Can we re-rework Mordekaiser?

WutsKraken··87 votes·3,713 views

Mordekaiser was one of my favorite anti-assassins in season 3. His rework might let him do some cool new things, but he's stuck in a similar situation to Kassadin now: He will likely keep getting power removed from his kit over and over because of ONE broken mechanic

Seriously, just like how Kassadin's only power was his ult, the only reason Mordekaiser is still so "strong" is because of his goddamn dragon ghost which makes no real sense to have and is silly but just STUPIDLY BROKEN

Otherwise: His W prevents him from going into a solo lane and the recent nerfs have severely weakened his laning power (His cheesy W is the only thing that really let him win lane), his reworked E severely weakens his early farming, and only his Q really still has much power. He currently relies almost entirely on snowball because he can easily get kited and killed when the enemy is just slightly ahead of him.

Oh yes, he can come back due to his late-game scaling, but he's not his old self, he's not Vayne, he'll never solo-carry without MASSIVE mistakes by the enemy

49 Comments

Lord Boltrix25 votes

(starts the timer for a Malicious Metal Post)

ChaosThief6 votes

You know, I would love to see what MM would do to rework him if he was in charge of it. Could be interesting.

Lord Boltrix4 votes

I'd have to be on that team as well, and smash on the head anyone, every time said person thinks to put cc, mobility, or trying to put his W on a minion on Mordekaiser.

Malicious Metal8 votes

No worries, that wouldn't be the case XD

Still, two brains are better than one. Having only one person designing a kit may just turn out to be less creative/imaginative due to the lack of a second opinion influencing the design.

Jbels14 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lord Boltrix,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6ravApAU,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2015-11-08T01:36:57.777+0000)

(starts the timer for a Malicious Metal Post)

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

Malicious Metal15 votes

(Lazily rubs eyes.) Why is there a party going on without me? T^T

Lord Boltrix2 votes

Because it's 3 AM where I am and nobody parties in the late night anymore.

Mordepool20 votes

Your a new face to the Morde crowd on the boards. Welcome.
I'd like to think we are solving Mordes MAJOR flaws one thread at a time. But only time will tell

Welcome. Misery loves company

Jotunheimr4 votes

{quoted}

Your a new face to the Morde crowd on the boards. Welcome.
I'd like to think we are solving Mordes MAJOR flaws one thread at a time. But only time will tell

Welcome. Misery loves company

All for Hue Hue for all

Cloud Potato9 votes

Morde's rework was an utter failure.

All of his old, low counterplay mechanics are intact. Forcing him into a duo lane was supposed to help mask this, but like Lulu it's not going to change the fact that he's shittily designed and needs actual changes.

All of his new mechanics are great for helping Morde catch up if he falls behind. But, it also makes him completely unstoppable if he gets ahead. It's exactly like insert execution ultimate here.

Combine the 2 problems with Morde also being overtuned and you get only 5 bans per game. Both of these issues need to be solved if Mordekaiser ever wants to be balanced in the game.

Blade of Justic5 votes

Well, let's see the previous rework chopping block and see if they've had a record of reverting reworks:

Cassiopeia Evelynn Karma Mordekaiser Sion Zilean

Nope.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

Maybe riot will stop ignoring the community when we're no longer paying ;)

ChaosThief4 votes

They did stop making the lee sin rework on account of outcry.

I wonder why they stopped it for lee sin. Could it be for the #LC$BIGPLAY$ ?

Teslablade5 votes

He needs a thematic, Sauron-like, JUGGERNAUT kit.

LadyRenly4 votes

I just want his q. most satisfying thing ever.

Matezoide3 votes

{quoted}

I just want his q. most satisfying thing ever.

Maybe if the sound effect wasnt so shitty.

Laggiest Medic5 votes

but i like the sound effect

Starfish H4 votes

It's not the ultimate that makes him strong. It's A) His Q B) His Q C) His Q

RyzeRework2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Starfish H,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6ravApAU,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2015-11-08T05:35:45.584+0000)

It's not the ultimate that makes him strong. It's A) His Q B) His Q C) His Q

550 range adc gj standing next to morde

WooBeeWoo3 votes

Its not his q its the dragon ghost

Count Zubat1 votes

Not really. What makes him strong is dragon ghost and W passive (before nerf). His Q is just his whole gameplay (remember, E is technically useless and we can't use W to it's full potential without support holding our hand). Take out exp passive and dragon and what you get? A shitty Q-spamming crap outclassed in tankiness and damage by everybody.

Hayaishi23 votes

And just like Kassadin, Riot can't remove his ultimate because mains will appear out of nowhere to complain about how Riot doesn't care about them, then they make threads like this one saying "Why can't kassadin get buffed?"

WutsKraken8 votes

Who cares about Morde's ult? It's been the same its always been

I mean the goddamn dragon ghost. What's the point of that?

Ravel Phoenix3 votes

They wont admit that they fucked up , thats for sure

Puynsi2 votes

Nope, buy more RP. [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Wyrmblade2 votes

I think this rework needs to scrap the whole bot lane thing altogether. The poke from his E is negligible and most matchups in sololane can get away from his Q before anything happens.

My suggestions for Morde is •Scrap W passive. •Either remove or weaken the dragon gimmick •Make his w not need an ally to deal damage and get rid of the second cast, have the heal be a drain instead that only does the actual healing once the ability is over. •Give some base tankiness back to compensate.

I like his Q's playstyle after playing a lot of junglekaiser, his main problem is the shitty dragon gimmick and the bot lane thing.

Steelflame3 votes

Honestly, let us HAVE to ult dragon to get the Dragon ghost. Re-balance his power accordingly. Now we don't have whatever ghost we have stolen instantly killed (I would plenty prefer to keep that fed Vayne/Cait/Jinx's ghost, thank you very much), we don't get the ult duration "refreshed" with Dragon, and we don't now have a way to keep our ult up for upwards of 150+ seconds strait if optimally timed on the objectives.

Now, we can afford to put power into his kit that doesn't depend on keeping a ghost up/his team getting dragon. Also would be nice if we could ghost Rift Herald as an alternative (and a reason to go top/mid Kaiser, or force lane swaps) for an early game alternative objective, who instead of being a RADC for taking towers "safely", is a brutal Super Minion with no cares of a tower being in his way while beating down on anyone who sticks around him. This obviously feels bad come 20 minutes when RH is no longer present, and we obviously can't ult Baron for his ghost considering how he does not move and all of his damage is "ability" based for the most part, but it gives us a much needed alterative, and a reason for Mord to actually go to top lane and not lose out on an entire part of his power budget in the early-mid game.

WooBeeWoo2 votes

Thats the only reason pros take him. The pressure on drag is insane. Basically they take morde and if you give up drag you also give up bot or mid tower to dragon ghost siege. That simple lead is enough for pros to capatilize on and so they nerf morde making his solo q worse making his mains sad and leaving him worse off than before.

Decrit2 votes

First of all I' d avoid another rework so soon: it would screw up things even more.

Second: better what we have now than what we had in the past. Yeah, being an anti-assassin was cool, but only because of an istant Q that you had to spam like a savage while in fights or for the E that you had to spam like a piece of shit while in lane. Plus, for how much i liked to play him ( for the lack of movement skills and ccs, which is a thing that was kept ), he gave shit to the team: there was no reason to pick it if not for the ghost, which could work only if the enemy managed somehow to kill the enemy first, and there are already many other champions that require a kill to get the ball rolling on a teamfight and beyond that added something else.

And the W that did absolutely nothing, and was useful only for the ms speed boost most of times, unless the enemy deliberately dueled you with the metal cloud up and then, and only then, meant something.

Was the rework perfect? No, but is more a matter of balancing than else. I' d also argue that if this was not a skill only rework but also a graphical one we would have got rid of his E, and since they appointed this when they announced the rework this makes me thing that they are saving something for later.

Jotunheimr2 votes

Alright, I'm not saying that Mordekiaser is good as he is now, but his current state does have some cool things:

Q. Love Q, but is drastically reduced with MR(unless you have M. Pen.

Heals. Love them heals, brings me many many huehues.

I honestly like Dragon Ghost, but I'm willing to admit that it is pretty dang powerful if I get one. OP. I'd be willing to sacrifice some of the power on DragonForce to put power back into solo Morde and his 3 main abilities.

Downsides: Holy crap the ult has awful range. I can't escape ganks at all!! And early am much too weak to fight them off if they have a good chunk of health; it's even worse when my support dies and it's 3 vs 1. Poor Mordekiaser stands no chance.(Enemy at this point: oh the super gank worked? LET'S KEEP DOING IT! YOU KNOW WHAT FUCK EVERYTHING, ALL BOT!!!!) no hues there D: Abysmall movespeed Solo w is pretty ineffective during ganks when the support dies Shield degenerates hella fast AWFUL BASE DEFENSIVE STATS---I can understand that you get buffed off of an enemy ghost but.. Mordekiaser is just too easy to kill. I've played as AND against him. He needs a base stat buff. Just defensive buff. That's all, I think. One can deal with the lack of mobility for a high damage output; I personally like the trade off.

It's funny that Kassadin was mentioned, oh man, I've heard of his ledgendary nerf streak. I'm so afraid this may happen to Morde, and I hope hope hope this DOES NOT HAPPEN. It would not be fun to have that happen. Kass has blink mobility; MORDEKIASER DOES NOT. Kass has cc; MORDEKIASER DOES NOT. A Kassidin like move on Mordekiaser will be absolutly devastating to the champion in every aspect.

Morde needs huelove, not huehate.

Let's keep Mordekiaser immobile yet powerful, with no innate cc in his kit.

IDEA: what if solo w granted AoE DoT-heals as it damages(or when deactivated based off of damage dealt by DoT) when Mordekiaser is under 25/30/35/45/50% max health(+ X% amount AP)? Keep the reactivate heal tho. That's nice, the reactivate heal on champions IF you are lucky enough to land it.

But yes, a damage over time when below a certain amount of health on solo cast w sounds nice. A sort of pinch situation tool, you know. It will give solo Morde a chance, without always pushing lane super hard early.

With that added to w, and taking off the exp passive in order to put such a thing on w, you balance out Morde's duo lane dominace by eliminating exp passive, whilst granting the ability to have Mordekiaser go into a solo lane, or not just melt when your support dies in a gank and it's suddenly 3 vs 1. What do yall old school Morde mains think?

I'm talking to you Malicious Metal and Mordepool!

Always hue Never die

Jotunheimr2 votes

I don't wanna say always shield never die because the shield degenerates so quickly.. Get more hues from killing before I'm killed. Huehuehue

ABlueQuaker2 votes

tbh now that he's in the public eye Riot could do a complete reversion of anmy changes to him in the last 12ish months and he'd be pretty balanced with a decent playerbase. Especially after the changes to Liandry's and Rylai's from earlier this season and WotA slightly later.

XxxLumberJackxxX2 votes

But dragon ghost= metal mage obv

Fateborn1 votes

I agree that Mordekaiser needs another rework, but at same time I'd rather not go back to old Mordekaiser. I tried my own version of Mordekaiser re-rework some time ago. Didn't really get much of feedbacks or views. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/vIPRgUtK-champion-relaunch-mordekaiser-the-steel-willowisp If anyone's curious.

TotalJerk1 votes

That was a re-rework. They gave him a mini rework around 5.4

Malicious Metal4 votes

Correction! There was a rework on the PBE but due to it being awful it didn't go through. What DID go through was the W automatically shielding Morde when he used it on an ally, the MS boost and a 25 increased Q range.

And reducing his hp/5 from 9 to 3 -.-

Count Zubat1 votes

Tbh, this rework wasn't too spectacular. Besides what went on live 5.4 patch, these were only ratio nerfs and the change of shield mechanic, which was going to scale of Mord's max hp if I read it correctly. Besides W changes, I wouldn't name that rework, but numbers adjustment. But even that would be better than what we got as final product in 5.16 imo.

Ace Access 1 votes

and his tankiness needs help

Jesus Died 4 You1 votes

Can we go ahead and throw Skarner in that boat? No one wants to play as, with, or against Skarner because of his annoying spires.

DirkTarTar1 votes

Please don't compare him to Kassadin.

SpecterVonBaren1 votes

Can we re-rework Skarner too while we're at it?

Tik1151 votes

Since when has Riot ever re-reworked/reverted something pushed to live?

The answer is never

And the answer will always be never

Riot would much rather go full panic mode and swing the nerf hammer around then revert or re-rework something they pushed to live

Silents4291 votes

I kind of think his bullshit passive is holding him back, Yeah the dragons damage is absurd, but hardly the reason I have ever been pissed about Mordekaiser

Poske1 votes

his passive eats his power budget and it is the core of morde it has nothing to do with dragon

Champion Skin1 votes

I haven't really tried Mordekaiser after the nerfs but before the nerfs Mordekaiser was pretty effective on TT You have Mordekaiser and a CC tank like Nautilus or Maokai who pick smite And how we started of was with Mordekaiser starting with W and clearing one camp with smite and then we move up to top lane and push it out with relic shield while potentially zoning off the enemy laner (as most are melee and they can't fight 2v1) And when the enemy top laner is stuck under tower mordekaiser and his "support" can then do whatever they want.. like farming their jungle or taking the enemy jungle or taking the altars

Sageace1 votes

Dragon ghost is the main reason Morde is so strong. It's usually guarantees enough siege power to destroy an enemy turret to push lane. I would hate to see this for the Rift Herald soon as well because that thing hurts.

A good way to tone down some of Morde's power a bit is to force him to ult Dragon or the Herald rather than get it for free. But I dunno what why Riot chose this path, and more importantly, promote him to become more of a duo laner.

Nrsh1 votes

As a Mordekaiser main I want to say that I don't see the dragon as that much of a problem (I do think it desservs a nerf tho) and yet they keep nerfing everything BUT his dragon. The main thing that concerns me is his W. The changed W was meant for duo lane, then got changed so it will fit solo lane, but now it belongs nowhere! It is pretty useless in solo lane and not that good in duo lane! I would really like to see a rework for Mordekaiser that will make him fit to solo lane again (and if possible to duo lane too) and will let him keep his Passive, E and Ult.

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