Please don't gank top

Z Statistic··10 votes·2,270 views

No, seriously, don't gank top.

Look, I know I died twice, but just leave me be. I can play defensive-

I said don't gank top.

Ok, we're doing this? Fine. Just wait-

I said wait.

For Pete's sake I haven't even thinned out the minion wave yet.

And he flashed. Which is nice except-

RAAAAAAAAAWR

Yeah, they just took dragon.

I know this sounds childish, but it's my reaction every time the jungler ganks top. What's worse is when the enemy ganks top and we don't do dragon. It kinda makes me conflicted. On one hand, my jungler wanted to help me out so I can do well. On the other hand, it cost us something more important.

36 Comments

CreationFlaw5 votes

I'm more salty when people don't ping and tell me when they're ganking, like no. I know you're there, but I want my cs.

The Griefer King1 votes

no no no, you gank with the jungler. initiate the fight, jng come in behind and finishes and then we lane tax you. don't make us wait in a bush while you cs. and we shouldn't have to ping because you should see us on mini map.

CreationFlaw4 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Griefer King,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8cTEWYHW,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2015-05-26T06:34:06.649+0000)

no no no, you gank with the jungler. initiate the fight, jng come in behind and finishes and then we lane tax you. don't make us wait in a bush while you cs. and we shouldn't have to ping because you should see us on mini map.

Douche.

The Griefer King1 votes

not at all. if the gank succeeds the benefit is worth more than a few cs. and the jungler is supposed to wait for your commitment before going in for the gank. therefore you have to initiate the fight. and lane tax is a must because sitting in that bush "waiting" puts us behind more than you actually know

EffectFX9 votes

Ping if you're going to gank, not everyone is watching the mini map regardless of how much they should be.

The Griefer King1 votes

i ping anyways but im on the side of they should be watching mini map. map awareness is a must in this game.

EffectFX2 votes

Doesn't matter what side you are, people will do what people will do.

The Griefer King1 votes

i understand that as well, which is why i ping. but its a team game and the jungler is to help. if i see my guy pushed under turret i WILL show. even if they dont want me there or not. this isnt a solo game, its a team game. i will NOT watch my guy get beat down and no respond. although sometimes i cant be in all 3 lanes at once but i will do my best to be there. even if they dont want the gank, i will gank anyways. i wont let someone start to snowball then eat our whole team.

CreationFlaw1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Griefer King,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8cTEWYHW,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-26T06:41:21.481+0000)

not at all. if the gank succeeds the benefit is worth more than a few cs. and the jungler is supposed to wait for your commitment before going in for the gank. therefore you have to initiate the fight. and lane tax is a must because sitting in that bush "waiting" puts us behind more than you actually know

The average champion kill is worth about 14-16 cs is it not? So no, a few cs is sometimes worth it x)

BluePolarizer3 votes

no it is not. the CS is never worth it if you miss a gank. I play both jungle and top, and if the jungler pings, I go in. Why? Because if the gank succeeds in pushing the enemy out or killing them, I get freefarm. You think that the enemy laner is just gonna let you freefarm? No. That's why CS in actual games is much lower than the ideal CS; as your CS skill goes up, your opponent's harass skills also goes up.

Also, you get a huge EXP lead. 1 level early game is the equivalent of 500 gold in stats.

The Griefer King1 votes

the cs will still be there after the gank. you wont lose a full wave from a gank. cs will still be there for share(lane tax) + a kill/assist. worth

Partholonian1 votes

That's the best case scenario. If the gank fails, you lost those cs for nothing (more if the jungler taxes after failing, which some do).

On the other hand, the enemy isn't going to cs during the gank either, so your loss of cs is offset by theirs. Unless there's a wave at your turret, in which case you're going to lose a lot more cs than they will.

I do agree that it's probably a bad idea to gank top while dragon is alive, though. Objective control is the jungler's first job, before snowballing lanes. Early dragons don't snowball the whole team as much as they used to, but they're still important.

3TWarrior1 votes

well actually, 5 dragons means you have super minions and this can push the lanes by 20 minutes without inhibitors. if you have someone who can solo baron (like nunu or etc but it's difficult), then you can have 2 super minions pushing a lane before your opponent can even handle them.

the jungle lane is high risk, high reward but some champs ignore that, like Lee Sin, though diving under a turret isn't smart, he is very likely to get away if he has flash and he gets his free kill

LifeCyclesTWA2 votes

You sicken me.

As a jungler main, the term "lane tax" is used by useless wastes of air that claim to be junglers but in all actuality have not a single fucking clue what their job is.

First off, "lane tax" is the dumbest fucking thing ever. You aren't going to be the head damage dealer on your team bud, leave carrying to your ADC. How do you carry as a jungler? By helping your laners succeed. You know what "lane tax" does? It makes them fail. You took away their gold and experience. They COULD have beaten the other laner to level 6 but you, the fucktard jungler, decided to hang out in their lane for far too long. They COULD have bought the BF Sword, but your dumbass fucked with their farm.

You are a cancer to all the teams you have ever played with and honestly, you should play ADC or Mid with the mentality you have because you are a poor excuse for a supportish role that the jungler plays.

Zoroastrian2 votes

you do know that junglers need farm too right? taking a few cs isn't a problem especially if they don't even have their jungle item yet. Junglers right now are either full damage assassins or tanks with tons of utility, so of course they are going to carry. Also laners have an infinite supply of CS while jungle timers spawn every 1 minute and 40 seconds. And what about when laners need help pushing so they can back? Should they just waste 15 seconds trying to get their farm or should you push the wave to tower and deny cs to the enemy laner?

LifeCyclesTWA1 votes

Math:

Minion waves spawn once every 30 seconds Jungle camps, with the exception of red and blue, spawn every 100 seconds.

Each jungle camp gives a tiny bit more experience than a minion wave. At 300 seconds (or 6:55 in game since minions get to lane at 1:55 and jungle camps spawn at 1:55) there will have been 10 minion waves and 12 jungle camps, not including red and blue. However, the number of jungle camps cleared and how quickly they were cleared determine how many camps will have spawned. More than likely, you will see around 8 camps, not including red and blue, by that mark.

If you are on top of your shit in the jungle and clear the camps as they spawn once every 1:40, you will outlevel your bot-laners and be close to your mid and top in levels, possibly higher if you have been farming the jungle (because there are more camps spawned every 100 seconds than minion waves)

The Griefer King1 votes

item 3070 item 3070 Garen teed after i lane tax your ass

but serious? would you rather tax a few cs OR just let you lane get harrased and die and feed. yea im taxing that ass cs.

LifeCyclesTWA1 votes

Your mentality is the cause of your massive failure in ranked. If you gank and fail, leave and farm your jungle. Don't take the laners cs, you already sapped off some of the xp while you were there when minions died therefore giving the other laner the level advantage in lane. If you gank and succeed, awesome, either push down the turret or leave and go back to doing your job as the jungler.

Here is a math/LoL lesson I gave to someone else:

Math:

Minion waves spawn once every 30 seconds Jungle camps, with the exception of red and blue, spawn every 100 seconds.

Each jungle camp gives a tiny bit more experience than a minion wave. At 300 seconds (or 6:55 in game since minions get to lane at 1:55 and jungle camps spawn at 1:55) there will have been 10 minion waves and 12 jungle camps, not including red and blue. However, the number of jungle camps cleared and how quickly they were cleared determine how many camps will have spawned. More than likely, you will see around 8 camps, not including red and blue, by that mark.

If you are on top of your shit in the jungle and clear the camps as they spawn once every 1:40, you will outlevel your bot-laners and be close to your mid and top in levels, possibly higher if you have been farming the jungle (because there are more camps spawned every 100 seconds than minion waves)

You cannot dispute the facts that I just posted. Lane tax is something Bronze-Platinum scrubs do. In a game with skilled players you will not see a jungler take someone's farm because "they failed a gank." However, you may see them push the lane with the laner in order to get objectives, such as turrets/dragon

The Griefer King1 votes

if you read comment above i never said i tax is the gank fails. and i will tax after a successful gank. 90% of the time the laner b's back to home after and doesnt go for objectives. and leaguecraft says lane tax is a must. so. lane tax it is

colesy1 votes

yes, asking team mates to actually have map awareness is such a douche thing to say

The Griefer King1 votes

explain to me how it is a douchy thing to do?

colesy1 votes

probably should have wrote /s

asking for map awareness imo isn't an unreasonable request and to be called a douche for it is pathetic

The Griefer King1 votes

i want to hear why you think asking for map awareness is douchey. i want valid points to why it is douchey. i already know its not a valid point to be called a douche

Bharhash1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Griefer King,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8cTEWYHW,comment-id=0002000000000001000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-26T18:18:22.977+0000)

i want to hear why you think asking for map awareness is douchey. i want valid points to why it is douchey. i already know its not a valid point to be called a douche

If you're engaged in farming / trading with the enemy top / dodging harass, then taking the time to look down at the minimap can be the difference between a death and not.

As well, you might start heading top, take a lot at the situation before deciding that you're better off going into top-side enemy jungle or turning around to gank mid. Just because I see you going top does not mean that you'll be ganking top.

Back to OP's post;

if I'm jungling, I try not to gank a lost lane. Two deaths might not make it a lost lane; I've seen a lot of lanes turn around after a pretty cruddy start, but I understand OP's sentiments. Don't gank a losing lane, unless you know that you're gonna get them a kill. Otherwise, you've wasted your time and theirs. Snowball the winning lanes. Counter jungle some. Secure dragon. These are the things you could be doing instead of attempting to and failing to gank a lane.

The Griefer King1 votes

i couldnt agree with you more. looking at mini map doesnt even take a fraction of a second to analyze. and usually i wont gank a lane either if they are 0/2 in lane. ill always give that 1 try though to try to equal it up. i also tab up to see what they have purchased already as well as the enemy to get a better understandign of the situation iam going in. if i know we can do it then ima do it.

colesy1 votes

i already told you, i don't think it's douchey at all. i'm saying the fool who said it was douchey is an idiot.

The Griefer King1 votes

ahh gotcha, my misunderstanding {.^_^}

Godhri3 votes

Junglers never gank my lane. I'm always winning it. gg thug lyfe

Vicvictorw1 votes

Are you actually telling him to go elsewhere in a calm manner or are you just spamming back pings accompanied with a "OMFG NOOB JG?"

They just want to help, but they might not be the best judge of a situation. Explain why it's best to leave toplane be.

Z Statistic4 votes

I don't rage in game. I only rage irl to the detriment of my next door neighbor :3

Xerees1 votes

Been in an exact same situation, except I didn't lose the dragon while the jg was attempting to Kill Jax without even having me clear my minion wave.

Only Play Darius1 votes

I like when junglers gank top at half HP against enemies with executes, like Darius.

Oh look, I was struggling in lane but I didn't give them a kill. Now my lane is going to be 5x harder.

Pæan1 votes

You dont want a lvl 2 gank that either kills him or blows at least 1 summoner spell? :C Shaco item 3070

AJStarhiker1 votes

I'm terrible in the jungle. But, I know it can be rough to keep up. I usually play Top relatively safely unless I can completely dominate, so when my Jungler comes in to gank, I'll check gold/health levels if it drove the opposing player out. If I'm low hp or high gold, I'll tell the jungler to farm while I go back.

I'm not actually losing anything, and the Jungler gets some extra gold/xp. Win/win.

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