spread to cover that shared weakness. Also, with hard CC being so popular in every role now (seriously, it is all about which team has more CC will usually win, save pro level and very high elo) getting that damage output from her Q is rather tricky because of her no escape kit.

OneMustFall5 votes

Yeah the buffs to Jinx and Riven 's ults make no sense to me. They already have good winrate and play rates. The damage on their ults is already strong enough to finish three people off at 1/4 health. So let's make it a 1/3?

CeexSett1 votes

Those are buffs directed at Worlds. The crowd loves to see cross-map Jinx rockets finishing someone or even stealing baron/drake.

The Riven buffs are jsut to get her to be played in LCS (which she already is). The reason is that it's more amusing to watch a Riven than a Trundle for example.

The Yetii Rider4 votes

The reason Jinx is getting buffed is that her primary niche is quickly taking down turrets (and because she was so good at that, her Death Rocket has been nerfed in the past)

Now that there's so much more damage to turrets in the game (Mountain Drake, red buff, Trinity Force got buffed) Jinx needs some of her team fighting power back to be relevant again.

The One Eye King1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Yetii Rider,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9j6wc5if,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2016-08-22T15:59:20.280+0000)

The reason Jinx is getting buffed is that her primary niche is quickly taking down turrets (and because she was so good at that, her Death Rocket has been nerfed in the past)

Now that there's so much more damage to turrets in the game (Mountain Drake, red buff, Trinity Force got buffed) Jinx needs some of her team fighting power back to be relevant again.

This ^

Depárt3 votes

Every ADC that is not Sivir, Ashe or Jhin needs a buff.

They are all crowded out by the utility ADC meta, which will continue to hold strong even after 6.17.

I may also mention that this is a small buff compared to the likes of Vayne and Draven, Adding more of a bonus AD ratio to her ult helps her much more in the mid-late game than any other time, Which she needs because she is struggling the longer the game goes, for such a reliable lategame hyper carry she doesn't seem to be reliable or hypercarrying lategame very much.

Handy Sandy 4 votes

{quoted}

Every ADC that is not Sivir, Ashe or Jhin needs a buff.

They are all crowded out by the utility ADC meta, which will continue to hold strong even after 6.17.

or ashe and jhin just need a nerf

Depárt1 votes

They're getting nerfs, but they're still going to run bottom lane.

I hate my ADC3 votes

That's the thing with champions like Jinx or Vayne. They feel weak because they have to rely on someone else to get to the stage where they can carry. You need a good support to protect you if you play Jinx. Which requires a lot more effort from both the support and Jinx in order to get there. But if you get through the harder early game, you will have an easy late game.

I personally think she's more than fine. But hey... I think they may be running out of ideas on how to make the game more snowball so they are changing the less snowbally champions.

Bouncemaster Zac2 votes

Jinx is very strong at pretty much every point in the game in terms of raw damage output and kill threat due to the unreasonable amount of free stats she gets from her Q in either mode. Her big weakness as has been stated is lack of mobility and utility, and even then she still has some of both of those things. She's more in need of dialing back than buffing up.

Kishiyami2 votes

As a Jinx main, I personally don't want these buffs. Don't get me wrong, a buff to your favorite champion is always good. My problem with this buffs is that after a while they might nerf her in some other way because of the R buffs. I'd rather keep Jinx the way she is now rather than dealing with a possible extremely weak Jinx in the future.

I think there are other champs out there who deserves these buff that Jinx. That's just my opinion. [slayer-jinx-catface]

Treune811 votes

+1.She doesn't need but classic things.Worlds is coming.Jinx and her ult is important plays (true ults), moves, penta plays.

Iźuku Midoriya1 votes

I feel that lucian doesnt exactly fall off for risking himself because of his e. At max rank, I believe it costs no mana and with 40% cdr its on a 8 to 9 second cooldown by itself. Now you add the passive it has from his passive, Lightslinger. E auto attack, Q auto attack, W auto attack and boom its already on a 2 second cooldown. It is extremely hard to catch this guy especially with and infinite mana pool from essence.

As for jinx, yes I feel that jinx with her items is abit overpowered however assassins are very strong right now in the meta. If she doesnt have her summoners to flash and/or heal from the shaco or akali and then follow up into e and w, shes dead. That is why riot nerfed her ult point blank. Though they should reduce the damage she deals with hurricane and Q rockets because she pushes very fast. Overall, I wouldnt say she needs a nerf but perhaps a change. The fact she can E and W and then unload autos into your face with a minigun is kind of broken.item 3085 item 3094 item 3031 item 3072

crippler381 votes

yes buff her so I can do more jinx shaco lanes.

ALL THE CRAZIES IN THE BOT LANE!

(it also helps that their traps synergize and and so does her long range engage with shaco's q)

Shaco support +

Jhin or Jinx is very nice, trust.

EDIT: for those who don't know why jhin is on here, see it's the crazy psycho murderer bottom lane ya know?

LatetotheRace1 votes

She's a lategame ADC that carries super hard once she gets there. She's effectively another twitch, and they're both fine doing what they do rn. Buffing her is going to be a huge mistake. If she's struggling, it's likely because dashy over ( Lucian ) there is too strong.

Maiziea1 votes

All they have to do to bring down Lucian (and jhin) is nerf ghostblade, no need to buff the rest. Though personally I like jinx so I don't mind this buff aslong as it doesn't make her pick ban/mirror matchup in norms every game.

LatetotheRace1 votes

Oh I know 100% that they need to nerf ghostblade, but for some reason they refuse to do so. That leaves us with nerfing the champion as pretty much the only option then.

Solari Fortune1 votes

I feel they might be buffing her to kinda break up the utility adc meta going on in competitive atm, Patch 6.17 and 6.18 are more focused upon the pro scene for worlds, that is why so many champs got changes. This way Worlds is not going to be Jhin Ashe and Sivir every game like how last year was Darius and Fiora every game

Leonerdo1 votes

I imagine Riot is trying to make her ult feel more useful, especially late-game, since it's really unreliable. Most of the time it just gets blocked by a tank and takes 5% of their hp. Or it misses completely. When it does hit that 25% hp carry, it really should kill them.

I also imagine Riot will nerf her in some generic way to compensate. Ya'know like -3 AD. Something that doesn't need to be tested on PBE.

The One Eye King1 votes

Yes she does. want me to explain?

kirbyzama1 votes

Jinx peak win rates are early because she snowballs. She does have a strong late game but that's just in raw damage output. She doesn't become much harder to kill unless she gets a GA so late game assassin/mages are still walking dead zones. She is more like katarina then nasus. She snowballs and requires a team effort to control. I remember watching imaqtpie and he was joking about how "good"/s jinx is saying things like "There is no way I'll lose every trade in lane" and "They aren't going to four man turret dive me cause I can do nothing about it". Another issue with jinx is her niche as an aoe adc is taken by sivir. Her niche as a global adc is taken by ashe. And her turret taking is matched by a lot of champs now even if she is the best its not by much.

The strength of jinx is she has all that you need in an adc and she needs a team to stop her making her a great solo/dynamicQ champ as you don't have to compromise anything but consistency, which your team can help make up for. As for the buffs? It probably won't mean too much honestly. I doubt she'll pass any meta adcs cause in competitive most teams can shut her down. However for the rest of use she'll get a stronger a bit earlier.

CookyPrince1 votes

MissFortune Q's are pretty good in team fights especially since her q still does more damage on the second bounce but she's only good in certain situations where you got a team combo to setup her ult, otherwise Twitch KogMaw Jinx outperform her in nearly every situation due to their disgusting dmg with runaans and their kits

xxxDogmanxxx1 votes

As a Xin Zhao and Taliyah Main, Jinx is never a problem for me.

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