Concerning Brand

l Helios l··4 votes·768 views

Ok so I'm most certainly not super qualified to pass judgment on champion balance, primarily because I'm silver and haven't been in gold ever. My goal in stating that is that is to enter into this from a state of humility and openness to listening. However, my concern is around Brand. What I am curious about is why his kit is so combo-dependent. What I mean by that is that Brand's spells all work together very fluidly and combo off of each other, primarily, if not completely, based on his passive. In essence, the way Brand feels to me is: "Land full combo - win. Don't land full combo - lose."

Now, I'm not trying to give off the impression that Brand is a bad champion or poorly designed champion; I have no right to charge the Rito team with that. Brand is not a bad champion, he is just overshadowed by other champions who are strictly better or stronger or more useful. My big concern is just that this mentality makes Brand feel highly one-dimensional. Compare that same mindset to someone like Syndra. Syndra is also combo based to a degree, but to me it doesn't feel as flat, for lack of a better word. Sure Syndra can Q, throw the Q with the W, E the Q to stun, Q again then R, and all of this requires hitting all of the skills to get a good result, but she still has more options for complex play, such as her positioning around the Q or repositioning it with W while waiting for the Q cd to turn off in order to maximize ult damage or position for her stun.

Brand doesn't have that type of depth; the only repositioning he/she (the player) can do is to move Brand himself to try and find a better position for a W Q or E Q combo (I word it that way just because the Q stun is quite strong and worth trying to get off). Now, I know some people will say that Brand and Syndra are two completely different champions with completely different kits, lore, purposes, etc. or that Brand has been played in the LCS. Both of these statements are true. However, differences in kits don't excuse a lack of depth, so that point is negated. Yes, he has been played in the LCS, but as a support, which I don't believe was his intended role. I don't seek to negate player creativity and the adaptability of a champion, but Brand is almost fully used as an off-ap carry as a support rather than for his utility. Now to the dimensional aspect, I don't forsee a reason to combo the Q into something. By that I mean Brand's stun is far more useful that the increased E spread or the extra damage on the W or the R bounce prioritization. So in essence, the combo usually goes either E Q... or W Q... and that's as complex as it gets.

Now, I'm not going to point out a problem then not give some option for change. What I propose is to change the passive procs for the W and E and possibly the R, or change some of the normal effects of the Q and E, or maybe both changed could be used. So for the E, it could be that the passive proc of the E, the spreading to units be kept as the normal effect, which would maintain some waveclear, and the new passive proc would be each passive on the units the E spreads to would detonate, sort of in the form of a smaller Karthus Q so that it wouldnt be too overbearing on the graphics and clutter but could still add some (10% bonus based on E's base damage) damage to help with waveclear. This would make his E more favorable to proc in some situations, such as in a teamfight or in clearing large waves.

His W's proc could be changed to adding more bonus percent damage (50%, up from 25%), but the base damage could be lowered. Overall damage on a passive proc + the W could increase some, not enough to be overbearing or oppressive. This would make proc-ing the W passive more favorable for following the in teamfights and in clearing large waves. This would even be good in general lane trades and add a more complicated aspect to Brand's combos.

The Q could have the natural effect of adding a small slow (10%-20% maximum for no more than 1 second max) to make comboing the W into it more favorable and easy to land. The stun proc for the passive could stay, as the utility on a 2 second stun is quite good. The skill shot would remain a single target and most likely the same width and speed so that the same level of challenge would apply as it does now. Now, the reason I say the slow should be no more than 20% is because if the slow is too much, then it makes the W too difficult to dodge for immobile champions, whereas a Zed can just W away. Same issue with the length of the slow, if it is too long, Brand's W cast time will trigger and immobile champions would have no way of escaping. The slow or duration could be longer to punish players for not staying behind minions or other champions or rewarding the Brand player for a god-like Q, but the reward/punishment seems good enough as it is; the W is harder to dodge or easier to land, based on who you are playing.

The R is tricky. One possibility I would propose is to have the R proc the passive in a stacking manner, similar to Darius's passive (i.e. the damage increases but the duration doesn't), but only if the ult was used AFTER the passive was applied. The ult would not stack the passive if Brand's passive was not applied before the ult hit the target for the first time. In addition, this stack would only apply during the ult bounces and wouldn't count the passive procs from the Q, W, or E. Now, this means A LOT of damage for being hit multiple times (from 5 bounces, maximum amount of times to be hit is 3, which equals 24% of one's max health in magic damage). This may sound crazy, but consider this: Brand's ult minus the passive will not prioritize anything as it bounces, i.e., it works based on proximity. As long as you avoid where it is, it most likely won't hit you. With the passive proc though, it will prioritize champions on its bounces, which makes the passive stacks more impactful, i.e., it rewards the Brand more and punishes the player more. Now, this also makes Brand's R more impactful in small skirmishes (2 - 3 champions per team) since it is more likely one will be hit multiple times, especially if monsters/minions are not nearby. This effect is somewhat negated in full 5v5 fights because there is much smaller chance that one will be hit more than once, especially if monsters/minions are present. This gives Brand more skirmishing power but would keep him full 5v5 power roughly equal and would reward him for applying his passive before ulting. In addition, it motivates players to try and diffuse Brand's ult to prevent the bouncing, since its damage potential is higher.

Now, part of the reason why I propose these concepts is that it offers more variability to Brand's combos and gives him more rewards for succeeding in each ability following the other. All of these changes together may be too much, but I think they add a lot of depth to his combos while keeping his damage a little higher than live, but his damage potential for playing well very high. Let me know what you guys think! I'd love to hear opinions on these ideas. I spent most of today thinking of ideas when I should have been working or paying attention in school :D Thanks for reading, and good luck on the rift guys! #BeVictorious

6 Comments

SouL1ess3 votes

...You honestly need to organize your thoughts into paragraphs. No one likes to read one entire paragraph of many focuses/arguments, not even your teachers.

On point, Brand has a few problems in that his kit is combo-oriented but his passive is counter-intuitive to chaining spells in quick succession, that his Conflagration is a very weak spell used purely to reduce the mana efficiency of Brand's combo, and that he has no way to reliably Blaze multiple teamfights to buff his AoE presence in teamfights.

Brand is very much a high-single-target-damage mage. He is very strong against one target because he can apply Blaze to whittle it down and also combo his skills together for burst damage, but he doesn't do as well in teamfights due to CD and AoE constraints, where he is relatively weak in.

I do have a few ideas to buff Brand to counteract his issues, but as of now he is playable and pretty good at what he does despite that he is not versatile.

l Helios l1 votes

Thanks for the critique man! I was doing most of that on my phone and as I was running around from place to place so forgive me pls xD

I see what your perspective on the passive issue being a problem with a combo style champion. Proc-ing a D.O.T. ability in quick succession doesn't really make a whole lot of sense in the context of a combo-oriented champion. I feel as though his passive could be introduced to have a stacking effect (with a nerfed pecent health ratio or a complete damage rework of course), similar to that of Darius (discussed in the ult section of the post above), but this has the potential to become a little too similar and wouldn't be unique except for possibly being an ap version of Darius's bleed. Of course it could also be made that the passive proc could finish completely when another ability hit the champion. By that I mean, if the passive still had 2 seconds to tick, the 2 second tick would be completely dealt to the enemy champion immediately when the next ability triggered, and then the passive would refresh back to the standard 5 seconds. This would probably add to the combo nature of the champion, while maintaining some of the core identity of the champion.

To your point about the E. This is a fair assessment of the ability, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that it is "...used primarily to reduce the mana efficiency of Brand's combo..." just because that concept sounds very strange. The purpose of an ability shouldn't be to hurt the Brand player for using an ability that they are meant to combo with others. That is primarily why I proposed an introduction of the new effects on the E, both to increase its damage and utility while also giving Brand a reasonable way to apply the passive during hefty fights. With the E's proc effect being the normal effect, it would spread much more easily and let Brand apply the passive in a teamfight more reliably. To be fair to his W, it is not a massively hard skill to land in a full 5v5; you just need to know where to place it and who on. A lot of it is predicting movements of foes.

Definitely post your ideas on here man! I'd love to hear them so I could get a sense of what other people think about the champion and how you think he could be tweaked to be more than he currently is. I agree that Brand isn't trash or weak, but I'm simply asserting that his gameplay isn't the most involving or calculated, and that's how I interpret the game should be. Thanks for your comment man!

SouL1ess2 votes

A few things I definitely agree with:

  1. Conflagration MUST be an AoE skill. Even if its radius is 250-300 it doesn't matter, this change will give Brand the option to actually apply Blaze to multiple targets without being dependent entirely on his ult. There are a few ways to do it. For example, Conflagration can be a ground-targeted AoE that have a really fast cast time (and therefore generally unavoidable), but also have its base damage lowered to 70/95/120/145/180 and ratio lowered to 0.5*AP to compensate for it being reliable AoE. The Blaze effect could be that the ground-targeted zone explodes again if any target hit is Blazed, and deals reduced damage to targets already hit (this mechanism exists on many different spells so it shouldn't be hard to code). The idea to have the current Blaze effect as the base effect also works to make it an AoE skill (and reduce the damage to the above as necessary), and I would have the Blazed targets hit by Conflagration to explode a second time after a one second delay, dealing reduced damage (25% of skill's original damage). But the basis is that Conflagration is how Brand applies Blaze as a combo starter, and I would argue that he needs some AoE presence on his Blaze initiation because his W damage is reliant on Blaze.

  2. Passive needs to slight benefit the combo-orient system. What I would do is change the passive to: "Brand's spells deals 1% Max health damage on-hit and an additional 6% damage over 4 seconds." This will award Brand for hitting with the spells, will not penalize him for comboing his skills together, and is a slight nerf to compensate for having his Conflagration reliably apply to multiple targets. I think this is a really easy change to make Brand's combos feel much more intuitive.

Meanwhile, I do not think Q needs a slow at all. If you want the slow, you can get the strong slow from Rylai's. I do think that Q-W is not a very hard combo to land, and I usually use it for quick poke where a stun is not necessary.

For his ult, I don't think having the Blaze stack up is a good idea, since the percentage damage can get high pretty quickly. I think that Brand's ult should automatically seek the next champion in range if it hits a champion on the last bounce, but the speed of the projectile gets slower with each bounce. It will retain the current Blazed effect. I think increasing the reliability of bounces while decreasing the speed of the projectile with each bounce will open up countermeasures for the enemy team, so that while they know that the bounces will head for them, they can also position to decrease the impact of the spell. Well, it's either that, or make the ult completely random in regards to minions or champions, but buff its bounce # massively, either through an effect related to Blaze or just increasing the bounce #, while limiting the number of times a champion can be hit. Kinda complicated to change the skill tbh, and it may not be necessary: the current Pyroclasm isn't that bad. What needs immediate help is the E and the passive.

I recognize that these changes combine together to be pretty hefty buffs, but that's how I see I can make Brand a better champion.

Ash Lockheart2 votes

The main thing with Brand is his cooldown on his spells. They are very high even with CD. His kit is very simple in my view how ever once you do your combos that's it for the most part. you have to run away until they come off cooldown. I would be happy if they lowered some of his cooldowns, but I don't think they will. Now what they can do for him that wouldn't over buff him is make his basic attacks scale with his ap. Why? Well because of how his kit is. if you miss more then one spell trying to get a kill then your kind of screwed. How ever I don't feel his kit needs to be changed. Just tweeked a little bit.

l Helios l1 votes

I get that. I'm not saying rework his kit entirely, just add something to it so his combo-ing style makes the character more cohesive. His cds are a slight issue but reduction of those might well come with some damage nerfs if they decide to make any such changes. Part of the purpose of this is to have people weigh in and see what we come up with. Thanks for being here dude!

fugatotabued911 votes

Ok

More from Gameplay

More by l Helios l