Fiora Buffs

MunchCrunchLunch·Jun 30, 2016·13 votes·2,824 views

Fiora Lunge (Q) bonus AD ratio now .95/1/1.05/1.1/1.15 from .55/.70./.85/1/1.15

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38 Comments

MoarCowbell98Jun 30, 20164 votes

This is bonus ad and only affects her early ish game since you max Q first anyway. Max rank Q is same ratio.

Fiora honestly needs it. She scales super well, but can't impact in the early game against most matchups right now at all. Her Q does essentially no dmg without a vital early and even with a vital early game it's pretty weak.

This will help her have some chance vs more brutal matchups like Darius and illaoi while not buffing her beast late game.

This also won't make her early game OP and make pick or ban again. She honestly is in a bad spot right now against competent players because of her early game. This change isn't going to break her

MunchCrunchLunchJun 30, 20163 votes

{quoted}

This is bonus ad and only affects her early ish game since you max Q first anyway. Max rank Q is same ratio.

Fiora honestly needs it. She scales super well, but can't impact in the early game against most matchups right now at all. Her Q does essentially no dmg without a vital early and even with a vital early game it's pretty weak.

This will help her have some chance vs more brutal matchups like Darius and illaoi while not buffing her beast late game.

This also won't make her early game OP and make pick or ban again. She honestly is in a bad spot right now against competent players because of her early game. This change isn't going to break her

lmao. fiora is one of the best early level champions in the game.

MoarCowbell98Jun 30, 20163 votes

{quoted}

lmao. fiora is one of the best early level champions in the game.

Rofl you are joking right? With her 6 second cd Q that does less dmg than an auto attack and probably about as much if you hit a vital. With a 24 second cool down riposte and over 10 second cool down slight auto attack dmg modifier?

She's awful early game. There are certain matchups you can dance around and hit vitals for days but most of the time you cannot do that as everyone out trades you.

Fiora sucks early after her nerfs. She used to be pretty good but she was nerfed reaaaallly hard

RalanrJun 30, 20164 votes

Because her early was too strong for the monster that her late game was.

Critmaster GarenJun 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Because her early was too strong for the monster that her late game was.

only that when shes played as a melee adc and not a beefy bruiser, her lategame was actually not that good since the nerf to her ult healing. she has overall little effect in teamfights without massive support since she blows up rather fast.

probably the reason people started building bruiser items on her in the first place. her ult wasnt reliable anymore, she died quickly and her ad build was ineffective. might aswell build tanky and deal a lot less but consistent damage, than build adc and blow up before you can contribute anything.

MoarCowbell98Jul 1, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Because her early was too strong for the monster that her late game was.

it was indeed too strong originally. but nerfing the base dmg on her passive was pretty big as wel as the riposte cooldown is huge. she is pretty weak early right now. not just pretty weak but TOO weak. you can buff a weak champion while still leaving them vulnerable in the early game. right now fiora really has little options in the early game. she just has to farm up which isn't good.

even weak early game champs like Jinx Vayne, Jax can all do things in the early levels. There's a reason when trinity got buffed you see the comeback of carry tops and fiora is nowhere to be seen in solo queue. she is too weak.

MelledoneusJul 1, 20161 votes

You're overplaying monsters here.

She redefined "late game carry."

Over InnsmouthJul 1, 20162 votes

On the one hand, I acknowledge she's been a bit weak lately so this isnt entirely unreasonable.

On the other hand, Fiora as a Champion feels almost entirely unreasonable to deal with, what with her stickiness, slipperiness and damage potential.

I was going to make a bunch of comparisons to Vlad and his early game being a sack of elephant potato shit as well, but then I considered how you mentioned Darius and Illaoi, and how Fiora's gotta deal with them in (almost) melee range.

I think you're pretty justified in the buff, and your point is made very nicely.

MunchCrunchLunchJul 1, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tides of Blood,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9AUxJjs1,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2016-07-01T00:49:16.582+0000)

On the one hand, I acknowledge she's been a bit weak lately so this isnt entirely unreasonable.

On the other hand, Fiora as a Champion feels almost entirely unreasonable to deal with, what with her stickiness, slipperiness and damage potential.

:/

I was going to make a bunch of comparisons to Vlad and his early game being a sack of elephant potato shit as well, but then I considered how you mentioned Darius and Illaoi, and how Fiora's gotta deal with them in (almost) melee range.

I think you're pretty justified in the buff, and your point is made very nicely.

if she gets one kill one you. you might as well afk because she will just stick to you and dive you without much you can do.

Over InnsmouthJul 1, 20161 votes

The same can be said for a lot of damage-oriented top laners. Riven is hated for being the postergirl of snowballing top laners. Laning against a Vladimir or a Swain who's ahead of you is one of the most soul-draining experiences a top laner can have. Tryndamere can dive you over and over on the cooldown of his ult, and do it far easier than Fiora.

Being able to snowball a lead doesnt make a Champion broken.

Zach SandwhichJun 30, 20163 votes

Not like this...

RcGjWO640wJun 30, 20163 votes

Jesus that's absurd...

Lady HammerlockJun 30, 20162 votes

Is this Riots answer to the Tank Assassin meta?a champion that shits on everything she touches when not kept in control?

Only Play DariusJul 1, 20162 votes

Gotta sell them skins

RalanrJun 30, 20161 votes

We may be getting some Poppy buffs as well.

Poppy buffs make me happy.

MunchCrunchLunchJun 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

We may be getting some Poppy buffs as well.

Poppy buffs make me happy.

yeah me too i wish the buff was a little more. more. so now i get 5% more shield at late game however her shield is somewhat so so. if not useless in team fights because you never focus on picking it up. so many champions have a shield on an ability. they don't have to pick it up after launching it.

i like the W buff tho. more movement speed. its a tiny bit but every little bit of it helps.

RalanrJun 30, 20161 votes

Wait, that's all they buffed for her passive?

...I hoped for too much.

MunchCrunchLunchJun 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Wait, that's all they buffed for her passive?

...I hoped for too much.

they buffed her stun to be 2s at all ranks instead of scaling so that was a buff but they reverted it.

they buffed her W movement speed by like 4-5 units each rank. not additive so 5 at rank 1 and 5 at rank 5. so its a pretty minimal buff

and the shield buff is something i could care less for. i hoped for more too. i haven't played poppy in ages.

RalanrJun 30, 20161 votes

All I want is the AA reset back.

Zach SandwhichJun 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

We may be getting some Poppy buffs as well.

Poppy buffs make me happy.

Fine with poppy buffs love that adorable little shit. Fiora buff are a bit of a stretch though because I still have problems dealing with fiora lmao. After that long ass time she was Meta I just want her to become the next yorick so I dont have to see her anymore.

ErockandrollJun 30, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Fine with poppy buffs love that adorable little shit. Fiora buff are a bit of a stretch though because I still have problems dealing with fiora lmao. After that long ass time she was Meta I just want her to become the next yorick so I dont have to see her anymore.

I don't think Fiora is going to have the same problem she use to have when she was meta. Back then, she could get away with a Juggernaut build with Titanic Hydra. And that Tanky build made her a problem. (If your specked to both Duel, and Tank shred, you better be vulnerable to burst.)

On top of that, The buffs drop off in the mid game, so it's really not adding anything to her end game power.

Zach SandwhichJun 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I don't think Fiora is going to have the same problem she use to have when she was meta. Back then, she could get away with a Juggernaut build with Titanic Hydra. And that Tanky build made her a problem. (If your specked to both Duel, and Tank shred, you better be vulnerable to burst.)

On top of that, The buffs drop off in the mid game, so it's really not adding anything to her end game power.

True, but I'm at fizz level with this champ to where just seeing her tilts my ass. I know she's not uber op rn but I just dont ever want her to be meta again lmao

ErockandrollJun 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

True, but I'm at fizz level with this champ to where just seeing her tilts my ass. I know she's not uber op rn but I just dont ever want her to be meta again lmao

Personally, I really don't want her defining the meta. (Nobody likes that.) But putting her in a position where she can actually counter matchups that she should be reasonably good at, and having a place in a team comp. It can probably be accomplished without making her completely unhealthy.

LovelleJul 1, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Personally, I really don't want her defining the meta. (Nobody likes that.) But putting her in a position where she can actually counter matchups that she should be reasonably good at, and having a place in a team comp. It can probably be accomplished without making her completely unhealthy.

Imo she'll never be healthy as long as she has %max hp true damage. It's a a dumb mechanic that counters everything, simply because she was played well.

Weiner the PoohJun 30, 20161 votes

yay, honestly tho, Q was fine, the should have lowered W cd, but ill take what i can get.

Critmaster GarenJun 30, 20161 votes

about time. ad fiora needs a buff for a while now.

only bruiser fiora was ever the problem. imo they should have never nerfed ripostes cooldown and instead built more stat hooks for crit and attack speed into her kit to give her more of an incentive to build squishy with items like essence reaver instead of titanic hydra.

chipndip1Jun 30, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9AUxJjs1,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-06-30T22:11:48.360+0000)

about time. ad fiora needs a buff for a while now.

only bruiser fiora was ever the problem. imo they should have never nerfed ripostes cooldown and instead built more stat hooks for crit and attack speed into her kit to give her more of an incentive to build squishy with items like essence reaver instead of titanic hydra.

Nah, Riposte's cd was probably one of Fiora's bigger general issues...let's be real here...

Critmaster GarenJun 30, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Nah, Riposte's cd was probably one of Fiora's bigger general issues...let's be real here...

no it wasnt. it was the mechanism, that allowed her to be squishy in melee.

this is the core of a melee adc. high outplay potential and mobility in return for being squishy as fuck in melee. if you time your abilities perfectly and use riposte to dodge hard cc and big ticket abilities you surive and carry. if you misplay and waste it, you blow up.

theyre supposed to be mechanically intensitive high risk, high reward champions.

the problems started when people built her bruiser and she basically turned into an effective bruiser with the outplay potential of a melee adc.

imo they should have increased the general cooldown of riposte to make it harder on bruiser fiora, but have the cooldown scale down with attack speed similar to yasuos q. so adc fioras would still benefit from short riposte cooldowns to help them survive. her e also should have been changed and to give her an incentive to build crit.

HappyHazard07Jun 30, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9AUxJjs1,comment-id=000600000000,timestamp=2016-06-30T22:39:51.775+0000)

no it wasnt. it was the mechanism, that allowed her to be squishy in melee.

this is the core of a melee adc. high outplay potential and mobility in return for being squishy as fuck in melee. if you time your abilities perfectly and use riposte to dodge hard cc and big ticket abilities you surive and carry. if you misplay and waste it, you blow up.

theyre supposed to be mechanically intensitive high risk, high reward champions.

the problems started when people built her bruiser and she basically turned into an effective bruiser with the outplay potential of a melee adc.

imo they should have increased the general cooldown of riposte to make it harder on bruiser fiora, but have the cooldown scale down with attack speed similar to yasuos q. so adc fioras would still benefit from short riposte cooldowns to help them survive. her e also should have been changed and to give her an incentive to build crit.

Except Fiora's kit doesn't work with crit or attk speed. She has to dance around people to hit their vitals, Not bash her rightclick button on a target. Both of these stats would sacrifice the raw ad needed for her Vital damage which wouldn't be good for fiora. This would also sacrifice lifesteal needed to surivive if you are going full damage.

Also how low would you want the cd of riposte to be. It is already an enraging ability for people going against it. Making it even lower of a cd wouldn't make her liked.

And what is wrong with fiora building a few tank items. She is a melee fighter plain and simple. Just one with dps and mobility. Her riposte doesn't suddenly make her immune to Azir 4 shotting her from 1000+ range. It's ok for her to build a a tank/bruiser item or 2 as long as that isn't the entirety of her build. Which was her problem during her titanic hydra days.

Critmaster GarenJul 1, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Except Fiora's kit doesn't work with crit or attk speed.

thats the point. she only scales with cdr and ad offensively right now which means she has no actual reason to build squishy.

thats why i think her riposte cooldown should go down with attack speed and her passive should scale like jhins. the % health true damage should scale with ad and critical strike, and her e reworked to make crit useful with it.

this would put a serious damper on bruiser fiora while making ad fiora more viable in comparison.

Hinagiku33Jul 1, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Except Fiora's kit doesn't work with crit or attk speed.

Not entirely true actually. Her E2 gives a guaranteed crit, so getting item 3031 straight up boosts her burst combo just like Shaco . I've gotten her E2 to hit for over 1100 damage before with it and the tooltip does update to show it boosts the damage just like it should. She probably doesn't need more crit incentive since the rework made her more of a "spell-weaver" melee carry - Riot seems to really want to emphasize rapid ability casts over auto-attacking like her old E steroid did.

She does actually scale a bit with Attack Speed - it stacks with the boost on her E to get both hits off faster for a quicker burst, and additionally lets her weave basic attacks a lot more smoothly to make the best use of all the AD she is supposed to be buying. Still shouldn't ever get more than one (strictly optional) AS item though.

Generally this makes her better with raw AD and Armor Penetration so she should be build more like Talon and less like Jinx . But holy hell with does so much damage. She just blows up instantly if you play her wrong. She 1v5s if you play her right though.

And what is wrong with fiora building a few tank items. She is a melee fighter plain and simple.

There's actually a ton wrong with Fiora building "a few" tank items. One defensive item is fine since even Marksmen can do that. Two is passable in a bad match up to survive. But if a squishy melee carry like Fiora is doing melee carry levels of damage while building at least half tank then something is massively wrong.

Jax is a tanky fighter that builds a lot of tankiness because he scales with how long he can stay in a fight and has limited mobility (a single gap-closer with no resets).

Fiora is a "light fighter" that is intended to build glass cannon to prevent her from becoming too frustrating. She is intended to scale with damage items and rely on her mobility and Riposte to access targets and avoid damage.

Needing to build glass cannon is one of the weaknesses of Fiora's kit by design. If she can build tanky and deal enough damage anyway then it is a huge problem as it means her weakness isn't meaningful. Her safety/success is supposed to be obtained through timing and player skill, not building defensive stats - making her a lot easier to deal with when she misplays or you outplay her since she'll blow up easily.

Solari FortuneJul 1, 20161 votes

Well you gotta remember it is a BONUS AD ratio not TOTAL AD So at level 1 it not like it gonna be 400 damage

SpookyNeedleJul 1, 20161 votes

Hehhehe yes!!!!

PiVoRxJul 1, 20161 votes

So how i will win against Fiora with my Yi? Oh i forgot Yi is meant to be used only against bots.

Critmaster GarenJul 1, 20161 votes

{quoted}

So how i will win against Fiora with my Yi? Oh i forgot Yi is meant to be used only against bots.

time alpha strike with her dash to dodge it? yi has significant outplay potential too.

Critmaster GarenJul 1, 20161 votes

i think fioras ideal build should look something like this.

item 3508 item 3046 item 3009 item 3812 item 3156 item 3026

this is the problem with the current fiora. she doesnt have stat hooks for attack speed and critical strike in her kit and only scales with cdr and ad. so she has no incentive to build like an actual melee adc.

id personally make her passive % value scale with crit and ad, so it ends up really crappy when she builds only some ad with items like item 3748 and good when she builds items like item 3508 and item 3046

her riposte cooldown should go down with attack speed, to give a squishier build more survivability, while bruiser fiora can only riposte every 20 seconds or so.

her e mechanic needs changes as to not deter you from building critical strike. for example the slow value on the first hit could scale with critical strike chance. and the 0% crit chance removed on the first hit. the second hit would double your crit chance instead of putting it at 100%.

MunchCrunchLunchJul 1, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9AUxJjs1,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2016-07-01T16:11:39.909+0000)

i think fioras ideal build should look something like this.

this is the problem with the current fiora. she doesnt have stat hooks for attack speed and critical strike in her kit and only scales with cdr and ad. so she has no incentive to build like an actual melee adc.

id personally make her passive % value scale with crit and ad, so it ends up really crappy when she builds only some ad with items like and good when she builds items like and

her riposte cooldown should go down with attack speed, to give a squishier build more survivability, while bruiser fiora can only riposte every 20 seconds or so.

her e mechanic needs changes as to not deter you from building critical strike. for example the slow value on the first hit could scale with critical strike chance. and the 0% crit chance removed on the first hit.

i think fiora's idea build should be something like this

item 3074 item 3111 item 3156 item 3071 item 3031 item 3812

Critmaster GarenJul 1, 20161 votes

{quoted}

i think fiora's idea build should be something like this

suboptimal. i.e. is too much gold on an item without additional critical strike chance from other sources.

you can replace the maw in my build with ravenous hydra or bloodthirster, but i think as a duellist, having phantom dancers as an option and essence reaver for cdr would make a lot of sense.

cleaver right now is only built for the cdr/ad combination on her anyways, because she simply doesnt need other offensive stats. not even armor pen, since her passive compensates for the lack of that. but generally its not an item that should be optimal on her, since she doesnt synergize with its passive.

also, essence reaver would completely remove mana as a factor by midgame. and much like yasuo, ad fiora is reliant on constantly using her abilities to be able to carry.

while mana is not a factor in lane for her right now, in extended teamfights and skirmishes she actually tends to run out.

item 3508 + item 3046 (or another zeal item) would also put her at 50% crit. which means if her e was changed to double her crit chance on the second strike, she would get 100% crit on it like she does now. while bruiser fiora doesnt get a crit at all.