Countering Damage Creep.

DragonShea··6 votes·3,812 views

Hi all this is one of a two part long post that I am gonna be making in regards to mobility and damage creep in the game that damaged the quality of the league. First of all, as a league player since S4 I can tell that the game has gone to the drains because of the high mobility and damage that is in the game. Now it's all about burst or be bursted so I wanted to talk about ideas on how deal with damage in the game.

First of all, I don't think that nerfing damage or doing extensive reworking of the runes reforged system is a good idea as it has become a fundamental part of the game, however what I do believe what should be done is buffing of the defensive power and items in the game so that it's on par with the damage. Tank items such as item 3143 item 3110 anditem 3109 are ineffective due to physical damage being so strong and that there are too many means to bypass it and practically deal true damage. Mages have gained HP close to juggernauts but are still dying quickly.

So how could be done? Well, here is a list of things that should be done:

1: Increasing the HP of all champions:

All champs will gain an increase to their HP, but not all of them will be getting buffed by the same amount. Champs will get a boost to their HP based on their role, damage potential, need to soak up damage etc. Etc. This means that Champs like Marksmen, assassins will get a low boost to their HP and HP scaling while champs like Tanks and Juggernaut will get a much bigger boost due to their role as tanks and lack of mobility respectively. there will be expectations as some champs will benefit more from HP buffs while others will need more HP so as to not fall behind and become unviable. So don't expect all champs of the same role to get the same amount.

Example:

Marksmen, assassins, burst and artillery mages and light Skirmishers will get:

131+7 per Lv up to +250 HP at Lv 18 (in general).

Light divers such as XinZhaoIrelia andDiana, heavy Skirmishers such as Jax, Enchanters, Battle mages

155+10 per lv up +325 HP at lv 18 171+12 per Lv up to +350 HP at lv 18

Heavy divers such as Warwick Renekton and RekSai

203+16 per lv up + 475 HP at lv 18 219+17 per lv up +525 HP at lv 18 227+19 per lv up +550 HP at lv 18

Juggernauts and tanks(Varies due to sustain or shields in kit).

307+27 per lv up +800 HP 243+21*17 per lv up +600 HP

The reason why some champs should have higher HP is because the damage in the game is way too high and by increasing HP, survivability will increase, making it harder to snowball at the early game. In addition, this will make resistance items more effective on champs like tanks as they now gain more HP and thus scale harder into the late game. However, more HP means that HP items gain an indirect nerf due to everyone getting more HP overall. Expect for Mages, The only buff to resistances will be to items as tanks are by far in a bad position and need improvements to their items to better tanks the damage there is in the game they should have higher Base HP in order to be naturally tanky.

But why not increase the base resistances of champs instead? Well The reason why I don't think that is viable is because You don't get as much survivability scaling overall than by increasing HP growth. And like I mentioned earlier, tank Items also need a buff so by buying a tank item and champs are gonna be getting a lot of resistances from items in the late game when they stack armor.

Let's take Yorick vs Tryndamere as an example.

Yorick has 580 base HP and 39 Armor at Lv 1. Tryndamere has has 625.6 base HP and 33 Armor.

Yorickhas 580*((100+39)/(100)) ▸ 806.2 effective HP vs Physical damage

Tryndamere has 625.6*((100+33)/(100)) ▸ 832.048

you add 10 extra armor and you are gonna get

580*((100+49)/(100)) ▸ 864.2 for Yorick and 625.6*((100+43)/(100)) ▸ 864.2 For Tryndamere.

That is increase of 58 and 62.56 respectively, so adding more armor to champions is not gonna increase their survivability that much, not with all the damage there is in the game.

With my formula however.

Yorick(juggernaut): (580+307)*((100+39)/(100)) ▸ 1232.93

Tryndamere(Skirmisher) (625.6+131)*((100+33)/(100)) ▸ 1006.28

Both champs get a sizeable boost to their survivability making harder for both to kill each-other in the laning phase.

2: Improving Physical damage mitigation.

Most tank items nowadays are just picked for the stats and rarely take the passive into account. Right now we are in a meta where tanks are no longer a core part of a team comp, and while they shouldn't always be on every team, they are still a powerful addition and shouldn't be overlooked.

However defensive Items are not really considered good atm and need a modern update to keep up with the game. In addition, most of the damage in the game right now is from either combo or AA based Physical damage dealers, meaning that a counter to those champs should be in place. People have always wanted to have better protection from those damage dealers and make armor more viable, so a good change would be to add a few new Items to the game while changing item 3082 into becoming more consistent defensive item(it's gonna take something good from a boot item I will discuss later on in this post).

The big problem is that AD Caster's have replaced Mages by a long shot and thus, AD champs that are ability reliant alongside AA champs have become too strong, especially as AD caster have no legit counter item that stops them from bursting someone down to 0 in less than a second in this damage meta. Mages in the past had to get enough AP to make item 3089 and item 3135 effective but AD casters and assassins only need a item 3147 or another core item to gain a power spike and dominate the game. In order to stop that, strong early game defensive items should made to stop them from snowballing out of control.

item 3082item 3143item 3075:

Will no longer reduce AS but instead should have item 3047's passive. New, Solid Steel, reduces 15% AA damage instead.

I don't think that getting hit by an fast attacks and have a AS slow on the target makes for a reliable AS counter. Having an Aura where you have a surefire way of reducing it is better and why only Frozen Heart has it now. In addition. Items like {{item:3075} suffer from the target having slow AS has they rely on them hitting fast to deal as much damage back to the enemy. Also, as many people take Tabi's against melee's having item 3082 reduce AA damage instead of tabi would make it a more viable armor item while also giving people more options in which boots they want.

item 3110:

95 armor 400 mana 20% CDR UNIQUE PASSIVE - HARDENED: Reduce all physical damage taken by 10%(Does not stack with Solid Steel) UNIQUE PASSIVE - ICY CORE: Reduces the Physical damage done by nearby enemies 5% and lower their Attack speed by 10%

Frozen Heart should be _the _ anti Physical item, so with it now reducing raw physical damage should the go-to item for tanks if they want to stomp all an all physical team comp. the passives from the item stack, reducing the damage the user takes from physical damage by 15%, making it on par with other Armor items. However this means a slight increase in cost and decrease in armor due to the raw damage reduction and a weaker AS slow.

New Item; Iron Veil:

Cost: 1100( item 1027 +item 1029 ) 20 Armor 250 Mana UNIQUE PASSIVE - BLADE WARD: If you would take physical damage that would reduce maximum health below 30%, you first gain a shield that absorbs 150-400(based on level) physical damage for 5 seconds

This is the first ever Physical shield item, allowing players(especially mages) to better survive champs that like to Zed Talon and other bursty physical damage dealers, it will also building into another Item that I had in mind.

Builds into {{The Bladebreaker}}

New Item{{The BladeBreaker}}:

Cost: 3200

70 Armor 40 AP 20% CDR

UNIQUE PASSIVE - ARCANE HARDENING- Reduces damage from Physical abilities by 5 +2% per 100 AP up to 15%

UNIQUE PASSIVE - BLADE WARD: If you would take physical damage that would reduce maximum health below 30%, you first gain a shield that absorbs 500 physical damage for 5 seconds and grants LIFESURGE for 8 seconds, Granting +35 AP, increase your total AP by 5% and restores 1.25% total mana per second(0.05 Max HP for Manaless champs such as Mordekaiser and Vladimir) (60 second cooldown).

This item would be the perfect anti-assassin item For mages, unlike item 3157, This suit mages that want to continue fighting instead of being put into stasis and become an invulnerable statue of pain.

Just like item 3057 items, Hardening has a priority list on which passive works. HARDENED(also overrides Solid Steal) > ARCANE HARDENING.

3: Boots Rework:

3.1: Ninja Tabi:

As i mentioned, I felt that item 3047 has become the go-to item for Physical damage and Really it's shouldn't be what people should be rushing as it makes it a too predictable and reliable pick against AA champs. Instead it should grant abilities more inline with evasion;

New passive: Avoidance: Reduces the damage taken from AoE by 5%(not DoT like Singed's Q) Now grants 10 armor and 10 MR

This means that Ninja tabi will be the boots you take if you need to mitigate damage from AoE.

3.2: Mercury Treads(and tenacity):

For starters, Tenacity needs to be applied to displacement expect Grab attacks from Blitzcrank, Pyke and Urgot. That is a change that has been looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong overdue.

Second; it now grant HP instead of MR because there are AD's with some powerful CC. item 1001+item 1028=item 3111

4: Towers:

Keeping this one short 'n sweet:

Outer towers:

HP 4500 Damage: 222 Damage at 7 minutes: 264 Armor and MR:70 Resistances after 15 minutes: 100

Inner towers:

HP 4500 Damage: 252 Damage at 27 minutes: 332 Armor and MR: 70 Resistances after 30 minutes: 100

Inhibitor towers:

HP 4800 Damage: 270 Damage at 37 minutes: 390 Armor and MR:100 Resistances after 45 minutes: 100

Nexus towers:

HP 4500 Damage: 252 Damage at 37 minutes: 372 Armor and MR: 70 Resistances after 45 minutes: 100

FORTIFICATION Now last up to 10 minutes instead of 5.

NEW Passive: Warmed Up: after getting all stacks of Warming up. Turret shot now peterate 75% of your armor.

All those these towers are to make sure that you should NEVER stand and soak up Turret Shots if you can. In addition, a large buff to tower Hp and resistances is gonna make Towers A LOT Harder to take down.

5: Resistances buffs:

In general. I also think that resistance items need a buff as well as a small armor buff to mages.

5.1: Armor:

+3 to 9 armor to mages +5 armor to 1st and 2nd tier armor items( item 1029 item 3076 item 1031 item 3082 item 2053 ) and +50g cost. +15 to item 3742 item 3075 item 3068 item 3025 item 3143 and + 200g cost. +10 to item 3109and +100g cost. +5 to item 3512 item 3105 item 3050 and item 3190item 3193 +100g cost. -5 to item 3110+ 50g

item 3193's passive should now grant 55 armor and MR when near 3+ enemy champs.

5.2: Magic resist:

+5 to item 1033 item 3091 item 3211 and +50g cost +5 to item 1057 and +30g cost. +15 to item 3001 item 3194 item 3065 + 200g cost +100 HP to item 3001 item 3194 as well. +5 to item 3105item 3512item 3193 (cost is in armor subsection). +10 to item 3050 and +100g cost.

6: Penetration Items:

One of the main reasons why armor is so useless as well is because of the item 3071 item 3036 +item 3147 combo that assassins have. Assassins should use lethality has their main stats for killing squishies but with all three items, they can reduce armor effectiveness down to 49.4% in addition to reducing the left over armor by a flat 18 points at lv 18. Pretty much stripping away armor for anyone and making it useless.

So I was thinking of something that could be done to make those items less effetive.

item 3036: 15% Total armor pen + 15% Bonus armor pen from 35 Total Armor pen. item 3033: 15% Total armor pen from 25%.

The reduction of the armor pen shouldn't be too bad as using item 3036 +item 3147 would reduce armor down too much.

Example:

Armor: 200

200*(1-0.15) ▸ 170.

85*0.85 ▸ 72.25 85+72.25 ▸ 157.25 85+72.25-18 ▸ 139.25 total armor efficiency

Instead of what is on live.

200*0.65 ▸ 130. 130-18 ▸ 112 total armor efficiency

Also. One has to consider that item 3031 is meant for ADC's to deal crit damage and tank bust, so in that regard I wouldn't mind if they had a bit of True damage deal with the increase in durability.

item 3071: Here is the big one. I think that Black Cleaver's armor shred is now outdated due to Conqueror now fulfilling that role better, especially as Champs that used to rely on item 3071 such as Darius and Garen are using item 3078 more often. So It should have it's Armor shred removed to prevent oversaturation of armor shred and instead have a new passive I call Executioners Fever:

Executioners Fever: Every time you strike an enemy champion and 3 seconds afterwards(Melee only) you gain a(2 for melee) stack of Fever for 6 seconds. Increasing your AD by 2 - 10(16 - 80 AD), stacking up to 8 times(can only gain a stack(s) once every 0.8 second, does not count DoT)

This means that Fever will finally be in the game but in item form. This will also stop other champs from getting too much armor pen as well and prevent champs from going balls to the wall with the front end burst and need to use their strongest attack at the end, not the beginning of a combo.

7: Some damage buffs for those that need it:

item 3068: Damage from 25+1 per Lv to 33+1 lv. Darius Ult: Now deals + 5% +1% per Hemorrhage stack of the targets Bonus HP to the target. a small buff to AP items if they suffer too from the buff to MR (+5 - 15 AP)

8: Other small random stuff.

item 2003: Now heals 180 HP over 15 seconds up from 150. item 2031 and item 2033 now heals 150 HP over 12 seconds, up from 125.

Short Summary of post:

Increase HP scaling of all champions to counter damage creep. Increase resistances on tank items to buff tanks. Increase the power of Towers to reel in the snowball meta. Reduce armor pen to make armor more effective.

TL;DR.

Item to counter melee burst. Massive buff to champion HP scaling. Increased resistance of items. Nerf to armor pen. Small rework of boots. Massive tower buff. Small random Tweaks.

Anyways, that is just my suggestion on how to fix damage creep and stopping the snowball meta.

Peace out.

12 Comments

Tahminatrix 4 votes

I don't think merc treads should give hp instead of MR...the mr itself is too valuable, more builds can fit hp, fewer builds can fit mr.. especially that early.

And sunfire cape shouldn't have its base dmg buffed because its already strong enough in the early game, have like 1.5 lvl scaling or something.

DragonShea1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Super Cow Swag,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6srrda1X,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-07-15T21:37:52.299+0000)

I don't think merc treads should give hp instead of MR...the mr itself is too valuable more builds can fit hp, fewer builds can fit mr.. especially that early.

And sunfire cape shouldn't have its base dmg buffed because its already strong enough in the early game, have like 1.5 lvl scaling or something.

Why not, that would be better actually considering that Sunfire does have good damage. That would add up to 50.5 damage instead of 43(60 based on my own suggestion) at lv 18.

Tahminatrix 1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Super Cow Swag,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6srrda1X,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-07-15T21:37:52.299+0000) or something.

1.5 was just a number I pulled out...

Could have sunfire cape do dmg based on a very very small amount of max hp , stacking up slightly on champions per consecutive hit (with a cap) but I feel like that would just be following the damage meta..

Just need something thatl make champions want to be tanky for this item to work well on them..

TheSingularity1 votes

Because of how quickly juggernauts will go from zero to one thousand. I would ignore deadmans and sunfire to avoid breaking juggenauts

DragonShea1 votes

{quoted}

Because of how quickly juggernauts will go from zero to one thousand. I would ignore deadmans and sunfire to avoid breaking juggenauts

Their damage? Yeah that would be better as no not make them OP and juggs as well.

TheSingularity1 votes

Everything about them actually. Made a post a few weeks ago about increasing tank item costs but also buffing their HP and armour. And came to the conclusion that touching juggernaut items at all would likely be problematic. Imagine even more beefy Darius Garen Aatrox Irelia DrMundo Garen. Would completely screw up the meta and tanks would suffer even more so up top as a result

DragonShea1 votes

{quoted}

Everything about them actually. Made a post a few weeks ago about increasing tank item costs but also buffing their HP and armour. And came to the conclusion that touching juggernaut items at all would likely be problematic. Imagine even more beefy Darius Garen Aatrox Irelia DrMundo Garen. Would completely screw up the meta and tanks would suffer even more so up top as a result

Well I did mention that all other classes should get a HP buff, just not as much as juggs and tanks. Imaging Irelia and Aatrox with + 800 HP at Lv 18. that would be a nightmare to deal with, and apart from item 3194 and item 3001, I wouldn't increase HP on tank items as well as tanks already would get an insane amount of HP.

But on to your point. I don't think that having more durability is bad as long as divers and skirmisher are not abusing them. We don't want shit like Ekko and Yasuo going full tank. They are champs what should have poor defensive stats and whatever defensive items they get should in theory only give them a 100:50 radio of damage and durability.

If granting more Armor and MR to tank items is a problem then Tanks themselves should gain an Armor or even an MR buff to prevent Bruisers from becoming too OP. Hell even just a better armor scaling per lv would be better.

TheSingularity1 votes

Oh definitely. Tank ekko -______________-, I'd rather die.

And increasing HP on tank items wouldn't be a bad thing. Over the years tanks have lost 850 HP and 55 armor due to item nerfs. The most obvious one being warmogs which gave 1000 HP. The other being cinderhulk (spirit of the ancient golem gave 10% more scaling health+20 armor and a ward but had 100 less HP). An interesting angle for tank junglers specifically may be replacing cinderhulk and it's bami recipe with quill coat. Like quill coat+kindlegem+200 gold or somethin

Edit: y'know wot, gonna make a quill coat thread after uni

DragonShea1 votes

{quoted}

Oh definitely. Tank ekko -______________-, I'd rather die.

And increasing HP on tank items wouldn't be a bad thing. Over the years tanks have lost 850 HP and 55 armor due to item nerfs. The most obvious one being warmogs which gave 1000 HP. The other being cinderhulk (spirit of the ancient golem gave 10% more scaling health+20 armor and a ward but had 100 less HP). An interesting angle for tank junglers specifically may be replacing cinderhulk and it's bami recipe with quill coat. Like quill coat+kindlegem+200 gold or somethin

Edit: y'know wot, gonna make a quill coat thread after uni

Ok, lets get my idea and play around with the theorycrafting.

Lets take our boy Ekko: Since he is a skirmisher, he has 569 HP at Lv 1 and 2030 at Lv 18. So let's give him 131+7 per Lv as he is a light skirmisher. Now he has 700 HP at lv 1 and 2280 HP at 18. If he builds tanky item 3100 item 3152 item 3068 item 3157 item 3001 item 3020 +1175 HP 70 MR,120 Armor and 215 AP.

Normally he'd build: item 3100 item 3152 item 3157 item 3135 item 3089 and gain 567 AP and just 300 HP from Protobelt.

Now let's look at Maokai Who is his biggest counter in the top lane, who gets 243+21 per lv. giving him 808 Hp at Lv 1 and 2780 HP at Lv 18 and builds item 3742 item 3068 item 3001 item 3065 item 3083item 3111 to counter him.

that is +150 armor, 140 MR and 2600 HP

Ekko:

HP: 3455 AP: 215 Armor: 203 MR: 123.4

Maokai:

HP: 5380 Armor: 257 MR: 218.4

That leaves Maokai with 18168.3(17684.1 vs Ekko with item 3020 ) effective HP and Ekko with 9093.56 effective HP, but I doubt that Ekko can tank-bust since he doesn't have item 3135

Then if we use the live stats in the game right now. then Maokai has 14092.7(13680.5 vs Ekko with item 3020 ) effective HP and Ekko with 7954.81 effective HP

So with my idea for buffing tanky champs. Maokai gains approx. 29% more effective HP while Ekko gains only 15% if he was to go for an effective tank build.

TheSingularity1 votes

Not bad, not bad at all. GIMME THE HEALTH!

Edit: quill coat post is up if u want a decent read

DragonShea1 votes

{quoted}

Not bad, not bad at all. GIMME THE HEALTH!

Edit: quill coat post is up if u want a decent read

Seen the post, but it doesn't help reduce damage creep, it's just a means to help Jungle tanks, it would be a good idea if damage was down in the game but since tanks are not viable now then it not gonna work.

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