"Games are too long!" - "Games snowball too easily!"

Mira Arya Enthe·Jan 10, 2017·31 votes·3,642 views

Pick one boards. When there isn't snowball, games are long and very back and forth(Which I prefer, I'd rather have a 50 minute competition than a 20 minute stomp). When there is snowball games are shorter, either way the boards complain. They are the two alternatives. You cannot have games that are both short and fairly even without reinventing League. Because wins require pushing several towers, inhibitors and a nexus, which you cannot do without an advantage or time.

88 Comments

DivewingJan 10, 201717 votes

From what I knew, the only ones who had a problem with long games were Riot.

That SKT vs CJ game 4 of spring 2015 was one of the most intense games I ever had the pleasure of watching, and it went close to an hour of I recall correctly.

But riot didn't like that so they made a bunch of bullshit changes to try force pros to make bold early game plays (needing the shit out of vision), only to have pros play super passively (because they inherently ARE MEANT TO take the least risky option). Things only changed when everyone got sick of lane swaps, then came the 1st blood tower crap.

Ariel the CruelJan 10, 201716 votes

Technically, the complaints in your title aren't mutually exclusive. You can make snowballing "harder," but the effect more drastic to achieve the same game duration. You can also make snowballing pretty easy but draw out the game so the losing team just suffers for 6 hours.

A complaint right now is that the first team to gang-rape bot lane snowballs immediately from that (and the associated dragon + possible jungle camps) and takes over the game. But we still have 20-30 minutes of the other team just failing to catch back up.

Also, the forums are a mob. They'll never be happy because happy people have no reason to speak out.

RavenMagusJan 10, 201713 votes

Pick one boards.

You are aware that the boards are not a hivemind, right?

The entire reason that the boards complain about a wide variety of different subjects - oftentimes in contradiction to each other - is because there are a lot of different people on the boards.

And, you know, different people agree about different things. They are allowed to have different opinions - it's kind of the whole point of being different!

UnpaladinJan 10, 20178 votes

There are complaints about game being too long? Where are they, are you sure you're not making it up? Because saying games are super long in a super-snowball meta is a fuckin stupid thing to say and I can't imagine why someone would want to provoke Riot into making the snowballing worse by going through another "shorter-games" phase.

GesterrJan 10, 20173 votes

I believe he was refering to early last season where games would always be drawn out super late due primarily to longer death timers which created passive playstyles till late game where one lost teamfight that wasnt even an ace meant being undermanned for so long the other team that was losing had the time to push through all 5 towers to kill the Nexus when they might not have even had taken a single tower before that point. It felt really bad.

UnpaladinJan 11, 20171 votes

Those patches were an absolute mess, and they were indeed a product of Riot going through a phase of wanting shorter games. I read a Rioter post earlier saying they think "snowballing now is fine, there's no risk of it getting bad". He's entitled to his opinion, but it reminded me they've added a lot of things lately that serve no purpose other than providing mass-snowballing techniques while giving little countermeasures for the other team.

If they think this is fine and don't address them then sure, but I don't want to see what it's like when they mess up again if they don't learn from that.

paperbIadeJan 10, 20177 votes

Long games because I play scaling champions

GULAG 4 UJan 10, 20177 votes

The boards aren't able to make their minds on anything.

Mira Arya EntheJan 10, 20177 votes

Except Yasuo, Riven, Lee Sin and Vayne. Boards made their minds up on them since release.

Meep ManJan 10, 20177 votes

I've been here for 5 years and can tell you this will NEVER change

Mira Arya EntheJan 10, 20174 votes

Moving on six myself. S2 veteran pride :^)

KoggyStyleJan 10, 20171 votes

vi patch noob shouting out!

Sire HippingtonJan 10, 20176 votes

The really bad thing is that games aren't that short and still snowbally. The average gametime is at 30-35min ( http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/infographics/patch-6-24-infographics ) However, games are decided 10-15min in and require some massive throws by the winning team to be turned around. But thanks to Leagueplayers beeing absurdly bad at closeing out games, at least in low elos and in soloQ, those throws actually happen, and even if they don't throw they still take a long time to finish. Games are hard to close and yet snowball hard(so hard to catch up once behind), which is a frustraiting combination.

I for one would prefer 40min games that are somewhat open for the first 30min rather than playing 15min and then waiting another 15min till either a massive series of throws happens or the game actualy gets closed.

oSEXYPLATYPUSoJan 10, 20175 votes

either way the correct answer is to be better at the game

cuz if you are better you will learn how to close out games when you have a lead and wont let them drag forever and barely win and if you are better at the game you less likely to make the mistakes that allow someone to snowball and game be completely over pre 15 mins

Mira Arya EntheJan 10, 20171 votes

Just tired of the boards cycle of "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are too donger!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!" "Games are too long!" "Games are decided by ten minutes due to snowball!"

oSEXYPLATYPUSoJan 10, 20173 votes

well love you know how the community is and you know what to expect when you come to the boards

its one big circle jerk of tears

everyone bitching about something

but me... but then again im the troll right ?

Mira Arya EntheJan 10, 20171 votes

Did you miss it? : ^)

AnidanJan 10, 20172 votes

Games aren't donger enough, that's the real problem.

rtbf221651412Jan 10, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=MrFawknSunshine ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6gHpdAjj,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2017-01-10T00:51:33.852+0000)

but me... but then again im the troll right ?

Yes.

oSEXYPLATYPUSoJan 10, 20172 votes

how have i trolled...

plz provide proof

SlythionJan 10, 20172 votes

did I miss something...I've seen your name around often but are you like...generally unpopular or something?

oSEXYPLATYPUSoJan 10, 20171 votes

im called a troll on here cuz i dont whine and cry like everyone else and i advocate playing the game for fun and not to take it over seriously and i tend to counter argue whatever point i dont agree with alot of time to provide more conversation over the topic. and i i chose not to play rank so when people cry over rank and take it as life or death i argue its not that serious. and so on

SlythionJan 10, 20171 votes

ah, alright. I can understand then that you tent to be a bit brash or blunt when talking to others? These are the boards, so often times having a different opinion is enough to get them to hate you, but to be blunt about it also doesn't help. You aren't in the wrong though, you're allowed to have your own opinions so long as you are still a decent person <3

Supreme Senpai69Jan 10, 20172 votes

He's also been known to be pretty damn rude, but honestly, language barriers exist, tone is hard to pick up over text, etc.

DynikusJan 10, 20175 votes

this is why riot doesn't, and can't, listen to the boards. You'll also constantly see

Adcs are too strong! Adcs are too weak! life steal is broken and makes adcs too good! They can stand there and solo tanks! Adcs die too easily! Tanks can solo them easily!

no one knows what they want, and no one can agree on anything.

ZT XperimentorJan 10, 20175 votes

Never wanted games to be shorter in the first place; why bother playing at all if it's decided in the first five minutes?

Malicious MetalJan 10, 20174 votes

Long games because an Elder dragon ghost equals a free win.

GULAG 4 UJan 10, 20174 votes

Good times back when elder drake was bugged, fucking love the 32k hp drags man. I fuckin love em'.

inplaneJan 10, 20174 votes

I don't understand why anybody would want shorter games. Long games are enjoyable because it's full of planning and adjusting playstyles to beat the enemy team. It makes you think and be patient about decisions. I love that in a MOBA. It seems like none of them have this kind of gameplay anymore. Even Paragon fell prey to the "LCS Competitve MOBA" Syndrome.

Arsenic SulfurJan 10, 20171 votes

It's not like long games are always good either. I'd rather have a short stomp than a 50+ stall fest because they picked Ziggs and a melee carry who's constantly split-pushing.

Covert Ops GnarJan 10, 20174 votes

I've NEVER asked for shorter games.** Ever**. Period. Not a single time.

S2-S4 + start of S5 were good. Then Riot decided to catch autism

Scary DoorJan 10, 20173 votes

There has to be some kind of middle ground that can be reached.

Right now laning phase lasts about 5 minutes.. whoever gets the first gank (perhaps two) bot lane means that it's over and you might as well open mid. Frankly, the moment anyone gets an advantage the odds of a comeback are exceptionally minimal anymore.

Sure, maybe no one wants games that are 60 minutes... but there has to be something better than "well, bot lane lost tower at 6 minutes, gg".

Supreme Senpai69Jan 10, 20173 votes

The boards, as a collective opinion, is the world's most arrogant dumbass you'll find. That being said, who the hell is complaining about games being too long!?

AhristocatsJan 10, 20173 votes

40 min game is what i want

Toru ItaiJan 10, 20172 votes

I want 30 minute minimum, 80 max personaly.

KoggyStyleJan 10, 20171 votes

a 2 hour rift in s3 and a 2 hour aram in s4 those were fucking great XD but now tanks cant slap eachother till theyre team respawns :|

Toru ItaiJan 10, 20173 votes

if you think games are too ling when they're under 60 minutes plz go away :X play Aram or featured game modes. plz let me have good games.

1wolfpackJan 10, 20172 votes

shorter, more even games.

Mecha MaIphiteJan 10, 20172 votes

I mean, it's kind of subjective. I know a lot of people hate snowballing, but I actually enjoy shorter games, because longer games feel a lot more stressful, and it's easier to keep a lead.

It's really just a matter of opinion.

Irelia BotJan 10, 20172 votes

They are to short since msot are fairly well decided by the first turrets destruction.

While I am happy about marksmen having their claim to bot challenged I know there are other ways Riot could do that.

CowseedJan 10, 20172 votes

Ahhh. You do know that the boards isn't a single entity and is made up of many individuals that do not necessarily share the same opinion. Right?

The same people saying that the game is too long are not necessarily the ones that are saying the games are too snowbally. But yes, I prefer longer games when games are decided by smarts instead of 1 mistep.

Titanium70Jan 10, 20172 votes

TBH, I dont remember much threads like 'Games are to long' back in the days... It's always Riot trying to shorten games for LC$ BIGPALY$ ... although nothing is more boring to watch than a 18 minute game...

Riot is inventing so much unneeded snowball mechanics... hidden power on minions is my personal highlight of BS.

I'm actually surprised this vote is that clear - I expect something like 2/3 - 1/3 - but I guess it depends on the current games state. ^^

Jeddy017Jan 10, 20171 votes

This is very subjective. For me, I prefer longer games. I like playing late game champs. I like that my team can turn around the game after a rough start. I like the close games with nail biting team fights. I like to take time to push lanes & create pressure on the map. Short games are ok sometimes. But If I only wanted shorter games, I go play ARAM or Overwatch.

ErockandrollJan 10, 20172 votes

{quoted}

This is very subjective. For me, I prefer longer games. I like playing late game champs. I like that my team can turn around the game after a rough start. I like the close games with nail biting team fights. I like to take time to push lanes & create pressure on the map. Short games are ok sometimes. But If I only wanted shorter games, I go play ARAM or Overwatch.

Personally, I prefer the games to be shorter, but I wouldn't necessarily want to throw the late game hyper carries under the bus.

I think the game just needs to scale faster. Riot had did a pretty good Job of removing a lot of the stall mechanics. (Combined with mechanics that make closing out games a little easier.) But attacking those mechanics alone made it harder for late game champs to reach that late game point. They just need to inch the late game closer to the desired time mark.

LuciferJan 10, 20171 votes

The two aren't mutually exclusive. You can have a game that's a stomp that still lasts around 30 minutes due to champions who do a good job stalling, such as Ziggs. A lot of times these games are very slow and painful.

Toru ItaiJan 10, 20172 votes

30 minutes is too long for you?

AcidTheWarlockJan 10, 20171 votes

I just don't have time to commit to 60+ minute games. I like my League matches at 35-45 minutes, thank you very much. Preferably 44 minutes, 44 seconds.

I like the number 4 ok

MunchCrunchLunchJan 11, 20171 votes

umm how are games too long when the average game is around 25 minutes?. I don't get it. nobody ever said games are too long. maybe in bronze games are 35+ minuteso n average but am in gold and most games end 30 min tops. 25 is average

SpoofghoulJan 11, 20171 votes

id rather this game be more strategic then a snowbally hyper mobility derpy oneshotting clown fiesta

MeserionJan 25, 20171 votes

Long games have always been the best time spent, epic battles with teamfights and full build in full contention of each other, so fun. I'd rather spend 40-50 minutes in a epic brawl to the death than waste 20 minutes waiting for surrender to becoming avaliable because our bot ADC went 1/6/0 in the first 5 minutes somehow. and then, OF COURSE, its 3/2 no surrender because people still think they can win even though we have no towers and the kills are 25 enemy/ 10 allied.