Not only is it difficult, it is boring. I have the greatest fun playing SR and TT as well as ARAM. Riot needs to put more focus on the main game. TFT is ok I guess, but the reason we play League is for the primary modes. Those are what deserve more updates. Its unfair to drop the ball on them just for TFT which is not everyone's cup of tea.
RiotBazerka43 votesThis is a great call out. TFT (much like League or any game for that matter) isn't for everyone! You should seek out game / game modes that you love the most and play! The hardest feels bad moments come when you find a game that doesn't have as many fans which means those game types dont get supported :(. It feels bad, but is the reality of anything. If not enough people use it, that thing will be killed. Doesn't stop it from feeling bad tho :P
Kai Guy11 votesHey Bazerka. You guys ever internally think about utilizing custom games more? Plenty of folks would be very happy even if map types are optional Downloads. I know a lot of folks will want TT and Dominion back and this might be a good option.
RiotBazerka19 votes[{quoted}](name=Kai Guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8Anyo39z,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-08-19T20:18:04.807+0000)
Hey Bazerka. You guys ever internally think about utilizing custom games more? Plenty of folks would be very happy even if map types are optional Downloads. I know a lot of folks will want TT and Dominion back and this might be a good option.
Has Riot ever thought about it? I can pretty much guarantee that we have. Do I know the reasons for why we haven't so far? I don't unfortunately :X. Riot is a big place, and not everyone knows everything about everything sadly. However, if I were to guess (and I cannot emphasize that I'm guessing here enough), I'd say that it gets tricky about releasing custom maps and modes as well as how far we can support them since those features are heavily resource intensive, and unlike other games with those features, our feature set constantly needs updating and balancing which exponentially increases upkeep cost.
Theres also the added concern around what the tech can allow. Thats a whole black box I'm unfamiliar with (but I'm learning! :D)
IceFang73 votesHas Riot ever thought about it? I can pretty much guarantee that we have. Do I know the reasons for why we haven't so far? I don't unfortunately :X. Riot is a big place, and not everyone knows everything about everything sadly. However, if I were to guess (and I cannot emphasize that I'm guessing here enough), I'd say that it gets tricky about releasing custom maps and modes as well as how far we can support them since those features are heavily resource intensive, and unlike other games with those features, our feature set constantly needs updating and balancing which exponentially increases upkeep cost.
Theres also the added concern around what the tech can allow. Thats a whole black box I'm unfamiliar with (but I'm learning! :D)
Do you guys plan on adding any other permanent game modes with the removal of twisted treeline?
RiotBazerka6 votesDo you guys plan on adding any other permanent game modes with the removal of twisted treeline?
That would be information classified as "secret" :P. Joking aside I have no clue, I dont work on League so I wouldnt know XD
Kai Guy2 votesYea. Its not like WC3 where you can just let folks use map editor and requires 0 dev interaction. The only way to cut out the cost issue is to abandon dedicated balance teams for the modes. Edit (and you still have some $ being spent. Not like its completely free to produce and distribute just cuz you don't have a paid balance team for it.)
If I had a good model to suggest for y'all I would provide it. My gut instinct is if there was enough Red + Player interest to the point you guys could net enough Volunteers to maintain the game health then I believe its viable in theory but the exact # are something I completely lack. To little data for me to really put together any convincing argument and I have no idea if there are any Reds in the right departments who loved a unsupported game mode enough to want to put their free time into it.
Off topic if you ever bump into Sapmagic, would you kindly let him know I am super curious of League's MMR is off a Normal or Logistical Distribution?
Have not seen ya in new for a while. WB.
RiotBazerka10 votes[{quoted}](name=Kai Guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8Anyo39z,comment-id=0000000000000001,timestamp=2019-08-19T21:02:33.759+0000)
Yea. Its not like WC3 where you can just let folks use map editor and requires 0 dev interaction. The only way to cut out the cost issue is to abandon dedicated balance teams for the modes. Edit (and you still have some $ being spent. Not like its completely free to produce and distribute just cuz you don't have a paid balance team for it.)
If I had a good model to suggest for y'all I would provide it. My gut instinct is if there was enough Red + Player interest to the point you guys could net enough Volunteers to maintain the game health then I believe its viable in theory but the exact # are something I completely lack. To little data for me to really put together any convincing argument and I have no idea if there are any Reds in the right departments who loved a unsupported game mode enough to want to put their free time into it.
Off topic if you ever bump into Sapmagic, would you kindly let him know I am super curious of League's MMR is off a Normal or Logistical Distribution?
Have not seen ya in new for a while. WB.
I think the MMR logic is kept pretty secret (something about secret sauce etc :P). I also tend to agree, IMHO the best way to have a healthy mod community in a live balance game is to charge a recurring license fee to develop / host on the platform. It doesn't have to be a ton of money, but enough to cover the company overhead of supporting those devs. Unfortunately, that move could be seen as greedy and for me would act as a serious deterrent from moving in that direction. Also the upfront cost of making that could be huge I imagine o.o
Jbels2 votesI think the MMR logic is kept pretty secret (something about secret sauce etc :P). I also tend to agree, IMHO the best way to have a healthy mod community in a live balance game is to charge a recurring license fee to develop / host on the platform. It doesn't have to be a ton of money, but enough to cover the company overhead of supporting those devs. Unfortunately, that move could be seen as greedy and for me would act as a serious deterrent from moving in that direction. Also the upfront cost of making that could be huge I imagine o.o
Didn't stop Eternals from being a thing.
Sorry, this isn't aimed at you, I'm just still extremely peeved about that
ArtumisPrime1 votesInstead of stealing eternals from DotA 2, maybe steal the idea of a workshop tool? It might breathe a bit of life back into this game.
LaMaPhUcKeRzz1 votesInstead of stealing eternals from DotA 2, maybe steal the idea of a workshop tool? It might breathe a bit of life back into this game.
eternals were created by comics in 1976, its america no one has a original idea
ArtumisPrime1 votesI don't see your point. They stole the idea of paid achievements from DotA (except in DotA you pay a sub and get all of them.) I would rather they steal an idea that supports the community and promotes growth of the game, rather than a cash grab.
LaMaPhUcKeRzz1 votesI don't see your point. They stole the idea of paid achievements from DotA (except in DotA you pay a sub and get all of them.) I would rather they steal an idea that supports the community and promotes growth of the game, rather than a cash grab.
its a gaming company they are going to try to take every penny they can from you
ArtumisPrime1 votesI'm sorry...are you defending cash grabs?
Larriet1 votesBugtesting was also cited for the removal of TT. For example, if you release a new champion who interacts with walls in any way (
), then you need to test that against the geometry over the entirety of every single map.
Trist mid opop49 votesThis is a great call out. TFT (much like League or any game for that matter) isn't for everyone! You should seek out game / game modes that you love the most and play! The hardest feels bad moments come when you find a game that doesn't have as many fans which means those game types dont get supported :(. It feels bad, but is the reality of anything. If not enough people use it, that thing will be killed. Doesn't stop it from feeling bad tho :P
It feels even worse when the gamemode doesnt get love from the creators in the first place and therefor no one wants to play it. Rip twisted treeline
Oznap19 votes[{quoted}](name=Trist mid opop,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8Anyo39z,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2019-08-19T20:56:28.162+0000)
It feels even worse when the gamemode doesnt get love from the creators in the first place and therefor no one wants to play it. Rip twisted treeline
I miss the crystal scar and it really hurts to know we won't get anything similar to it ever again. 
Trist mid opop5 votesI miss the crystal scar and it really hurts to know we won't get anything similar to it ever again.
Hide n seek
ModRowanstar2 votesThis is a great call out. TFT (much like League or any game for that matter) isn't for everyone! You should seek out game / game modes that you love the most and play! The hardest feels bad moments come when you find a game that doesn't have as many fans which means those game types dont get supported :(. It feels bad, but is the reality of anything. If not enough people use it, that thing will be killed. Doesn't stop it from feeling bad tho :P
Agreed. And thank you for joining the conversation. Both as a Mod and a player, I hope to encourage more interaction between Rioters and the Boards (as a positive relationship). We appreciate it.
DUDE BRO2 votesThe hardest feels bad moments come when you find a game that doesn't have as many fans which means those game types dont get supported :(.
I'm hoping this philosophy can be used with RGM's, so they they change out every single week, perhaps with missions or some small incentive to play them each week.
I wasn't a fan of the original idea of giving us one only on special occasions and making them last too long, like these month long events. That's an easy way to make anything boring and stale.
They need to be short, often, and different each time to stay fresh.
They don't even need to be huge changes. A simple "SR with double/triple gold income" or even "SR with ARAM-styled gold income" should be enough to make an exciting mode for a week. They can basically just be SR with small tweaks, since SR is so popular already.
Oooh Oooh bonus! Maybe while an RGM is on, there can be a global poll somewhere in the client with 3 random RGM's. Highest voted at the end of the week gets chosen for the next week.
nGio3 votesThis is a great call out. TFT (much like League or any game for that matter) isn't for everyone! You should seek out game / game modes that you love the most and play! The hardest feels bad moments come when you find a game that doesn't have as many fans which means those game types dont get supported :(. It feels bad, but is the reality of anything. If not enough people use it, that thing will be killed. Doesn't stop it from feeling bad tho :P
Think about all those URF fans who have to wait 6-12 months to play something that should be available permanently. At least TFT has myself and some friends playing League again, because we're usually playing other games until URF comes back.
At this point Riot should just evolve, and allow every RGM to be permanent. Let the players actually play your damn game, instead of "play ranked LCS Simulator like the pros or gtfo".
ImTheJuggernauty2 votesEven if urf was just available once a quarter or one week a month, that would be nice.
GenoXx2 votesYou know....Being the only Rioter taking one for the team never really quells anything. I just thought I'd slip that in since you seem to be trying to pacify players.....while your colleagues on the surface seems to show cowardice.
Nothing against you though, I'm just saying.....how come this isnt a group effort?
RiotBazerka6 votesYou know....Being the only Rioter taking one for the team never really quells anything. I just thought I'd slip that in since you seem to be trying to pacify players.....while your colleagues on the surface seems to show cowardice.
Nothing against you though, I'm just saying.....how come this isnt a group effort?
Riot is home to lots of people, and not everyone likes to talk to a large group of players (at least not in this format). Some people get massive anxiety or stress when thinking about posting on forums etc. Everyone communicates in their own way, this happens to be mine :), I don't expect others to do the same :D
ImTheJuggernauty1 votesI'm going to add here, that while you are being polite and saying nice things about your coworkers, the fact is that Riot is a multi-billion dollar company, and there is absolutely no excuse for the level of indifference and silence shown by Riot. None whatsoever. It's a big company, there ought to be at least a few mature adults like yourself who can put their big boy pants on and interact with players on these forums a little more. The anxiety defense doesn't really work in a professional environment when a company wants professional respect.
Kai Guy4 votesRandom Blogs are here Use this to find reds rather then hope reds find you Here are the Weekly posts
I don't know if you resemble this but a massive # of players expect reds to find them, their posts and comments, then provide all the information they want. Personally I find it easier to get information by going to where they provide it most frequently.
It might be my Bias from being an old player and how the forums used to operate but Gameplay Boards should and likely are intended to just be a place for players to help players and talk about what they are doing in the game.
But... well... It got so cluttered with folks trying to vent its not all to helpful for new players or folks who like discussing the game. I kinda miss Iron stylus flapping into a thread and cracking jokes or some of the community jokes.
Yordle Xayah3 votesYou should seek out game / game modes that you love the most and play!
https://imgur.com/KXQmAPn.png[] Dude...
https://imgur.com/F8xksUx.png[]
That's cold... https://imgur.com/8eGeauL.png[]
xelaker3 votesThere ya go, blame the playerbase! It's not you (Riot), it's our lack of support that makes things go away or suffer.
RiotBazerka3 votesThere ya go, blame the playerbase! It's not you (Riot), it's our lack of support that makes things go away or suffer.
I blamed the player base? I was blaming? Would love to know what I said that led you to that conclusion :). I def wasn't intending too, but rather just calling out that the OP's opinion that TFT wasn't for them was totally fair and appropriate.
Jaghatai1 votesToo bad Riot keeps removing those game modes. Dominion Twisted Treeline
Rotating game modes like: Definitely not Dominion Ascension Etc.
Yuuuup ... just get right on that ...
Zlera8 votesI agree, Riot should focus more on SR and Aram (I would say TT, but riot doesnt really much care that we want it to stay), those are its main money makers. Skins sell for those modes, most money comes from them, if riot just stops updating them, its an issue... not just for them but also for us.
IceEragon5 votesI hope this mode fails. It's boring and useless.
Janakin4 votesNot only is it difficult
Please tell me you are kidding. Please.
Kegan Arto3 votesTFT is fun for a couple games but I wouldnt play game after game like I do with base league.
Honestly my biggest issue with TFT is how literally every single aspect of the game is RNG. Items, Champions, Even gold.
I've had MANY games where I just needed a single extra warwick or something to get them to 2 star and I had 20+ gold and spent every bit refreshing and never once did warwick show up.
I've had games where the only items I got were the items from the part where everyone picks a champion from the middle.
I've had games where I barely even got gold (that 1 pity gold when u get no items from jungle helps nobody) and still got no items so I was just completely screwed over.
I wish there was some way to guarantee SOMETHING. Like you can spend 10 gold to select a particular champion you need or something like that, or even you could "recycle" champions u have on the bench to guarantee a champion of the same rarity (like sacrificing 3-4 tier 2 champions to select a specific one you need or want)
Same with items, what if you could spend like 10-20 gold to get a random item.
But as it is now, TFT is honestly just frustrating to play.
like when ur pretty kate in the game at raptors or something and u still only have like 2 full items then when u fight another player they have like 2 3 star champions that each have 3 items and every other champion has at least 1 item, that's just so insanely frustrating.
SiG DxD3 votesrip twisted tree line also btw
Carteeeer2 votesthis is actually the worst post I've ever read? really low effort thread bro
ModRowanstar8 votesthis is actually the worst post I've ever read? really low effort thread bro
well then you dont need to be involved. if you have nothing nice to say, be silent.
MasterDClone1 votesand you have no reason to hate on tft either but here you are
Tynides1 votesDifferent context. One is about the game while the other is about a person's post being a low effort which really shouldn't even be a thing to complain about. It's not even about what's being posted. I can see if he commented about why he disagreed with Rowanstar's post, but he doesn't. He hates it because it is... short? Lol.
MasterDClone1 votesya i agree with all of that, the part in his comment I was objecting to was more the if you have nothing nice to say be silent, because his post would then contradict that. So i was just using his own logic against it. I disagree with the original commenter because it isnt a low effort thread and even if it is who cares?
MirirLightHammer2 votesi mean, what's even the point of it? what do you "win"? EXP? blue essence? nothing. you get NOTHING for wasting 30 minutes. that thing is just a cash grab for stupid players that buy the cute pet
MasterDClone2 voteshow is it a cash grab, i play the mode and still use the riversprite, you play for fun why would you need anything but even then you win icons and emotes by playing it. getting xp or blue essence is pointless because you dont need to buy champions to play tft lol
MirirLightHammer2 votesbecause the ones that don't want those stupid pets are the minority. tft has NO fun value, it's all luck based and gives you nothing if you win. it's a general waste of time. the entire little legends system is A SCAM designed to milk as much money as possible from stupid players
MasterDClone3 votesLeague as a whole is a general wast of time lol all video games are, it's meant to be played for fun lol. As is tft just like what I said previously people play it for fun. A lot of people just simply enjoy playing tft for fun i dont see what you're problem is with people enjoyin the autochess genre. Of course the little legend system is designed to scam people, as is the skin system in league and the upcoming eternals. But that doesn't mean the core game is bad just because there are some elements of it that are greedy
MirirLightHammer1 votesas long as tft shares the same client and the same account you use in league, if it doesn't give you experience or blue essence for the main game, it IS useless
MasterDClone2 votesbut why would it give you either if you don't benefit at all from them to play tft, oh shit i can buy yasuo now, oh wait it doesnt matter at all to play tft. But you do win emotes and icons which are nice cosmetics for tft.
Could you imagine if hextech chests gave u little legends, to players who dont play tft this is completely useless. Actually tho why would tft give be or xp just answer that lol. It does give rewards tho, tft specific rewards lol. thus it isnt useless and at the end of the day both are video games that you play for fun and dont serve any benefit to you as a person
Shiroe LogH2 votesExp or BE given by TFT would be terrible. Then you'd probably end up with something like 4th being the losing place because probably something like 5th-8th would be quick loss bots farming exp/BE to get lvl 30 accounts to sell...
Tynides1 votesBut why did they have to add Ranked TFT if it was for fun? With all it's rng, letting it have ranked is the worst decision ever for me. In fact, Ranked TFT is just laughable really. It's not based on skill but on luck. Not that most of the other modes aren't but TFT is just a whole another level.
MasterDClone2 votesit is based on skill tho, the prime example is scarra, who everyone knew was going to climb high on that ladder and then proceded to do so, unless you are claiming that every challeger tft players are just really consistently lucky over long periods of time. Also league is a game mode that is meant to be played for fun but it also has a ranked mode because people like to just fuck around but some people have fun with a mode when it is more competitive. It have a ranked mode was a smart decision because it allows people to prove how good they are at adapting to new strategies and synergies based on what is given to you, which is something that I enjoy quite a bit.
Tynides1 votesWhat I'm trying to get at is that skills don't matter that much in TFT. Luck is really the main factor to get that item or champion you need to finish off that 3-star champion or 2-star champion. Yes, Scarra can climb like that, but does that mean everyone can do it like Scarra? No.
What do you mean ranked is where people like to have fun and fuck around? That's what normals are for.
You can also adapt to new strategies and synergies in normal TFT too... Actually, that's exactly what you do whether it be in normal or ranked. All I'm saying is that Luck or RNG is a really big factor in TFT and to add ranked to it is just plain dumb. Rank is meant to be competitive. Having the two most important part of the games(items/champion) be based on RNG/Luck instead of a player's skill is just stupid. For example, at the beginning of the game where you fight the minions, some get lucky and get items while others just get a coin or two. Sometimes even nothing at all. That item matters a whole lot more than those coins and those coins matter a whole lot more than getting nothing. If everyone gets only items or coins, then I won't mind it. But to have it be based on RNG/Luck to get either of them is just ridiculous.
MasterDClone2 votesok i miswrote that second bit, what i was trying to say is that some people enjoy playing to fuck around and that is fun for them so they have normals, but others enjoy playing competitively and that is what is fun for them.
But you misunderstand, if 1 or 10 or 100 or whatever other number of players are able to climb in this game mode that means that there is a certain amount of skill required to win consistently and most of that revolves around game knowledge, mental math and being quick to adapt. Ranked tft is competitive because those playing it understand that they are the sole reason for their success or their failure, it's up to you to make your best comp or to pivot into something else. RNG is forsure a huge part of playing tft as it relies on it for the game to function but to say that everygame it is just the luckier players who win is ridiculous, because at the end of the day it is the player skill that allows players to win. I prefer getting coins during the first few minion rounds than items to get more possibilities and running a losing streak, some people prefer items early to secure a winstreak early.. You classify being lucky based on what you consider the stronger start when others don't. A very prominent strategy recently is to open fort which actually requires the coin start and leads to consistent success which shouldn't be possible in a game where you think that skill is meaningless compared to the rng in the game. During the first minion waves it is impossible for the game to give you nothing, they patched this out at least a month ago. What champions and what items you get are mostly RNG but what matters is how you use those champs and items based on what everyone else is running and how you position it to make it work.
