"We're giving compensation buffs to Duskblade-dependent champions."

ChickenWrap·Feb 26, 2018·5 votes·767 views

Meanwhile, Shaco, who is entirely Duskblade-dependent, is looking at getting further nerfs.

https://puu.sh/zwhC9/f33056ee61.png

Hmm, that's kind of odd, isn't it?

33 Comments

LyingOnLineFeb 26, 20187 votes

“We’re spamming Shaco topics until the mods tell us to shut up”

Well I’m no mod, but could you shut up? You’ve already got a topic you posted less than 2 hours ago.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20182 votes

I'm no balance team member, but until they recognize that they're being stupid, we'll be out in force demanding that Riot actually talk to us before deleting our champion from the game again.

LyingOnLineFeb 26, 20181 votes

{quoted}

t until they recognize that they're being stupid,

demanding that Riot actually talk to us

Mmm, yeah, that sure sounds like something that’s going to be productive. I’m sure it’s Riot that’s being stupid, and not you.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20182 votes

I'm sure Riot is being stupid, and maybe having every Shaco player up in arms about it is something they should PAY ATTENTION TO?

Besides, this warranted its own thread.

LyingOnLineFeb 26, 20182 votes

It really, really didn’t.

And I’m quite certain that every Shaco player is a whiny crybaby. On account of all the evidence that they’re providing me.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20182 votes

You're ignoring every counter-point we give you and maybe if every Shaco player is upset that their champion is going to be unplayable, you should actually listen to them instead of trying to act smart on a smurf and tell us we're wrong.

LyingOnLineFeb 26, 20182 votes

I’m telling you that you’re arguing the wrong thing in the wrong way.

You feel that the Duskblade nerf will disproportionately affect Shaco negatively, even to the extent of making his current strength into complete weakness?

Then ask them to redesign him. Talk about where strength could and should be shifted or added, and why Duskblade’s current state is crippling Shaco by the fact of his overreliance on it.

Stop spamming the boards with whining and insults, and try to actually reach out to Riot constructively.

Maybe then you’ll actually be worth listening to.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20182 votes

So Quinn has a 54% winrate. Higher than Shaco's. Duskblade is being nerfed, but Quinn is getting compensation buffs while Shaco is not. What do you think about this information?

LyingOnLineFeb 26, 20181 votes

I think you read the topic incorrectly. And I think that Quinn is cancer that needs nerfing in the first place.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20181 votes

I already said that adding a flat damage buff to his Q would fix the Duskblade problem while still leaving him weaker than before but not dumpster-fire tier. You think I'm spamming the boards with whining and insults, but each serious thread I've made touches on all the serious issues and what Riot should be looking at.These recent threads (sans this one) are probably more worth reading and looking into than anything posted on this particular board in months. I don't mean to be rude, but generally speaking, most of this is just circlejerking fotm garbage. I'm definitely more worth listening to than most of the drivel on here.

JorenciceFeb 26, 20184 votes

No.

Shacos playstyles are as healthy as old poppys.

Hes been shelved waiting for a rework.

Could you not tell?

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20182 votes

So is Nid's, Rengar's, Zed's, Talon's, Kha'Zix's, Lux's, Annie's, Brand's...

Oh wait it looks like most champions in this game have toxc playstyles, but you can play around it just like you can play around shaco's!

Weird.

LauchmelderFeb 26, 20181 votes

I can also play around Yasuo's kit, doesn't make him any less obnoxious and anti-fun to play against. The same applies to Shaco.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20182 votes

So howcome Yasuo doesn't get kneecapped? You're literally agreeing with my statement while trying to disagree. There are tons of toxic champions in the game, and you play around them. Just because a champion is annoying doesn't mean they deserve to be removed.

LauchmelderFeb 26, 20181 votes

I don't agree with you, even if you try to twist it that way in your mind.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20181 votes

You literally said "I can play around yasuo but he's still frustrating."

What I said was "There are lots of annoying champions but they're easy to be played around, just like Shaco."

So how is that not you agreeing with me? Lol.

LauchmelderFeb 26, 20181 votes

First of all half of the champions you listed don't even have a toxic kit to play against. Zed for example is literally the only assassin done right.

Yasuo doesn’t get kneecapped because he doesn't need it. He already is semi bad.

Shaco on the other hand is in no world outside of the Shaco bubble bad.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20181 votes

Yeah dude I love trying to fight Zed and going from 1/4 health to dead with one auto-attack. I love trying to kill him and having him press R, avoid everything, press E, and then vanish away from me while I die with no way to stop it from happening.

Yasuo is NOT semi-bad. What????

Shaco is bad because people like you keep crying for nerfs and then continue refusing to play around the easy-to-play-around mechanics of Shaco. He does no damage and you still think he's too good. Like, that's meme-worthy in and of itself.

LauchmelderFeb 26, 20181 votes

Like I said, you're living in a bubble.

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20181 votes

You're... Something else, dude.

ImGodlyatYasuoFeb 26, 20181 votes

Listen what makes shaco op is how high his win rate is plus his play rate plus his utility plus his stealth. Playing around a good shaco is nearly impossible through all elos playing around a good yasuo is nearly impossible in bronze 5 -3 lp...........................................

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20181 votes

>53% win rate because of who is meta right now in the jungle. OK. >2% play rate. How does this make him OP? >All of his utility means that he does no damage and he scales with only items >Stealth is included as secondary to utility?

Playing around a good Shaco is easy. Ward propery, use Oracle's properly, watch for smoke, anticipate. It's not too complex.

JorenciceFeb 26, 20181 votes

I have no problem with any of those champions (really dont have a problem with shacos either but im a silver scrub no one can play shaco at my level) but that doesnt change the fact that having 0 counter play (besides a weak jungle) and being able to 1 shot from true invis isnt fair and can lead to an extremely frustrating laning phase as the people on the map basically have to play super safe and give up farm because a shaco MIGHT be nearby.

MorganFreemanBotFeb 26, 20183 votes

{quoted}

So is Nid's, Rengar's, Zed's, Talon's, Kha'Zix's, Lux's, Annie's, Brand's...

Oh wait it looks like most champions in this game have toxc playstyles, but you can play around it just like you can play around shaco's!

Weird.

Er, what the actual fuck are you talking about?

Zed can sometimes be too powerful, but he's one of the healthiest champions in the game design wise. His mobility is telegraphed and predictable, his ability to combo is reliant on landing multiple skills from different directions, and he literally wrote the book on "health assassination patterns" with his ulti having a 3 second delay.

Kha'zix is also, generally, pretty healthy as an assassin. He has at times been too strong, but similar to Zed he's healthly from a design perspective. If he catches squishies alone (I.E. when they're out of position / wandering around without wards) he murders them; otherwise he is SIGNIFICANTLY less dangerous.

Nid's a squishy champion who has to dive into melee, putting her escape on cooldown, in order to kill. She used to be unhealthy AF, and while she can be SO GOD DAMN ANNOYING, she is not currently unhealthy.

Brand is another champion who relies on enemy positioning. He has two skill shots, and an ultimate which can wreak havoc in a team fight but is far from a point-and-click delete / I win button.

Annie is kind of BS, but she's short range. You have an argument for her. Rengar sort of the same; he 'warns' you, but he's different from other assassins in that the warning is that he's coming in, once he's actually on you it's entirely over. Talon I don't have a strong opinion on because I never see, but he's more mobility over function, isn't he?

Lux is also frustrating, but 100% skillshot based, extremely vulnerable (when caught), and not super bursty when unfed.

Just because you have trouble playing against a champion, or do not like playing agaimst them, does not make them toxic. Toxic designs are those which discourage interaction and leave you absolutely no responses: Champions who delete you instantly (old LB, old Rengar, most old assassins in general), have a strong combination of mobility / hard CC / unavoidable burst (Irelia, pre-rework Xin, Olaf before he got Olaf'd), or offer you no responses to their play patterns other than "all in and hope you win" (old Morde, old Xin, old Yorrick).

ChickenWrapFeb 26, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Er, what the actual fuck are you talking about?

Zed can sometimes be too powerful, but he's one of the healthiest champions in the game design wise. His mobility is telegraphed and predictable, his ability to combo is reliant on landing multiple skills from different directions, and he literally wrote the book on "health assassination patterns" with his ulti having a 3 second delay.

Avoiding all damage is toxic. One-shotting someone is toxic. Insta-death if you have under 1/4th HP is toxic.

Kha'zix is also, generally, pretty healthy as an assassin. He has at times been too strong, but similar to Zed he's healthly from a design perspective. If he catches squishies alone (I.E. when they're out of position / wandering around without wards) he murders them; otherwise he is SIGNIFICANTLY less dangerous.

Moving through entire jungle unseen is toxic. E+Q one-shot combo is toxic. E reset is toxic.

Nid's a squishy champion who has to dive into melee, putting her escape on cooldown, in order to kill. She used to be unhealthy AF, and while she can be SO GOD DAMN ANNOYING, she is not currently unhealthy.

Spears are toxic. Cougar W+Q one-shots are toxic.

Brand is another champion who relies on enemy positioning. He has two skill shots, and an ultimate which can wreak havoc in a team fight but is far from a point-and-click delete / I win button.

Hi I'm Brand I pressed EQ and now you're dead. My ult smashes everyone and I have tons of % hp damage for no reason. I'm toxic.

Annie is kind of BS, but she's short range. You have an argument for her. Rengar sort of the same; he 'warns' you, but he's different from other assassins in that the warning is that he's coming in, once he's actually on you it's entirely over. Talon I don't have a strong opinion on because I never see, but he's more mobility over function, isn't he?

Protobelt/Flash+Tibbers W. Aced your whole team. I'm toxic.

Lux is also frustrating, but 100% skillshot based, extremely vulnerable (when caught), and not super bursty when unfed.

Implying it's easy to dodge her half health 30 second CD ultimate. She doesn't get caight, she has a snare that allows her to 100-0 you.

Just because you have trouble playing against a champion, or do not like playing agaimst them, does not make them toxic. Toxic designs are those which discourage interaction and leave you absolutely no responses: Champions who delete you instantly (old LB, old Rengar, most old assassins in general), have a strong combination of mobility / hard CC / unavoidable burst (Irelia, pre-rework Xin, Olaf before he got Olaf'd), or offer you no responses to their play patterns other than "all in and hope you win" (old Morde, old Xin, old Yorrick).

I don't have trouble playing agaisnt champions. I peaked D1 last season. I just understand that there are toxic elements to every champion's kit so complaining about one or two small things that Shaco does that there is ample counterplay to makes you look stupid.

MorganFreemanBotFeb 27, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Avoiding all damage is toxic. One-shotting someone is toxic. Insta-death if you have under 1/4th HP is toxic.

Moving through entire jungle unseen is toxic. E+Q one-shot combo is toxic. E reset is toxic.

Spears are toxic. Cougar W+Q one-shots are toxic.

Hi I'm Brand I pressed EQ and now you're dead. My ult smashes everyone and I have tons of % hp damage for no reason. I'm toxic.

Protobelt/Flash+Tibbers W. Aced your whole team. I'm toxic.

Implying it's easy to dodge her half health 30 second CD ultimate. She doesn't get caight, she has a snare that allows her to 100-0 you.

I don't have trouble playing agaisnt champions. I peaked D1 last season. I just understand that there are toxic elements to every champion's kit so complaining about one or two small things that Shaco does that there is ample counterplay to makes you look stupid.

Wow. I don't even know where to begin.

Suffice it to say you're using "toxic" as short hand for "capable of punishing my recklessness".

Saying that being able to burst someone from 25% is toxic, what the actual fuck. Literally any non support champ can do that.

ChickenWrapFeb 27, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Wow. I don't even know where to begin.

Suffice it to say you're using "toxic" as short hand for "capable of punishing my recklessness".

Saying that being able to burst someone from 25% is toxic, what the actual fuck. Literally any non support champ can do that.

Anything that can cause distress to a player where they have no real agency to fight back is toxic, based on what people choose to complain about with Shaco. Anything that you can take steps to avoid but is hard to deal with regardless, so?

MorganFreemanBotFeb 28, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Anything that can cause distress to a player where they have no real agency to fight back is toxic, based on what people choose to complain about with Shaco. Anything that you can take steps to avoid but is hard to deal with regardless, so?

Toxicity is the removal of interaction from the game.

As an example, Pantheon is toxic because you cannot play around him. "Are you within x range? Eat spear to the face. Are you within X-Y range? Eat stun and burst". He has no skill shots, his cooldowns are short, and the only way to 'play around' his kit is to not be within range of it. This is not to say that point-and-click is innately toxic, but Pantheon's combination of unavoidable ranged poke, combined with point-and-click hard CC for all inning, is a toxic combination. Alternatively, support fiddle was toxic back in S3 (I think?) because he had 3 seconds of hard CC on a long range point-and-click ability; which meant it couldn't be out played.

An important element hear is that a lot of what you're arguing is.. Just being a moron. If you're caught at 25% hp, dying instantly is not toxic. That's being out of position / where you shouldn't be with low hp, which shifts the burden onto you because you made the choice to be there with low hp.

That's like saying that the ability to die is toxic, or that having to actually ward is toxic. That's something where the burden is on you to make a choice, and you simply made the wrong one.

ChickenWrapFeb 28, 20181 votes

By your own definition, Shaco isn't toxic.

Poofs of smoke, the existence of oracle's, tons of shield and healing items, there's counterplay to Shaco, you're just too lazy to utilize it. You want the game to be easy for you because thinking about Shaco is difficult and that doesn't make Shaco toxic, that makes you lazy.

Sayonara ShabiFeb 28, 20182 votes

shut up crybaby no one likes that champ just accept it

ChickenWrapFeb 28, 20181 votes

it must suck to be so bad at League of Legends and multi-tasking in strategy games that you think Shaco is too strong.

Plenty of players like the champ, but it's not my fault you just can't play the game :thinking:

MorganFreemanBotFeb 28, 20181 votes

{quoted}

it must suck to be so bad at League of Legends and multi-tasking in strategy games that you think Shaco is too strong.

Plenty of players like the champ, but it's not my fault you just can't play the game :thinking:

Can you find where I said that Shaco was toxic?

What's that, I didn't? Oh yeah, that's right.

I only piped up to say that your definition of toxic is absolutely insane. I literally didn't say jack shit about Shaco; you should trade in that ;thinking; emote for :reading:, because you're clearly incapable.

ChickenWrapFeb 28, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Can you find where I said that Shaco was toxic?

What's that, I didn't? Oh yeah, that's right.

I only piped up to say that your definition of toxic is absolutely insane. I literally didn't say jack shit about Shaco; you should trade in that ;thinking; emote for :reading:, because you're clearly incapable.

Did you just log on to a second Gold 5 account to tell me off on a post that has nothing to do with what you're ranting about? Wait -- Did you use two accounts to say two separate things about how dumb you think I am?

Oh man you're something else.

Maybe you need to get to learning how to read, friend :^)