What was wrong with galio rework release numbers?

Hammermancer·Jan 4, 2019·9 votes·9,045 views

Everyone talking about galio right now, but when he was initially reworked he seemed a lot tamer

then they added all this weird burst into his kit so he'd build a luudens and a voidstaff

Why?

32 Comments

boricCentaur1Jan 4, 201914 votes

Some people wanted galio to be a burst mage would not stop crying so riot listen to them and in 7.21 made him into a mage while also killing tank galio in the process since they needed to nerf the base damage to make room for the scaling. This is how I think it happened I could be wrong.

ModWulf HelhammerJan 4, 20194 votes

Bingo

RagnaveilJan 4, 20193 votes

Which now birthed his balancing issues. The mains should rather have asked to be more anti-mage, than try to muscle head mages for top damage spot.

GaliöJan 4, 20197 votes

A lot of Galio mains asked for something similar to his old W and being a tank. It was mostly just random new galio players post rework that wanted him to be a burst mage. They wanted to play the shiny new champion and also be the carry.

InfernapeJan 4, 20195 votes

He was fine-ish when he was initially reworked because tanky Galio worked. But now if you're not building full AP on him you're basically trolling.

I wouldn't mind it if he got MR scaling on his abilities or something. It's what attracted me to old Galio. The fact that you could play him as an actual AP tank.

GaliöJan 4, 20196 votes

Well there really arent MR options for him to scale off of.

Abyssal mask is expensive, game is too short to spend so much early game for an item you need to be constantly melee range for benefits and with minimal power.

Banshees is w.e and a waste of money for the most part.

You cant build spirit visage anymore.

Adaptive helm is ok, but typically only as a 4th item in a meta where games end pre 3 or on 3.

Merc boots are ok.

No options for MR, even if he had more scaling, he needs more incentive.

RagnaveilJan 4, 20195 votes

Which circles back to another issue: A lack of MR items, even good ones.

GaliöJan 4, 20194 votes

Wits end is good, gargoyle stoneplate was/is good on specific champions, spirit visage is good, mercs is ok. That orange sword who's name escapes me right now is pretty decent. Zzrot was good before it was gutted.

Abyssal was ok before the meta forced everyone to take it, then it was gutted, and now its mediocre.

#MRAlwayskindasucked

Armor options were great before everyone and their cousin got true damage and max helath damage and executes ;)

RagnaveilJan 4, 20193 votes

Yep...Then MR was "too" OP, so they buffed Void to basically ignore everyone's MR to hell and back. Thus killing tanks. The true damage part is infurating. Morello pretty much had the game balanced when he reworked several champions to not have true damage in their kits anymore, which left Vayne, Darius, and Twitch (at the time I think, this was before the update to Garen and Darius?) the only people with true damage in their kit. Now you have a champ like Cam who converts Tri procs into full on true damage (1000 per q even), Zoe who does bonus true damage with her spells on an E'd target, Conqueror, and so many other things. Its not a balanced stat anymore.

LunaranulJan 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

A lot of Galio mains asked for something similar to his old W and being a tank. It was mostly just random new galio players post rework that wanted him to be a burst mage. They wanted to play the shiny new champion and also be the carry.

Honestly, just having damage reduction on his W is simpler than what his old W was.

The "heal on being damaged" effect was functionally flat damage reduction that was reduced by grievous wounds and double-scaled off Spirit Visage since it granted both MR (for his passive + Bulwark's AP ratio) and the heal boost, and could roll into the negatives to be a net heal for Galio.

It was one of those abilities that was situational, but so oppressively strong in those situations that it was just a headache. Like how the old Veigar would make your life miserable if you were an AP champion who got fed.

The "tag an ally to reinforce them and sustain yourself" part of Bulwark was spiritually remade as Knight's Vow, which is nice since it's an effect that any supportive tank wants and can make use of.

GaliöJan 4, 20194 votes

It's not that much worse, and gave him incentive for spirit visage (MR)

Check out my recent post where I used math as to why his W should have the on damage heal instead of the DR. It makes sense for his I eat magic theme. It makes sense to make him build MR. And currently he doesnt get a free +90 armor and MR.

I have the numbers to prove why it's better, even with net heals.

LunaranulJan 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

It's not that much worse, and gave him incentive for spirit visage (MR)

Check out my recent post where I used math as to why his W should have the on damage heal instead of the DR. It makes sense for his I eat magic theme. It makes sense to make him build MR. And currently he doesnt get a free +90 armor and MR.

I have the numbers to prove why it's better, even with net heals.

His current DR scales off MR, though, so it's not like he's lost an incentive to build it.

If anything, the passive portion of Idol of Durand is what could be changed to fit the "magic eater" concept better.

Passive - Arcane Bulwark: While Idol of Durand is off cooldown or being cast, Galio stores a portion of any Magic Damage he takes as Grey Health. If Galio leaves combat, he will rapidly heal for a portion of the Grey Health, consuming it in the process. If Galio successfully taunts at least one enemy champion with Idol of Durand, he'll instead instantly heal for that same portion of Grey Health.

Grey Health is capped at X (+X% Bonus MR).

GaliöJan 4, 20191 votes

Eh that's ok. Kinda a meh version of Tahm with MR scaling thrown in. That would incentivize some more MR options. Also even though his W (currently to backpedal) has an MR ratio, he still doesnt have much reason to wanna build MR. Especially since its AP ratio is similar (if not better in terms of gold efficiency/availability)

TobykachuJan 5, 20191 votes

Wasn't it because he was being built full tank in competitive and destroying?

TheSingularityJan 5, 20191 votes

You pretty much hit the nail on the head.

Galio, in his current state is the embodiment of what was wrong with him pre rework. He's a conflict of support (his R), mage (Q+Passive) and tank (W+E). Pre rework was the same mage (Q), support (W+E) tank (P+Q+R).

This mash of play styles causes a conflict within his small playerbase of dedicated mains, who play him tank, mage or support. Balancing him is a no win situation, as at most you can please 2/3 of the base (tank or mage individually, and support)

Bob the ToastrJan 4, 20193 votes

People complain whenever their champion can't one-shot people.

IllabetheJan 4, 20192 votes

When Galio was initially reworked, he was literally bugged on his winds, where 100 AP was giving 3% Max HP damage per second. In other words, it was a 1 shot skill, and it was left that way for about 2 weeks. People actually ranked off it. It was then dropped significantly, and he became tankier again.

Recently, Riot gave about half that power back to him, so his Winds are hurting again.

Death by GlamourJan 4, 20195 votes

that was long after the rework no?

GaliöJan 4, 20191 votes

No it was on release. Instead of doing 3% damage over the duration it did 3% per second for 2.5 seconds or however long the tornado lasts.

So if you had like 500 AP, would been 15% max health per second. 40% max health the entire duration or so. Lol

Sire HippingtonJan 4, 20194 votes

Not quite right, it did do 3% per tick, with 3ticks over 1.5sec, but it had no ap-ratio, so it were 9% maxhealth all ranks all game long on the full Q. 305base+9%maxhealth on 6sec base CD still was quite high for that Q...

Anyway, the absurd ratio was added in 7.21, which is quite some time after the rework in 7.06, befor that he only had a ratio on the flat damage part of his Q

GaliöJan 4, 20191 votes

Oh yeah that was later during the super Q damage fiasco. U right lol

IllabetheJan 4, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Death by Glamour,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=60xMYAIL,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-01-04T17:54:13.175+0000)

that was long after the rework no?

The initial rework shift to AP was October Season 7.

The buff that re-added some of the damage was in December this year.

Rocnation98Jan 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

When Galio was initially reworked, he was literally bugged on his winds, where 100 AP was giving 3% Max HP damage per second. In other words, it was a 1 shot skill, and it was left that way for about 2 weeks. People actually ranked off it. It was then dropped significantly, and he became tankier again.

Recently, Riot gave about half that power back to him, so his Winds are hurting again.

This was a change riot made after his inital release. After nerfing him repeatedly for competitive reasons.

IllabetheJan 6, 20191 votes

{quoted}

This was a change riot made after his inital release. After nerfing him repeatedly for competitive reasons.

It was a change they made in an attempt to retcon him away from being a pure tank and taking damage out of the base.

Sire HippingtonJan 4, 20192 votes

2 things were wrong: So much base damage that he would be a damage threat and waveclear bot with full tank gear A big Part of gallios old core identity was beeing a mix of mage and tank, and after the rework, he was a pure tank.

The big issue is that his Kit is that of a pure tank, Old gallio could afford to be a mage cause he had no hard mobillity and only a speedboost and a slow for utillity outside of his high CD ult, but new Gallio is bound to be broken whenever he can work as a mage cause his kit has to much utillity for that, even after removeing the damage reduction on his ult. This is why they utterly failed the rework and effectively removed the old champ from the game, new gallios kit can never be allowed to work in the ways his old did.

D357R0Y3RJan 4, 20191 votes

the second thing that was wrong is that he went toplane and won pretty much all match up

which should not be happening with galio's fantasy

Minimac2000Jan 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

the second thing that was wrong is that he went toplane and won pretty much all match up

which should not be happening with galio's fantasy

Well, he didn't win. He just "won" as in his wave clear was insanely op and almost oppressive bc the enemy could never put pressure on him or leave lane bc of it. But now he just can't be played top at all

LunaranulJan 4, 20192 votes

[deleted]

GaliöJan 4, 20192 votes

Hey, I'm downvoted all the time if it makes u feel better. Lol.

Being a Galio one trick unti being forced to one trick a new galio is rough and I guess people hate me for it (shrug)

KazukesJan 5, 20191 votes

I loved rework galio and had a lot of success playing him as sup almost hit m7 with him. Then they randomly nerfed his base damage and overbuffed his scaling and he became pick/ban from the lcs and I couldn't play him like used to anymore.

Z3SleeperJan 5, 20191 votes

Cuz "old Galio players" demanded he be a tank/AP hybrid burst champion like before. They got what they wanted and now that everyone hates it they're asking for a revert.

Revert "old Galio players" out of existence instead ty.